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The Shadow
Premium
join:2013-04-18
kudos:5
Reviews:
·Champion Broadba..
·Time Warner Cable

UPS has your Personal ID info on file from Credit Bureau.

UPS offers a new customer service that you sign up for to have a lot more control over the delivery of your package plus more than the standard knowledge about delivery status. It is called “My Choice.” There are two levels of service: Regular and Premium. The former is free and the latter is $40 per month. I chose the regular.

Link explaining short and sweet or concisely what the service provides:

»www.ups.com/mychoice/?WT.srch=1&···t|pmt|e|

During the registration process one comes to a part where UPS reasonably wants you to answer some questions to verify your identity so that others cannot control or redirect your unauthorized deliveries. Fine so far! But then they ask you a series of personal questions to which you have to pick from the multiple choice answers offered you like “which of the following streets have you live on in the past” or “which month were you born in” and you choose from list offered, etc.

Here is the shocker. All of the questions they ask are comprised of information straight from the credit bureau AND UPS all ready has it when you contact them online to sign up for their extra service. Repeat, even though you’ve never given them info that is on your credit report in any form in the past they all ready have in their files on you. And to be clear they have current and past information going back decades.

Just to be clear your credit report contains basically two sections. The top part that has your name DOB or YOB, address info, last reported employer, and SSN, etc.

Below that is the section that lists nothing but information directly related to your credit history such as current and past accounts. Just directly related credit info.

The personal non-credit information is legally available to anyone that the credit reporting agency is willing to sell it to that requests it. The actual credit history is theoretically protected and private by law except for certain transactions or verification. But remember that’s just the credit info not the personal information on you.

It’s outrageous that a company has that top half personal information on all of its customers without their knowledge, consent, or letting the customers know that they have it.



jadinolf
I Love You Fred
Premium
join:2005-07-09
Ojai, CA
kudos:8

Just experienced it a few days ago.

If UPS knows it, so do many other companies.

Oh well.
--
Printed on 100% recycled bytes



The Shadow
Premium
join:2013-04-18
kudos:5
Reviews:
·Champion Broadba..
·Time Warner Cable

Yes, but theoretically the other companies that have it should be those that you have entered into or had some type of current or at least prior credit relationship. It's not illegal for them to have it but it would fall under a company's privacy policy, business practice, and PR or image. Then of course their is the elephant in the room: What does UPS do with the info they have and why do they have it anyway? Who if anyone do they share it with?

Plus think how big UPS is and ask yourself who have they not delivered some package for or to in their business. Wow.



drslash
Goya Asma
Premium
join:2002-02-18
Marion, IA
reply to The Shadow

This is nothing new. It may still be wrong for companies to operate like this but it has been going on for quite some time. Most of the data you refer to is in the public domain or available for a small fee.



chamberc
Premium
join:2008-08-05
Irving, TX

1 recommendation

reply to The Shadow

All of this data is legal to have. You agree to UPS accessing it (as well as many other vendors) when you begin to sign up for their service.



The Shadow
Premium
join:2013-04-18
kudos:5
Reviews:
·Champion Broadba..
·Time Warner Cable

2 edits
reply to drslash

said by drslash:

This is nothing new. It may still be wrong for companies to operate like this but it has been going on for quite some time. Most of the data you refer to is in the public domain or available for a small fee.

Most of data I refer to is not in the public domain but I agree it is available, as I stated in the OP, for a fee if one wants to purchase the information piece mill or subscription. The specific information I'm referring to in my case originated on one or more of the three credit reporting agencies. Whether or not the information is obtained by companies like UPS directly electronically from the agencies or a third party is not important as the information I am referring to specifically starts in the food change with the credit reporting agencies.

I hope that you are not making the common mistake of confusing the term or label "public domain" with "public record." If by chance you are don't feel bad, very few people are aware of the difference. They are further confused by credit and information agencies that sell the specific type of information I'm talking about while they claim it is public record. It is not. It is legal for them to sell said information but they can pick and choose who they want to sell it to and what they charge.

Public record are records or information regulated by law or statute that makes the legal right for anyone free of charge to access the information. Some examples is the information stored at the recorders office, assessors office, courts, and so on. The law says the specific records must be made available to whoever wants to see it. The only charge if any is for copies to be made of the information.

What you state as pubic domain is a bit different than someone can get information on you that is only available from the credit bureaus or to those entities they sell it to which then can also re-sell it.

For instance if someone like a landlord or lender legally obtained your credit report they would have the information I'm talking about that UPS was asking about from me but they would only have the most current and in some cases the not too distant past on that report. Say for instance your current address and the one previous to that. What they don't have is all of your address history going back 25 or 30 years. But...the credit bureau has it in their internal records. They are selling that and all but actual credit info to UPS or others who actually sell it to UPS and others too on a requester by requester basis. Requests can be electronically and provided just like ISP provides Internet access and charges you money.

