Because of a little criticism??? If i'm trolling, answer this.
When the callback system was at it's worst, you blamed the phone software, when your new phone offering had troubles, you blamed the vendor or the hardware. When wait times are you high as they still are, you blame back to school, vendors, DHCP issues. When you were congested and overselling, you blamed the vendor for upgrading your uplinks too slow.
It's always an excuse. You should have prepared who you were getting in bed with, you should have ordered the higher capacity links earlier, you shouldn't have continued selling on nodes that were congested. You cannot just come out and call people names because they show a little criticism. We don't all have to sit back and be a fanboi to be respected by you do we?
Feel like unless you have a customer that LOVES you, you think we're all trolls.
loosedoobs has a point, that even us, non-techie guys were blamed for tying up the phone lines when it started getting busy. There is always an excuse, no matter what. Where is the accountability within?
It's always an excuse. You should have prepared who you were getting in bed with, you should have ordered the higher capacity links earlier, you shouldn't have continued selling on nodes that were congested.
Yes Marc. You should have anticipated a link installation schedule that Rogers won't give you and that changes constantly. You should have predicted exactly how they would lie and delay and obfuscate. And you certainly should have broken into their offices to steal the node upgrade schedule that they refuse to share with you. Your excuses sicken all decent human beings.
That's weird you think that cause I called Robbers yesterday and got the 35/3 cable package with 300 gig at the same price as Tek. No contract. And no need to buy a modem either.
So you got a sweetheart deal to woo you back to Rogers from TekSavvy. No contract? So how long is that price good for? 6 months? Rogers bumps their prices at least once if not twice in a year. I've not had a TekSavvy price increase except when I changed plans.
I hate sweetheart deals ... I've been burned on them with Rogers and Bell in the past where staff says different things as to what's included, when it expires etc. That's why I'm on TekSavvy and Wind.
When I had Rogers, and I had problems, believe me, I beat my head against brick walls getting problems solved, often having to go to management to get them resolved because customer support was just about useless.
gotak ... the way it's going, it's not really a similar price to go with an incumbent. It's significantly more expensive. It would cost me about 50% more for comparable speeds, but far less data usage.
Moreover, this is precisely what the incumbents want us to do ... so they can lock us into contracts or other conditions making it difficult to go back.
There's a lot to think about. This is short term pain for long term gain.
That's weird you think that cause I called Robbers yesterday and got the 35/3 cable package with 300 gig at the same price as Tek. No contract. And no need to buy a modem either.
Rogers screwed me on a cell phone deal when I was thinking of switching. Be very careful taking these incumbants deals. Their phone reps lie worse than thieves.
I really just needed to get some words to 'paper' to appease my own feelings here and to give what I think is an honest opinion of how SOME of us as customers view the situation. I blame the incumbents for this mess and I'm most definitely not switching to the very companies who are purportedly causing these issues (nor am I or was I implying anybody should). I will be sticking with Teksavvy through this.
My issue simply comes down to the lack of info. I read the forums (well started reading them as of last week) and I now know what's going on, but I didn't and I'm a fairly informed human being. Teksavvy needs to explain to their customer that DHCP/RF issues are provided by X and that they have no insight into repair times and that you're working towards measures to try and get more access in the future. Customers need to know that I will be reimbursed and you as a company are just as frustrated as I am and doing everything in your power (which I'm sure you are, but haven't heard anything from my calls). Without reading the forums, I wouldn't have known about the CNOC, etc. That's where my rant comes in. The average customer knows that they're paying money for a service they aren't receiving, not the reasons or realities behind it.
@Mark. I'm sorry you guys are going through this mess and I'm sorry you have to go through posts like mine. I'm sure it's a huge pain in the ass. I understand the situation. I simply feel the message needs to get relayed to us the customer (in my humble opinion) regardless of an legalities (there are always ways around this). I've written the CRTC and competition bureau already.
Hope this gets resolved soon and that the incumbents don't get away with this.
