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batterup
I Can Not Tell A Lie.
Premium Member
join:2003-02-06
Netcong, NJ

2 recommendations

batterup to pjsutton

Premium Member

to pjsutton

Re: [Info Needed] DSLAM build location

said by pjsutton:

As Zenit figured out a few pages ago, my CO is actually a remote CO.

A remote CO is a gloried remote terminal. They were built before what we now call a remote terminal were placed. They do have an exchange number assigned but the switch is in the main CO. Plant technicians do all of the wiring no central office technicians are needed.

I wonder if the remote CO is still feed by copper T-1s?

pjsutton
join:2013-06-25
Kempton, PA

pjsutton

Member

said by batterup:

I wonder if the remote CO is still feed by copper T-1s?

I wish I knew the answer! The only thing I do know is that the main CO is at least 20 miles away.

Zenit_IIfx
The system is the solution
Premium Member
join:2012-05-07
Purcellville, VA
·Comcast XFINITY

3 recommendations

Zenit_IIfx to batterup

Premium Member

to batterup
Its my understanding that some remote CO's are basically a shack or vault with DLC equipment in it, while a lot of them are about the size of a small business or family home. The line gets really blurred with home sized buildings containing a 5ESS-RSM, or whatever the other manufacturers put out. The RSM can handle 16,000 lines which is not quite the total number of station numbers for two exchanges, but close.

The larger remote CO's here do typically serve as a hub of local activity for VZ - our remote CO has trucks and cars there every day of the week leading me to believe that there are offices inside.

Today I have no doubt that all of the activity of these small 1-2 exchange CO's could be handled by RT's or DLC equipment. Nobody wants to pay Alcatel-Lucent tons of money for some fancy mini-ESS in 2014.

As for feed for CO's I would be surprised if it was still a T-carrier. Someone else in the thread a few pages back with a lot of knowledge of C&P Tel operations stated that VZ has a tremendous amount of inter-office fiber and I am inclined to agree. Even the most rural remote CO's around here have fiber running to and from them overhead!

Now remotes...VZ still has tons of T-1 fed remotes, or very long CO fed loops out in the wild. ts surprising McAdam has not gotten the crews out there ripping out those long copper trunks for the money contained in the cable. Bell Canada has been ripping out old unused inter-co trunks and has made a killing on the value at recycle time.

It makes me wonder on why McAdam is not jumping to rip out copper faster. There are a few WC's that are getting the copper decommissioned totally, they could relocate the remotes from those to areas that desperately need some modernization. The CO WC of Upperville here has copper loops longer than 8 miles fed out of the CO...its really horrible.

Then again, LTE profit is much greater than money from recycling copper and reusing old equipment to upgrade service.

tim_k
Buttons, Bows, Beamer, Shadow, Kasey
Premium Member
join:2002-02-02
Stewartstown, PA

1 recommendation

tim_k to pjsutton

Premium Member

to pjsutton
There are some RTs fed with T1's. Adtran 1248 and a very small number of Alcatel 7300's. Some T1's run over HDSL, some are fed by fiber to an Adtran 3000 or similar mux and broken into T1's at the remote site.

pjsutton
join:2013-06-25
Kempton, PA

pjsutton

Member

said by tim_k:

There are some RTs fed with T1's. Adtran 1248 and a very small number of Alcatel 7300's. Some T1's run over HDSL, some are fed by fiber to an Adtran 3000 or similar mux and broken into T1's at the remote site.

Timk, what's your professional opinion? Do you think I'll ever get higher than 3 Mbps?
pjsutton

pjsutton

Member

Went over to my elderly neighbors to change their default SSID and password for them. Their modem also has the odd 3359/861 sync.

wiggie116
Premium Member
join:2013-10-31
Pittsfield, MA
D-Link DSL-2750B
Actiontec GT784WN

1 recommendation

wiggie116

Premium Member

Must be the equipment. Strange because you had the correct sync for 10mbit. I wonder if it's possible to see more of the overhead from the modem. My average speed test is 6.63 wireless, and wired is 6.75. Not that it would make a big difference..... but I have always wondered if you could get closer to the actually sync rate of the modem..

pjsutton
join:2013-06-25
Kempton, PA

pjsutton

Member

My average speed tests on both are around 2.87.

Why is there so much overhead? What is it for? They should provision the line so that, with overhead, you are able to get 3 Mbps on a speed test. I have a friend with Windstream and they get exactly 3.0 Mbps on their speedtests, and that's what their plan is. I don't know what their sync speed is, though.