Also this may have changed in the past couple of years but on the credit report when I last involved in the a related business the report did not have on it you DOB, just your YOB. But again the credit agency has the DOB in their files. They are selling or offering that too.


The Shadow
Premium
join:2013-04-18
kudos:5
Reviews:
·Champion Broadba..
·Time Warner Cable

1 edit
reply to chamberc

said by chamberc:

All of this data is legal to have. You agree to UPS accessing it (as well as many other vendors) when you begin to sign up for their service.

You're mistaken. They all ready have access to it before you sign up for the service or enter into any agreement with them I describe in the OP. The info is all ready in their database whether or not you sign up for the service I did. That's the point. What they do with it and why they have it on you absent any relationship is the issue.


DC DSL
There's a reason I'm Command.
Premium
join:2000-07-30
Washington, DC
kudos:2

3 recommendations

reply to The Shadow

No, The Shadow See Profile, they DO NOT have the data in their possession prior to signup. This is a common challenge-response system that the credit bureaus use on their own sites to verify identity. Third parties can purchase realtime interface access to those facilities. While framed in the third party's chrome, all the third party gets is a thumbs-up/down from the data provider as to whether the individual correctly answered the questions.

Instead of pressing the Panic! button and seeding the Internet with yet more inaccurate information/speculation/fear-mongering, why not *ask* others if they know about things you are unfamiliar with?
--
"Dance like the photo isn't being tagged; love like you've never been unfriended; and tweet like nobody is following."



hitachi369
Embrace Your Rights
Premium
join:2001-10-03
Grand Rapids, MI
kudos:4

DC DSL See Profile is correct. I work for a bank and we use the same system, its a 3rd party software. We dont know the right wrong answers, and it only gives us a pass/fail.



anonome

@verizon.net
reply to The Shadow

Credit bureaus don't exist for you or me or any other "consumer". They exist for the financial institutions and the organizations they--and we--do business with. Just to be clear, "we" are the product... always have been. Just because data is "about" us doesn't mean the data "belongs" to us.



The Shadow
Premium
join:2013-04-18
kudos:5
Reviews:
·Champion Broadba..
·Time Warner Cable

1 edit
reply to DC DSL

said by DC DSL:

No, The Shadow See Profile,

1. they DO NOT have the data in their possession prior to signup. This is a common challenge-response system that the credit bureaus use on their own sites to verify identity. Third parties can purchase realtime interface access to those facilities. While framed in the third party's chrome, all the third party gets is a thumbs-up/down from the data provider as to whether the individual correctly answered the questions.

2. Instead of pressing the Panic! button and seeding the Internet with yet more inaccurate information/speculation/fear-mongering, why not *ask* others if they know about things you are unfamiliar with?

1. At face value what you say is logical and technically feasible. Whether it is correct or not is a different question. I do not know definitely whether it is or not. I do know what the UPS people told me when I called and my experience that admittedly has significantly declined in scope overtime--a very long time.

Prior to making my post I called UPS and had an in depth conversation with them. They did not deny what I posted. Not in the slightest. (It was their response and information that prompted my post.) They did make some comments that could by inference be interpreted to support what you state unattributed in the first paragraph of your post.

2. Instead of flaming and trolling with OT and tossing out an unprovoked attack mode attitude as well as being presumptuous on what I know or do not know why don't you stick to facts.

My experience with the credit reporting agencies, third part data collectors as well as my use of them professionally is admittedly dated. However, in 1984 I helped Experian, (then known DBA under the TRW umbrella) and TransUnion set up the early models of what we are talking about today.

Now since you are looking to boost your ego so much why don't you do what I did and call UPS and ask or challenge them. You can argue with them and tell them they are wrong in what they told me hours ago.

While your at it, since in your OT junkyard dog unprovoked criticism perhaps you would like to explain why the UPS representative's story disagrees with your theoritical model and what is the basis and qualifications for your claims or your "speculation." What is or where is your offer of proof?

You could have just run with your first paragraph and added a source and that would have been an A++ post for anyone reading it. Even if posted without a source it would still have been a positive post. But you had motives other than informing and educating in making your post.


The Shadow
Premium
join:2013-04-18
kudos:5
Reviews:
·Champion Broadba..
·Time Warner Cable
reply to hitachi369

said by hitachi369:

DC DSL See Profile is correct. I work for a bank and we use the same system, its a 3rd party software. We dont know the right wrong answers, and it only gives us a pass/fail.

