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18286719

join:2013-02-02
Whistler, BC

lol shaw routing

so i decided i would try to figure out what routes shaw is taking to texas for me, since i continually seem to have peering issues with texas, florida, and other southern states. this is the site im tracing »www.theworldsend.net/php-ping.php , my request is going,through bunaby (12ms), to edmonton (40ms) to chicago (70ms), and through dallas (100ms). wow

Tracing route to phonoscope-204-2-20-030.phonoscope.com [204.2.20.30]
over a maximum of 30 hops:

1 1 ms 1 ms 1 ms RT-AC66U [192.168.1.1]
2 * * * Request timed out.
3 15 ms 16 ms 14 ms 64.59.156.243
4 16 ms 15 ms 15 ms rc2bb-tge0-12-1-0.vc.shawcable.net [66.163.69.21
8]
5 79 ms 12 ms 12 ms rc2wh-tge0-0-1-0.vc.shawcable.net [66.163.69.65]

6 22 ms 24 ms 25 ms 66.163.74.182
7 39 ms 39 ms 40 ms 66.163.75.126
8 71 ms 71 ms 71 ms 66.163.78.213
9 72 ms 72 ms 74 ms xe-0-0-0-16.r05.chcgil09.us.bb.gin.ntt.net [129.
250.197.9]
10 * 72 ms 72 ms ae-6.r21.chcgil09.us.bb.gin.ntt.net [129.250.2.2
6]
11 * * * Request timed out.
12 * * * Request timed out.
13 94 ms 97 ms 97 ms ae-0.r20.dllstx09.us.bb.gin.ntt.net [129.250.2.5
8]
14 101 ms 101 ms 102 ms ae-3.r04.hstntx01.us.bb.gin.ntt.net [129.250.5.2
26]
15 104 ms 100 ms 104 ms bbr1.phonoscope.com [128.241.5.5]
16 114 ms 107 ms 108 ms phonoscope-204-2-20-030.phonoscope.com [204.2.20
.30]

Trace complete.

THE ONLY WEBSITE, SERVER, or ANYTHING I GET PROPER ROUTING TO TEXAS is this voip server

Tracing route to houston.voip.ms [209.62.1.2]
over a maximum of 30 hops:

1 1 ms 1 ms 1 ms RT-AC66U [192.168.1.1]
2 * * * Request timed out.
3 14 ms 14 ms 15 ms 64.59.156.243
4 18 ms 15 ms 15 ms rc2bb-tge0-4-1-0.vc.shawcable.net [66.163.69.49]

5 49 ms 47 ms 47 ms 66.163.78.126
6 35 ms 35 ms 37 ms te1-7.bbr01.eq01.sjc01.networklayer.com [206.223
.116.176]
7 58 ms 35 ms 35 ms ae7.bbr02.eq01.sjc02.networklayer.com [173.192.1
8.165]
8 44 ms 42 ms 50 ms ae0.bbr02.cs01.lax01.networklayer.com [173.192.1
8.151]
9 65 ms 51 ms 51 ms ae7.bbr01.cs01.lax01.networklayer.com [173.192.1
8.166]
10 77 ms 75 ms 76 ms ae19.bbr01.eq01.dal03.networklayer.com [173.192.
18.140]
11 78 ms 79 ms 79 ms ae0.bbr01.sr02.hou02.networklayer.com [173.192.1
8.219]
12 83 ms 83 ms 83 ms po31.dsr02.hstntx2.networklayer.com [173.192.18.
235]
13 80 ms 79 ms 79 ms te4-1.car14.hstntx2.networklayer.com [74.55.252.
222]
14 79 ms 80 ms 79 ms ev1s-209-62-1-2.theplanet.com [209.62.1.2]

Trace complete.

why cant all my traffic to texas go this way? its the same routing for dallas voip server aswell


rotohoto

join:2012-03-31
canada
kudos:1

said by 18286719:

why cant all my traffic to texas go this way?

Short answer:
Because the internet doesn't work that way.

Longer answer:
Because there isn't a common path between the two to take.

The first IP you gave is on NTT.
NTT peers directly with Shaw (presumably somewhere in or near Chicago). All things being equal, that will typically be seen as the best path to take.

The second IP you gave is on "The Planet".
The only upstream peer The Planet has is Softlayer.
Softlayer and Shaw don't peer, so any traffic between them needs to go through an intermediary.

In this specific case you have an example where it's (barely) advantageous for your traffic to go through SJ to Texas, as opposed to through Chicago to Texas.
If you dug around, I bet you could find just as many examples where the opposite is true.

Calling this a "peering issue" when you're seeing less than 30ms difference in round trip times going from the northwest to Texas is.... a bit of a stretch.
I get it, you play games a lot so you're more sensitive than most would be.... but this is just not a problem as far as the internet at large is concerned.


18286719

join:2013-02-02
Whistler, BC

first, thanks for the reply and fairly well explained answer.

but other then that one voip.ms ip, everywhere in texas i hit is 100ms+, the other day i was pinging someone in florida on verizon dsl it was like 195ms. howcome it is so easy for telus to get better routing to both locations, i wish i still had my telus line to run tracerts to the same ips
--
Shaw Broadband 100/5 - Cisco DPC3825 - Asus RT-AC66U


rotohoto

join:2012-03-31
canada
kudos:1
reply to 18286719

Without being an employee of either it's tough to say.