Wonder if I should even bother calling in again to see if they can bump the speed up.

tschmidt
MVM
join:2000-11-12
Milford, NH
·Consolidated Com..
·Republic Wireless
·Hollis Hosting

1 recommendation

tschmidt

MVM

said by pjsutton:

Why is there so much overhead?

The bulk of the overhead is ATM but also need to factor in PPPoE and TCP/IP

When you add it all up best case performance is 85.6% of sync speed, which is why Verizon sets sync speed higher then marketing speed. Assuming your modem is syncing at 3360kbps your speed test result is right on the money.

/tom

wiggie116
Premium Member
join:2013-10-31
Pittsfield, MA
D-Link DSL-2750B
Actiontec GT784WN

1 recommendation

wiggie116 to pjsutton

Premium Member

to pjsutton
Fairpoint is the same way, speed matches their tier. Every once in awhile I'll get 6.90. My Galaxy S3 shows my speed test at 7.20Mbps and 1.12 for upload...Haha. I agree Verizon should bump up sync to match the advertise speed. It doesn't seem like much but it could help sometimes. Can you stream Netflix in 1080i? When I had 3mbit I could stream Vudu in HDX, but I could not add anything else or it would buffer.

I would ask again for speed increase.

pjsutton
join:2013-06-25
Kempton, PA

pjsutton

Member

Yes, I can stream Netflix but in 720p, haven't seen it go up to 1080i. I've been able to watch Youtube at 1080p, though. Netflix will stay at 720p, even while watching a 480p Youtube video, which really surprised me!

I do have some trouble, though, streaming things from Directv. They have a feature called "Start Over" where certain shows can be played from their beginning if you tune in late. You press Rewind, and it starts to stream from the beginning, and it usually buffers and never gets to a point where it is "ahead" of itself. Video on Demand works fine, though, which seems strange to me. They must do something weird to the stream.

Maybe I will try regular CS and see what happens.

Smith6612
MVM
join:2008-02-01
North Tonawanda, NY
·Charter
Ubee EU2251
Ubiquiti UAP-IW-HD
Ubiquiti UniFi AP-AC-HD

1 recommendation

Smith6612 to pjsutton

MVM

to pjsutton
Back when I still used Frontier DSL, their 3Mbps plan was providioned at 3712kbps sync rate. That would usually offer around 3.1 to 3.2Mbps depending on the day. I did use PPPoA instead of PPPoE with Frontier, so that alone helps with reducing some of the overhead.

wiggie116
Premium Member
join:2013-10-31
Pittsfield, MA
D-Link DSL-2750B
Actiontec GT784WN

1 recommendation

wiggie116 to pjsutton

Premium Member

to pjsutton
I went through PA at first to, you never know with regular CSRs. I also had issues with 3mbit when using on demand, When playing a 1080p I would have to wait 15 minutes before the show would play.

I still ask once in awhile to see if I qualify for 7.1-15Mbps. I don't push at all. In a few years we will need more bandwidth. My line could handle 10mbit but not 15 my SNR has been jumping from 16-19 actually it's been as low as 15 a few times. Which is weird because my attenuation dropped to 24. 3mbit did feel a little slow when I was listening to music and surfing the web and my wife was streaming video. There are plenty of people that whish they had 3. But it's different when you have seen the line sync at 10 with no issues, so I can imagine it must be frustrating.
wiggie116

wiggie116 to Smith6612

Premium Member

to Smith6612
said by Smith6612:

I did use PPPoA instead of PPPoE with Frontier, so that alone helps with reducing some of the overhead.

Does Verizon offer PPoA?

batterup
I Can Not Tell A Lie.
Premium Member
join:2003-02-06
Netcong, NJ

batterup

Premium Member

said by wiggie116:

said by Smith6612:

I did use PPPoA instead of PPPoE with Frontier, so that alone helps with reducing some of the overhead.

Does Verizon offer PPoA?

Verizon was DHCP in ex-GTE areas. Why the OP got PPoE is a mystery to me.

pjsutton
join:2013-06-25
Kempton, PA

pjsutton

Member

said by batterup:

said by wiggie116:

said by Smith6612:

I did use PPPoA instead of PPPoE with Frontier, so that alone helps with reducing some of the overhead.

Does Verizon offer PPoA?

Verizon was DHCP in ex-GTE areas. Why the OP got PPoE is a mystery to me.

me too. When they first tried to set it up it was using DHCP but didn't work so they changed us to PPPoE and gave us a username and password. My neighbors are PPPoE as well...

Maybe our data combines with ex BA traffic somewhere too??

batterup
I Can Not Tell A Lie.
Premium Member
join:2003-02-06
Netcong, NJ

batterup

Premium Member

said by pjsutton:

Maybe our data combines with ex BA traffic somewhere too??