I was a Rogers customer for 5 years before TekSavvy and there was never ever a 4 day outage in those 5 years. I think you are over amplifying in your mind the trouble with Rogers. Yes there are issues but I am sure you noticed there has been rolling outtages with TekSavvy for a while now.
The way I see it is I get back internet back today which enables me to do my work at home so I don't have to stay at the office late. So I can spend the time with my 5 month old that I don't want to miss. While people can rant and rave about Roger's bad practices. I'd rather pay more and not miss the moments important to me. And since I am not actually at this moment paying more. It seems like a no brainer.
If I can convince myself alternative to cable reseller can give me stable service without the hassle of the bad billing practices. Then I'll leave Rogers again. It's no biggie as there's no contract. In the mean time as long as you guys are supporting 3rd party vendors and they keep afloat I don't see why I can't continue to enjoy the same price as you but without the downside of having someone relay my technical issues to Rogers and then crossing fingers they will be fixed.
]Teksavvy needs to explain to their customer that DHCP/RF issues are provided by X and that they have no insight into repair times and that you're working towards measures to try and get more access in the future
I bet that TSI (or any other TPIA) can not legally state publicly that the problems are caused by "X".
They have stated in other posts, that they are working towards getting a better handle on things, Hence the CNOC submission to the CRTC. If you read through that, you will see even in that document, a lot of the issue are referred to as "vendor x" or "vendor y", without using the actual name in public documents.
I was a Rogers customer for 5 years before TekSavvy and there was never ever a 4 day outage in those 5 years.
Yeah that's nice. I was a rogers customer for a bit over 7 years, and got hit with: 24h outage, 72h outage, and a 11 day outage. Including two cases where the tech pulling the cable. Luckily I saw them do that, and was able to get them to call into the head office so they wouldn't.
That's not even touching the massive screwup on routing that lasted 6 months, or the 30min DHCP leases for Woodstock--that lasted 4 months. And in my parents case, where their cable modem died(an old tetryon), and they sent them no less than 4 RCA modems that simply wouldn't connect with the head end, leaving them without internet for 6 weeks.
With Tek, I've had one outage lasting two days. And that was because rogers...again...fudged up routing.
Sure, Tek, wind, new players certainly have changed the playing field and lowered prices. sure it was prolly a sweetheart deal to lure a cust back to rogers.
but seriously? Thats your response? just a flippant, youre welcome?
Why not accuse anyone with an issue of being a troll. oh wait. that was 3 posts up. How is this helpful?
It just reinforces the perception that you think nothing is your fault but that everything good is thanks to you. You have done much for internet service and customer rights and for that I thank you. But some of this other stuff just comes off as petty and confrontational. This is a discussion forum afterall. coming back with "and the trolls are out" or a "youre welcome" as your witty retorts certainly dont encourage any kind of discussion. They dont impart any kind of understanding, in fact, it feels like a slap in the face to someone who just wants to air their grievances.
I get that you are tired of explaining why things are the way they are. but dude, thats part of the game. you cant just give up on it and expect people to deal with your 'tude. If you cant help but give people attitude for having the gall to take issue with shitty service, well, maybe you shouldnt be frequenting the forums?
I was with Rogers for nearly 10 years, and through that were a few prolonged outages not many I'll grant you, but the worst problems were the degraded service issues. And it was brutal ... the times I raised tickets that would be closed NFF when clearly when you get 300kbps on a 1.5 Mbps service, something's wrong.
Being in the computing and communications industry for many many years, I have a good grasp on the technical aspects of what's happening with the incumbents vs the TPIAs, so I see them for what they are ... incompetence or possibly deliberate obstruction on the part of the incumbents.
I've also seen how the legal process wrt to regulatory bodies like the CRTC work and recognize that the process of getting problems resolved is quite painful to watch.
So, maybe I'm more forgiving.
But in the end it's all about personal choice. 20 years ago, we wouldn't be having this discussion. I did a little work from home by dialing in to the office with a glass teletype and an acoustic coupler, but that was a prelude to having to go into the office when on call.
We've created new freedoms to do things like spend time with our kids, although we may not be spending the time we think for although at home, our eyes are glued to the screen(s).
