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| HughesNet The Best Option for Southeast Alaska? I'm moving to Southern Southeast Alaska - somewhere around Ketchikan, AK or Craig, AK. I'm a very technical user and am trying to understand my satellite options if I choose a location not served by the local cable company. The tricky thing is that the exciting next-gen services (Exede, Gen4) aren't available in SE Alaska. I'm left with a smattering of last-gen services.
So far, I've found home/small business targeted options from HughesNet and Starband. Have I missed anything? (If you want to check, try zip code: 99921) What about Skycasters? It looks expensive, but their site doesn't say much.
There's on thread that suggests Starband is clearly better than HughesNet. ( »Starband Vs Hughesnet ) Would you agree or disagree? I'd like opinions. Perhaps links to reviews?
What is the practicality of using a larger dish with any of these services? Being fairly far north and having heavy rainfall (some areas 160 inches a year!) I'm expecting somewhat weaker signals with greater risk of rain fade. (Although Ku band services are less vulnerable than Ka band, of course.) Space wouldn't be an object, why not use a 1.8-2.0 meter dish with the service?
I would appreciate thoughts, opinions, links, etc. to help me explore this issue. Thanks everybody! | |
 gwalkPremium
join:2005-07-27
West Mich. | With the 9000 & Gen4 systems you need to be within the "footprint" of a "beam" as compared to say 7000 systems that just need line of sight to a bird. The thing is which bird is allowing new installs on a given day.
You may find some insight as to the Ku, Ka dilemma by reading some of the articles on the Montana Satellite website.
»www.montanasatellite.com/
With that being said, follow up on this posting on MontanaSat:
Is HughesNet fazing out the Ku Band HN7000s systems and service?
8/6/13
It's obvious to us that HughesNet has high hopes for their Gen 4 technology, however we're not sure if they understand how many people are still dependent on their Ku Band HN7000s systems and services! That being said, they appear to be forcing upgrades and making it harder and harder for dealers like us to support our Ku Band customers. Is it all ending soon? We think it will be a couple years before HughesNet actually ends HughesNet Ku Band service, however we feel the HughesNet VAR platform for the Ku Band HN7000s service could be available for several years to come or at least until Ka band technology becomes flexible enough to handle the demands that the Ku Band systems fill, such as portability, mobility, and simple installation and setup!
With that being said...
We were notifed on 8/5/13 that HughesNet is no longer allowing it's residential distributors (RS&I, Perfect 10, and others) to ship "parts" such as modems, transmitters, etc. to their dealers! They are only allowed to ship complete HN7000s systems and only for new customers in Alaska and only with new account activations!
We were also notfied on 8/6/13 that as of Sept. 1, 2013, HughesNet will not allow new activations on the residential platform for HughesNet HN7000s Ku Band service except in Alaska, and EVEN if line-of-site and other issues prevent installation of a Ka system in the Continental U.S.
Fortunatly, Montana Satellite Supply is still able to sell and ship replacement parts, however at much higher prices than we were all use to on the residential platform.
Montana Satellite is also able to sell HN7000s Ku Band Equipment and set up HN7000s accounts and monthly service plans through the HughesNet VAR platform, which is more expensive than the residential plans, however the VAR plans are business level plans with typically offer, better, more stable service than the residential platform plans offered!
Click here for more information on the HughesNet HN7000s Ku Band Service plans that we offer!
Click here for more information on the HughesNet HN7000s Ku Band Equipment we offer!
Click here for HughesNet HN7000s Ku Band Parts and Accessories in our secure online store!
Hopefully you can glean some info. | |
| reply to gponderer
said by gponderer:Being fairly far north and having heavy rainfall (some areas 160 inches a year!) I'm expecting somewhat weaker signals with greater risk of rain fade. (Although Ku band services are less vulnerable than Ka band, of course.)
I can't answer your questions about Starband and larger dishes, but I can tell you my experience with Direcway / HughesNet in a similarly wet location.