When you do a tracert does it show Verizon or GTE as the first public IP?

pjsutton
join:2013-06-25
Kempton, PA

pjsutton

Member

said by batterup:

When you do a tracert does it show Verizon or GTE as the first public IP?

Microsoft Windows [Version 6.1.7601]
Copyright (c) 2009 Microsoft Corporation.  All rights reserved.
 
C:\Users\xxxxxx>tracert dslreports.com
 
Tracing route to dslreports.com [64.91.255.98]
over a maximum of 30 hops:
 
  1    <1 ms    <1 ms    <1 ms  192.168.1.1
  2    41 ms    39 ms    39 ms  10.7.33.1
  3    38 ms    39 ms    44 ms  ge-2-2-3-0.PHIL-CORE-RTR1.verizon-gni.net [130.8
1.194.136]
  4   151 ms   178 ms   181 ms  so-7-2-0-0.PHIL-BB-RTR1.verizon-gni.net [130.81.
20.136]
  5     *        *        *     Request timed out.
  6     *        *        *     Request timed out.
  7     *        *        *     Request timed out.
  8     *        *        *     Request timed out.
  9    73 ms    90 ms   108 ms  0.ae1.XL3.CHI13.ALTER.NET [140.222.225.179]
 10    60 ms    59 ms    62 ms  TenGigE0-6-0-9.GW5.CHI13.ALTER.NET [152.63.69.14
9]
 11    61 ms    61 ms    60 ms  giglinx-gw.customer.alter.net [152.179.92.62]
 12    68 ms    68 ms    67 ms  lw-dc3-core2-vlan66.rtr.liquidweb.com [209.59.15
7.226]
 13    66 ms    66 ms    66 ms  lw-dc3-dist16-po6.rtr.liquidweb.com [69.167.128.
95]
 14    65 ms    65 ms    65 ms  www.dslreports.com [64.91.255.98]
 
Trace complete.
 
 

batterup
I Can Not Tell A Lie.
Premium Member
join:2003-02-06
Netcong, NJ

batterup

Premium Member

You come out of Philadelphia, original Verizon.

Zenit_IIfx
The system is the solution
Premium Member
join:2012-05-07
Purcellville, VA
·Comcast XFINITY

1 recommendation

Zenit_IIfx

Premium Member

So that means VZ has moved the backhaul for Quaker State to the proper VZ (ex-Bell) side of the house.

Interesting.

I guess its not regulated like phone so they can do whatever they want. Quaker State is a VERY small telephone company, so it makes sense that VZ would consolidate the infrastructure as much as would be legally possible.

batterup
I Can Not Tell A Lie.
Premium Member
join:2003-02-06
Netcong, NJ

batterup

Premium Member

said by Zenit_IIfx:

So that means VZ has moved the backhaul for Quaker State to the proper VZ (ex-Bell) side of the house.

Interesting.

I guess its not regulated like phone so they can do whatever they want. Quaker State is a VERY small telephone company, so it makes sense that VZ would consolidate the infrastructure as much as would be legally possible.

There must not have been any GTE facilities near the OP. When Verizon said it was a major build they weren't kidding. It may only be the 18 new DSL circuits that feed from Verizon. This would explain why the OP is PPoE and not DHCP.

pjsutton
join:2013-06-25
Kempton, PA

pjsutton

Member

said by batterup:

said by Zenit_IIfx:

So that means VZ has moved the backhaul for Quaker State to the proper VZ (ex-Bell) side of the house.

Interesting.

I guess its not regulated like phone so they can do whatever they want. Quaker State is a VERY small telephone company, so it makes sense that VZ would consolidate the infrastructure as much as would be legally possible.

There must not have been any GTE facilities near the OP. When Verizon said it was a major build they weren't kidding. It may only be the 18 new DSL circuits that feed from Verizon. This would explain why the OP is PPoE and not DHCP.

Interesting! Now I am curious if other people from my CO, or from one of the other remote CO's in my area that go to the same host CO, are PPPoE or DHCP.

Zenit_IIfx
The system is the solution
Premium Member
join:2012-05-07
Purcellville, VA
·Comcast XFINITY

2 recommendations

Zenit_IIfx to batterup

Premium Member

to batterup
VZ North has such a small footprint, it probably had no DSL back in the GTE days. It would make sense that when they started deploying DSL out of the 4 or so CO's that make up QS, they chose the BA way.