If you're comfortable with the choice you're making to want to go back to incumbents, then so be it ... but the problem is in doing so you are legitimizing the techniques to win back customers from TPIAs and the TPIAs only crime was to be naive in thinking this was all going to work smoothly!
It's always an excuse. You should have prepared who you were getting in bed with, you should have ordered the higher capacity links earlier, you shouldn't have continued selling on nodes that were congested.
Yes Marc. You should have anticipated a link installation schedule that Rogers won't give you and that changes constantly. You should have predicted exactly how they would lie and delay and obfuscate. And you certainly should have broken into their offices to steal the node upgrade schedule that they refuse to share with you. Your excuses sicken all decent human beings.
Wow dude, you read what you wrote before posting it? You think an ISP cannot anticipate rate of growth? Projected numbers based on volume of customers = rapid growth = order early. Wtf does stealing their "node upgrade schedule" have to do with ANYTHING? You just came off as a massive fanboi.
I don't argue that the vendors drag their feet, but ordering a higher capacity uplink is up to Teksavvy to anticipate based on rate of growth/expansion.
Now if Teksavvy was a reseller, i'd be saying the same as you, but they are not!!!... So yes, they can anticipate their growth each and every week that passes. You want investors, you need to provide investors current #'s and expected numbers by dates. Nothing written in stone but you should have a good idea on the growth of your business. This is after all what makes Tek a business last i checked. They are supposed to know these things.
Problem is, they ordered late, continued selling causing more conggestion at the time and this was the time "newbie" customers were literally called out for destroying Tek and tying up the phone lines.
I've read close to one million posts on dsl reports over all the years since inception and can tell you without a doubt Ottawa is ground zero for internet of all types. It used to be Windsor about ten years ago but today it's Ottawa and has been for some time. I live in the north part of Ottawa but have somehow stumbled by on dsl over the past years decades...
Because of a little criticism??? If i'm trolling, answer this.
When the callback system was at it's worst, you blamed the phone software, when your new phone offering had troubles, you blamed the vendor or the hardware. When wait times are you high as they still are, you blame back to school, vendors, DHCP issues. When you were congested and overselling, you blamed the vendor for upgrading your uplinks too slow.
It's always an excuse. You should have prepared who you were getting in bed with, you should have ordered the higher capacity links earlier, you shouldn't have continued selling on nodes that were congested. You cannot just come out and call people names because they show a little criticism. We don't all have to sit back and be a fanboi to be respected by you do we?
Feel like unless you have a customer that LOVES you, you think we're all trolls.
loosedoobs has a point, that even us, non-techie guys were blamed for tying up the phone lines when it started getting busy. There is always an excuse, no matter what. Where is the accountability within?
You are the one calling it blame. I'm calling an ace an ace. I've done my share of accepting faults where they were due. This is not one of those situations.
You talk about phone system. there's only one phone system, it's really not possible to have two phone systems running the call center. so either it works or it doesn't. What can I say when it doesn't work? I say... guys, it's not working. you, call that blaming it seems. net result = the phone system is down. I don't know what else I can possibly call it or plan ahead or anything else... still to this day, the callback feature has some issues. (oops, there I go again blaming! geez)
fact = back to school is the busiest time of the year for us. sorry for doing all that blaming though.
fact = DHCP issues are 100% NOT in our court to fix. we can not fix what is not in our power to fix. it's part of the CRTC submission... hopefully something comes of that.
fact = 2 years ago, it took more then 7 months to get ANY capacity upgrades. this led to congestion. We did stop selling. 7 months to deliver capacity is NOT normal!!
today... we ordered way way more capacity then needed way back in January of this year.
we hired way more than we needed.
we did everything humanly possible to make sure we were well prepared.
somehow. now that there is basically nothing left to hit us with. look what happened now.
you ARE trolling. I'm calling that ace the way I see it as well. -- Marc - CEO/TekSavvy
]I really just needed to get some words to 'paper' to appease my own feelings here and to give what I think is an honest opinion of how SOME of us as customers view the situation. I blame the incumbents for this mess and I'm most definitely not switching to the very companies who are purportedly causing these issues (nor am I or was I implying anybody should). I will be sticking with Teksavvy through this.