The average rainfall over the last decade at my particular location has been 165 inches per year. I started out with a DW4000 system with a non-metallic "really close to 1 meter" dish. The DW4000->DW6000->HN7000S systems (same dish and transmitter all that time) worked surprisingly well in the rain. The systems were much more sensitive to rain than say DishNet TV (it takes heavy rain to disable my DishNet), but the systems usually worked in light to moderate rain. The receive signal strength would drop during rain, but the system was usually functional unless the rain was heavy. Now keep in mind that most of our rain is orographic, and I am unfamiliar with what causes Ketchikan's famous rain. Now any type of actual storm (especially if lightning was involved) would definitely disable the system.
I think the main problem you would have with HughesNet is that if you ever need technical support, you're going to get screened and asked if it is raining. If so, you'll be told to call back when it stops raining. I no longer bother to keep records, but one spring I stopped counting after 60 consecutive days of rain. Assuming that it is similar there, you might need to be dishonest to about the weather. But really, if a system is installed correctly, and you know how to manage your router, PC, etc., there's not a lot of technical support needed other than equipment failure. (But be sure to read the recent "DNS Issues" thread: »[HN7000S] DNS issues I really don't think they're ever going to fix that bug.)
As an aside on Ka band systems: I was concerned about them working at all out here. But both Gen4 and Exede-12 held up pretty well in the rain. (The last wet season was unsually "dry", but still over the 100 inch rainforest threshhold.) | |
 dbirdmanPremium,MVM
join:2003-07-07
usa
kudos:5 | reply to gponderer
Expanding on the prior comments: Ku-Band satellite depends on footprint just as spot-beamed Ka-Band does. The difference is that the spots are really, really, big, but they generally are tuned roughly to the 48-states, so most services do not have anything hitting Alaska.
Hughes is an exception, having service on a satellite called Horizons-1 at 127W. Besides having a footprint that reaches Alaska it is also relatively high in the sky. "Relatively" is an important thing, because no satellite is really high in the sky in Alaska, meaning that even small hills can be an obstruction if they are nearby. Fortunately at Ketchikan you are far enough south that you have better clearance than somebody in Fairbanks or even Anchorage will have.
Satellite reception and transmit strength have a lot to do with dish size. The standard Hughes dish is a .74-meter dish (and I suspect that is what James1979 had, since larger was not available for the 4000 modem. That dish is over a yard across, so people sometimes think of it as being a meter, but dishes are rated on total surface area, and the size is what the diameter would be if it was a round dish instead of oblong. A true 1-meter dish has almost double the surface of a .74. It is common in Alaska to see 1.2-meter dishes, both for internet and TV reception.
I traveled to, and around, Alaska in 2011 with a .74-meter dish assigned to 127W. It worked everywhere it wasn't blocked, but I would have been happier with a larger dish. I think you will find that installers for satellite are common in Alaska.
The closest I came to the locations you are talking about was at the head of the Portland Canal (Hyder, AK and Stewart, BC). I did not get either internet or TV there as the mountains rise too rapidly on the south side of the fjord/valley.
One other thing is that you mentioned Skycasters. They are one, and only one, of many, many companies that provide business-level internet service using the iDirect platform. iDirect is not like Hughes; they are a manufacturer of internet technology, and anyone can buy an iDirect platform and lease satellite bandwidth to resell to others. iDirect works far better than Hughes, but it takes more power/bigger dishes to do it, and the companies that provide it charge an arm and a leg. The key for Alaska, assuming you were willing to pay the price, is to find a company with service on 127. I don't know who does that.
On my Alaska trip I also at the time had iDirect service with a 4-watt transmitter on a 1.2-meter dish, but the service was on 93W and was essentially worthless for most of the trip.
--
Author of hnFAP-Alert, PC-OPI and DSSatTool traveling in a 2004 Blue Bird M380 | |
| reply to gponderer
Hi guys, lots of great information here! Let me hit on some of the high points here to further this conversation.