My question is why did they not dump quaker state onto Frontier. They did that with the actual native-GTE areas of PA. (QS was Contel territory)

I hear when BA and GTE merged there were tons of arguments over who's way was the right way to do things. One of the examples is cleaner for fiber before splicing - BA liked this all-natural orange solution, GTE used harsh chemicals. Well, the BA people won the fight, and then they found out that Ants down south in Texas LOVE the orange cleaner's residue....they try to eat the fiber.

GTE's culture before the BA merger was also pretty screwy - they called the Contel people "ex-Cons" which is pretty bad for encouraging unity. Probably the same arguments over procedures and methods happened then too.

pjsutton
join:2013-06-25
Kempton, PA

pjsutton

Member

Quaker State exchanges and CO's: »www.localcallingguide.co ··· ocn=0201

Many of these are not even contiguous; they have strange isolated areas all over the state. Lots of other situations like mine, where it's a remote CO going to a host.

Does any of this stuff mean anything? Like why I'm limited to 3?? Probably not!
pjsutton

pjsutton to batterup

Member

to batterup
said by batterup:

said by Zenit_IIfx:

So that means VZ has moved the backhaul for Quaker State to the proper VZ (ex-Bell) side of the house.

Interesting.

I guess its not regulated like phone so they can do whatever they want. Quaker State is a VERY small telephone company, so it makes sense that VZ would consolidate the infrastructure as much as would be legally possible.

There must not have been any GTE facilities near the OP. When Verizon said it was a major build they weren't kidding. It may only be the 18 new DSL circuits that feed from Verizon. This would explain why the OP is PPoE and not DHCP.

Wouldn't this be my CO, though? It was GTE.

batterup
I Can Not Tell A Lie.
Premium Member
join:2003-02-06
Netcong, NJ

batterup

Premium Member

said by pjsutton:

Wouldn't this be my CO, though? It was GTE.

The CO, in your case, is out of the picture for broadband, the DSLAM is in the field. IP address are assigned from a central location . In you case from Philadelphia. If you look up your IP address it will most likely show you are in Philadelphia. The 10.7.33.1 IP is an internal address. Where that is I don't know but it won't be in a local CO. It may be in Philadelphia too.

I would not get my hopes up for getting more than 3 meg unless you can get DSLX to service you or CATV to extend the coax. You are lucky Verizon didn't sell you with the rest of North. Selling the Quaker State company most likely didn't add up for the bean counters.

pjsutton
join:2013-06-25
Kempton, PA

pjsutton

Member

My IP address says Emmaus, PA which is where the host of the remote CO is.

What does DSLX do differently that they sometimes offer higher speeds than Verizon?

batterup
I Can Not Tell A Lie.
Premium Member
join:2003-02-06
Netcong, NJ

1 edit

batterup

Premium Member

said by pjsutton:

My IP address says Emmaus, PA which is where the host of the remote CO is.

What does DSLX do differently that they sometimes offer higher speeds than Verizon?

Why your IP says Emmaus is a mystery to me. When your IP changes see if your location changes.

Remember your loop can handle up to 10 meg so it is an administrative decision to only give you 3 meg just like it is an administrative decision by DSLX not to give you anything.

pjsutton
join:2013-06-25
Kempton, PA

pjsutton

Member

said by batterup:

said by pjsutton:

My IP address says Emmaus, PA which is where the host of the remote CO is.

What does DSLX do differently that they sometimes offer higher speeds than Verizon?

Why your IP says Emmaus is a mystery to me. When your IP changes see if your location changes.

Remember your loop can handle up to 10 meg so it is an administrative decision to only give you 3 meg just like it is an administrative decision by DSLX not to give you anything.

I've had a few different IP addresses and they all say Emmaus, and the ISP name is "Verizon Internet Services" and sometimes "Verizon Online LLC."

I seemed to have a bunch of PPPoE problems last night around 12:30 am. I was on Wifi then, and it kept dropping the connection and when I checked the logs PPPoE kept going down. Like every 5 minutes. I finally came down to reset the modem and it's been fine since then. What causes that?
pjsutton

pjsutton

Member

So, I called tech support this afternoon asking if there was a speed upgrade available. I mentioned that I had synced at 10 Mbps but only got 3, and asked to speak to a network tech. He said, of course, that I couldn't speak directly to the network tech, but that he would call one and talk to them, and then call me back. He did call me back when a network tech became available, apparently it was actually the engineer in my CO. He said he would check to see if a 10 Mbps slot was available, and if it was would try to move me to it. He said the CO guy would call back...which of course he didn't tonight, probably because this was about 5:30 that it happened. So...I guess we shall see what happens tomorrow? It sounded sort of promising, but I won't hold my breath.