My issue simply comes down to the lack of info. I read the forums (well started reading them as of last week) and I now know what's going on, but I didn't and I'm a fairly informed human being. Teksavvy needs to explain to their customer that DHCP/RF issues are provided by X and that they have no insight into repair times and that you're working towards measures to try and get more access in the future. Customers need to know that I will be reimbursed and you as a company are just as frustrated as I am and doing everything in your power (which I'm sure you are, but haven't heard anything from my calls). Without reading the forums, I wouldn't have known about the CNOC, etc. That's where my rant comes in. The average customer knows that they're paying money for a service they aren't receiving, not the reasons or realities behind it.
@Mark. I'm sorry you guys are going through this mess and I'm sorry you have to go through posts like mine. I'm sure it's a huge pain in the ass. I understand the situation. I simply feel the message needs to get relayed to us the customer (in my humble opinion) regardless of an legalities (there are always ways around this). I've written the CRTC and competition bureau already.
Hope this gets resolved soon and that the incumbents don't get away with this.
no worries. we're all frustrated.. -- Marc - CEO/TekSavvy
Sure, Tek, wind, new players certainly have changed the playing field and lowered prices. sure it was prolly a sweetheart deal to lure a cust back to rogers.
but seriously? Thats your response? just a flippant, youre welcome?
Why not accuse anyone with an issue of being a troll. oh wait. that was 3 posts up. How is this helpful?
It just reinforces the perception that you think nothing is your fault but that everything good is thanks to you. You have done much for internet service and customer rights and for that I thank you. But some of this other stuff just comes off as petty and confrontational. This is a discussion forum afterall. coming back with "and the trolls are out" or a "youre welcome" as your witty retorts certainly dont encourage any kind of discussion. They dont impart any kind of understanding, in fact, it feels like a slap in the face to someone who just wants to air their grievances.
I get that you are tired of explaining why things are the way they are. but dude, thats part of the game. you cant just give up on it and expect people to deal with your 'tude. If you cant help but give people attitude for having the gall to take issue with shitty service, well, maybe you shouldnt be frequenting the forums?
I'm guilty of being human it seems.
I'm here day after day trying to help any and all. I'm on my staff day and night to make sure we're doing everything we can to help. Even in this thread I'm offering help.
My priorities are in the right place.
This mess that's currently going on is 100% not our fault. full stop. -- Marc - CEO/TekSavvy
I was with Rogers for nearly 10 years, and through that were a few prolonged outages not many I'll grant you, but the worst problems were the degraded service issues. And it was brutal ... the times I raised tickets that would be closed NFF when clearly when you get 300kbps on a 1.5 Mbps service, something's wrong.
Being in the computing and communications industry for many many years, I have a good grasp on the technical aspects of what's happening with the incumbents vs the TPIAs, so I see them for what they are ... incompetence or possibly deliberate obstruction on the part of the incumbents.
I've also seen how the legal process wrt to regulatory bodies like the CRTC work and recognize that the process of getting problems resolved is quite painful to watch.
So, maybe I'm more forgiving.
But in the end it's all about personal choice. 20 years ago, we wouldn't be having this discussion. I did a little work from home by dialing in to the office with a glass teletype and an acoustic coupler, but that was a prelude to having to go into the office when on call.
We've created new freedoms to do things like spend time with our kids, although we may not be spending the time we think for although at home, our eyes are glued to the screen(s).
If you're comfortable with the choice you're making to want to go back to incumbents, then so be it ... but the problem is in doing so you are legitimizing the techniques to win back customers from TPIAs and the TPIAs only crime was to be naive in thinking this was all going to work smoothly!
To me forgiving and crime are words that has no place in the discussion of whether someone should use a service or not.
At some point in the past the cost vs benefit was in TekSavvy's favour because there was no competition to B and R. Now because of of the CRTC there is some competition. But now the cost vs benefit is not so clearly in the 3rd party's side due to the limitation of the current set up and the pain you have to endure while the incumbents are stepping up on the price side.