As for Exede and Gen4 - yes, I fully understand the nature of needing to be in a spot beam and the fact that I would not be in a spot beam up there in SE Alaska. I hope this will change, but until a new bird gets up in the air, that area is SOL.
As for rain fade - I probably understand the math and physics better than most of you on this forum. The problem is that I don't know what kind of margins are in the system. I was figuring that if I am going to bother with all the trouble of installing a system, I might as well do a 1.8 meter dish, they are readily available and not very expensive. If I am in a place where I need satellite, space is not an object.
As for Ketchikan area weather - 160 inches of rain per year, 200 days of rain, and it is due to mountains being *right* on the coast and preventing the clouds from passing. Clouds linger all the time. Rain can be heavy at times, but is mostly spread around, a bit similar to Portland and Seattle, just a lot, lot more.
As for HughesNet, I think that explains why I have called both a reseller AND Hughesnet and NEITHER will call me back about getting Hughesnet service up there. I don't know this is a battle I would want to fight.
This suggests that I should probably focus on Starband for SE Alaska. I have noticed quite a few Starband email addresses in use up there. Thanks for the clarification on iDirect.
Are there any other options out there I have missed? | |
dbirdmanPremium,MVM
join:2003-07-07
usa
kudos:5 | reply to gponderer
As you can see, the power of Horizons 1 into Ketchikan is quite good. Without rain, a .74 meter will work. With rain, a .98 meter will probably work, and a 1.2 will be absolutely perfect, no need for a 1.8.
The problem is to get someone to sell it to you.
I think Starband is using 129, which is workable with a 1.2, but not wonderful. See footprint below. With Gilat selling Starband the future is uncertain - they will not survive on marginal Ku service to the hinterlands when the majority of possible customers can get faster Ka.
--
Author of hnFAP-Alert, PC-OPI and DSSatTool traveling in a 2004 Blue Bird M380 | |
| Thanks for the maps. Sorry for the delay in replying, I have been in the process of moving. (Not up to Alaska, not quite yet...)
They are really helpful. I know there are thousands of customers in SE Alaska that rely on satellite. I can't imagine they are going to just shut them off... but man, this is a tougher challenge than I first thought.
I wish somebody would just hurry up and launch a Ka spot beam up there. Do we know anything about the timeline on those plans?
I am kind of looking at moving somewhere temporary late this year / early next year in SE (which would be well-served with broadband) and then looking at perhaps buying land about this time next year. | | |
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| reply to gponderer
I have been doing some poking around - it looks like Echostar 17 has a spot beam hitting the far southern tip of Alaska - shouldn't I be able to sign up for service from Hughesnet with this satellite?
See "Coverage Patterns 2" UO2:
»www.satstar.net/satellites/echo17.html | |
2 edits | said by gponderer:shouldn't I be able to sign up for service from Hughesnet with this satellite?
Interesting find. That site has a "Beam Finder" tool, but it doesn't include Ka-band in the search. This is where I would call a dealer:
»www.hughesnet.com/index.cfm?page=ContactUs
There is a dealer in Fairbanks and a dealer in Anchorage.
If they don't return your call, then I would go to the HughesNet Community. I'm sure the employees there would welcome an eager customer with their time. »community.myhughesnet.com/hughesnet
23 degrees of elevation begs the question - are there mountains SSE of you? »www.satsig.net/maps/satellite-tv···-usa.htm | |
dbirdmanPremium,MVM
join:2003-07-07
usa
kudos:5 | reply to gponderer
This community post: »community.myhughesnet.com/hughes···n_alaska says no, but it is generalized about Alaska, rather than specific to that lower corner.
This Hughenet page: »www.hughesnet.com/index.cfm?page=Alaska lists only 7000 service. Whether an Anchorage dealer will be knowledgeable about Ketchikan is hard to say. For those that don't know the two are 800 miles apart as the eagle flies.
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Author of hnFAP-Alert, PC-OPI and DSSatTool traveling in a 2004 Blue Bird M380 | |
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