Thanks for your post. The system you describe constructively and informatively in your post makes perfect sense and functionally seems like as described a good system. As I've all ready stated in response to another "poster" the UPS rep did not support your answer. I don't say that as any claim he was being accurate and you are not. I simply state that the whole problem that I had was with the UPS online interface in signup process and the subsequent Q&A it generated with the UPS rep on the phone. It was his answers to my questions and his claims that were the motive for my post.


dib22

join:2002-01-27
Kansas City, MO
reply to The Shadow

said by The Shadow:

The former is free and the latter is $40 per month.

It's 40 per year, not month. I use it so I can re-direct packages when needed.

Also the verification service isn't owned by UPS... Sprint also uses it (at least that is the other company that I got the same questions from recently).


DC DSL
There's a reason I'm Command.
Premium
join:2000-07-30
Washington, DC
kudos:2
reply to The Shadow

I know this first hand because I have built a number of websites in other business sectors that do the exact same thing. This was further substantiated by someone in banking. The critique of your opening message is completely appropriate, as there are countless threads (on here and gazillions of other places) that all have the same, uninformed "the sky is falling because they have our personal info!" tenor. My motives are simply being sick and tired of these Chicken Little threads taking on a life of their own with blatant misinformation. As you admit you don't have current knowledge, then don't dare post absolutes as you did. ASK if others have experienced something and it won't be necessary for those of us who actually know to admonish or rebuke you in public.
--
"Dance like the photo isn't being tagged; love like you've never been unfriended; and tweet like nobody is following."

Expand your moderator at work


chamberc
Premium
join:2008-08-05
Irving, TX
reply to The Shadow

Re: UPS has your Personal ID info on file from Credit Bureau.

That is not correct. It is not in UPS' database. You buy this data from another company, and access it when the process of signing up begins.

I know.... I manage another large fortune 100 website that does the same thing.



The Shadow
Premium
join:2013-04-18
kudos:5
Reviews:
·Champion Broadba..
·Time Warner Cable

1 recommendation

reply to dib22

said by dib22:

said by The Shadow:

The former is free and the latter is $40 per month.

It's 40 per year, not month. I use it so I can re-direct packages when needed.

Thanks for correcting my typo.


02778712

join:2013-07-08
MA
reply to hitachi369

said by hitachi369:

DC DSL See Profile is correct. I work for a bank and we use the same system, its a 3rd party software. We dont know the right wrong answers, and it only gives us a pass/fail.

It's called "Identity verification". All three credit bureaus sell that service. To do a soft or hard pull they need a SS# and DOB.


The Shadow
Premium
join:2013-04-18
kudos:5
Reviews:
·Champion Broadba..
·Time Warner Cable

said by 02778712:

said by hitachi369:

I work for a bank and we use the same system, its a 3rd party software. We dont know the right wrong answers, and it only gives us a pass/fail.

It's called "Identity verification". All three credit bureaus sell that service. To do a soft or hard pull they need a SS# and DOB.

Thanks for the input and post. Simply FYI

The system that UPS used when I contacted them did not require a social security number from me and I do not know where they would have gotten mine. I certainly didn't give it to them when I attempted to sign up for their special service. Also, I never had a business agreement or relationship with them in the past. In the initial challenge questions online there was one question I could not answer to their satisfaction and then to "get by that failure" they asked me for my DOB.


The Shadow
Premium
join:2013-04-18
kudos:5
Reviews:
·Champion Broadba..
·Time Warner Cable

1 edit
reply to chamberc

I now believe that what you say is accurate and spot on. However, what some people missed was before I made the OP I attempted to sign up online with UPS for an extra service they provide.

To complete the online signup process it was clear that the origin of the information used by UPS for challenge questions originated from the credit bureaus...regardless of whether or not there were other parties involved in the flow or communication chain of that information between the credit bureaus and UPS.

After completing the signup process and before making my OP I called and spoke with an UPS rep specifically about what I experienced and how and why they had the information on me contained in the challenge questions.

The UPS rep specifically said that the UPS had the info but it was all public record. (It wasn't all public record.) In our cordial professional interaction I asked him specific and relevant followup questions. Broadly speaking the UPS representative told me UPS had it but it was only public info and they only used it internally.

It was in light of the UPS official response to my inquiry and their claims that in that I made the OP.

It is clear now that the UPS rep was less than accurate in his explanation. If he had been accurate there would have been no basis for me to make the OP.



chamberc
Premium
join:2008-08-05
Irving, TX

said by The Shadow:

\
It is clear now that the UPS rep was less than accurate in his explanation. If he had been accurate there would have been no basis for me to make the OP.

No worries... just also understand, the customer service reps on the phone never have any idea how software works. Never... just how to troubleshoot and follow scripts....