If we were all to stick by TekSavvy when service are out for days. How responsive would they be to our problems? If all of us are kamikaze level loyal users would there be any need to improve? Any need to keep price down?
Marc tells me "You are welcomed" but really is he doing me a favour by starting his company or did he start it because he saw a chance to make some money? It almost seems like he is a bit smug to be honest.
If I don't act like a logical consumer TSI and others will be no better than Rogers. By acting like a logical consumer we keep all provider honest.
It is difficult to deal with idiots ... but what we can do, eh?
Keep up the good work!
OK, i was staying out of this thread by a mile, but really? Calling frustrated customers idiots? Going a little far there. I don't see anyone calling Marc an idiot for expressing his frustrating outward as upset customers express it inward (toward TSI).
Each deserve a break and a little more respect than this.
Marc tells me "You are welcomed" but really is he doing me a favour by starting his company or did he start it because he saw a chance to make some money? It almost seems like he is a bit smug to be honest.
If I don't act like a logical consumer TSI and others will be no better than Rogers. By acting like a logical consumer we keep all provider honest.
Nobody is questioning your decisions. If you feel better going with Rogers--or if it is more logical, in your circumstance, or whatever--then do so.
It doesn't change the facts though: competition from Teksavvy has caused Rogers to offer competitive prices to select customers. Don't expect those prices to last if Rogers manages to stamp out the TPIA providers. -- electronicsguru.ca
Marc tells me "You are welcomed" but really is he doing me a favour by starting his company or did he start it because he saw a chance to make some money? It almost seems like he is a bit smug to be honest.
If I don't act like a logical consumer TSI and others will be no better than Rogers. By acting like a logical consumer we keep all provider honest.
Nobody is questioning your decisions. If you feel better going with Rogers--or if it is more logical, in your circumstance, or whatever--then do so.
It doesn't change the facts though: competition from Teksavvy has caused Rogers to offer competitive prices to select customers. Don't expect those prices to last if Rogers manages to stamp out the TPIA providers.
Rogers and Bell are only offering competitive prices because of the 3rd party providers. If they were gone they'd rob you even more.
Things had improved leading into the beginning of last week, but since then, their responses to our tickets continues to be quick but they are making more changes than ever on their network and so now the number of affected has gone back up. We are told that things should get back to normal by mid week however, I don't know what that means exactly.
Marc, I to believe what you are saying, but the vast majority of techs are polite robots who strictly adhere to protocol. Even supervisors are not created equal. From my experience, there were only about 2 or 3 agents that were experienced and had sound reasoning that utlimately helped me resolve the issue, which took almost 2 months to resolve, and I had suspected the modem for a very long time based on the diagnostics performed early on.
In the end, you can't keep blaming the incumbent. Each case must be scrutinized and the problem not generalized, with the finger immediately pointing to the incubment. In my case, if a new modem was sent to me when the diagnostics had indicated that it could well be the problem, then my issues would have been solved at least 1 month earlier. You don't know how many times I asked for a new modem (my initial modem was open box, and although it's re-certified, I really question the robustness of the recertification process as is obviously demonstrated in my case)
Technicians need to be more empowered, but protocols need to be changed in dealing the customers issues. For example, I think I asked for a new modem on 5 separate occassions; each agent refused. Finally, the 6th agent looks at my file and right away tells me he'll send me a "new" (open box) modem, and I didn't even bring up the topic. I phone in again, after receiving the modem, and a different agent questioned why I received another open box modem, and sent me a brand new modem to ensure 100% that the modem is or is not the issue (this particular agent was very good and had sound, logical reasoning)
When I finally had everything working (the new modem did the trick) I phone in again and the last agent I talked to, a supervisor in fact, told me that if he had handled my case from the very beginning, he would have sent me a new modem right away.
So, you see, it all depends on who you get. It really shouldn't be this way. Most people would have given up in my case, and left Teksavvy. In the end, I'm glad I stuck it out, but man, it was extruciatingly painful
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