Telus does have a looking glass in Alberta that you can run pings and traceroutes from.
It can also do routing table lookups. Unfortunately as far as I know Shaw doesn't have a publicly available one.

I'd imagine anything you see from Telus in Alberta will be similar in most cases to what you see in BC



spock

join:2012-07-08
Reviews:
·TekSavvy DSL
reply to 18286719

2 erx01.van.teksavvy.com (76.10.191.6) 15.861 ms 17.365 ms 18.265 ms
3 76-10-191-28.dsl.teksavvy.com (76.10.191.28) 19.288 ms 20.707 ms 21.724 ms
4 v504.core1.yvr1.he.net (64.71.138.205) 23.247 ms 24.128 ms 25.141 ms
5 10gigabitethernet12-3.core1.sea1.he.net (184.105.222.1) 30.289 ms 31.631 ms 34.675 ms
6 te1-5.bbr01.wb01.sea01.networklayer.com (206.81.80.140) 36.570 ms 36.250 ms 38.089 ms
7 ae0.bbr01.cs01.den01.networklayer.com (173.192.18.145) 68.403 ms 56.971 ms 58.629 ms
8 ae12.bbr02.eq01.dal03.networklayer.com (173.192.18.138) 81.641 ms 80.195 ms 81.117 ms
9 ae0.bbr02.sr02.hou02.networklayer.com (173.192.18.221) 86.889 ms 75.489 ms 74.982 ms
10 po32.dsr01.hstntx2.networklayer.com (173.192.18.237) 78.930 ms po32.dsr02.hstntx2.networklayer.com (173.192.18.239) 81.194 ms 81.453 ms
11 te4-1.car14.hstntx2.networklayer.com (74.55.252.222) 84.010 ms te3-1.car14.hstntx2.networklayer.com (74.55.252.218) 81.123 ms 82.439 ms
12 ev1s-209-62-1-2.theplanet.com (209.62.1.2) 87.846 ms 88.761 ms 89.276 ms

Teksavvy DSL


adiabatic

join:2009-01-24
Victoria, BC
reply to 18286719

said by 18286719:

so i decided i would try to figure out what routes shaw is taking to texas for me, since i continually seem to have peering issues with texas, florida, and other southern states. this is the site im tracing »www.theworldsend.net/php-ping.php , my request is going,through bunaby (12ms), to edmonton (40ms) to chicago (70ms), and through dallas (100ms).

I'm on a Telus business line right now and the ping results look very similar although via a totally different route. 102 ms to that same server on Level3's backbone. Vancouver-> Seattle-> Dallas-> Houston

parrelium

join:2005-07-31
Abbotsford, BC
kudos:1
Reviews:
·TELUS
reply to 18286719


C:\Users\Ryan>tracert 204.2.20.30

Tracing route to phonoscope-204-2-20-030.phonoscope.com [204.2.20.30]
over a maximum of 30 hops:

1 1 ms 1 ms 1 ms 192.168.1.254
2 6 ms 5 ms 6 ms 10.31.206.1
3 11 ms 10 ms 10 ms 204.225.243.18
4 11 ms 11 ms 11 ms sea-b1-link.telia.net [213.248.91.169]
5 11 ms 12 ms 10 ms level3-ic-304311-sea-b1.c.telia.net [62.115.37.1
18]
6 80 ms 80 ms 80 ms ae-32-52.ebr2.Seattle1.Level3.net [4.69.147.182]

7 79 ms 79 ms 79 ms ae-2-2.ebr2.Denver1.Level3.net [4.69.132.54]
8 73 ms 73 ms 73 ms ae-1-100.ebr1.Denver1.Level3.net [4.69.151.181]

9 80 ms 79 ms 79 ms ae-2-2.ebr2.Dallas1.Level3.net [4.69.132.106]
10 87 ms 79 ms 79 ms ae-92-92.csw4.Dallas1.Level3.net [4.69.151.165]

11 79 ms 79 ms 81 ms ae-91-91.ebr1.Dallas1.Level3.net [4.69.151.162]

12 80 ms 80 ms 79 ms ae-1-13.bar1.Houston1.Level3.net [4.69.137.137]

13 75 ms 72 ms 73 ms ae-0-11.bar2.Houston1.Level3.net [4.69.137.134]

14 80 ms 80 ms 80 ms 4.59.126.18
15 80 ms 80 ms 80 ms phonoscope-204-2-20-030.phonoscope.com [204.2.20
.30]

Trace complete.



18286719

join:2013-02-02
Whistler, BC

yes! this is the path my traffic should be taking!



MJB

join:2012-01-29

i bet it's rerouted to the nsa.... stupid isp's for spying on you.



18286719

join:2013-02-02
Whistler, BC

if shaw peered with level 3 this could be fixed, i wonder how hard that is
--
Shaw Broadband 100/5 - Cisco DPC3825 - Asus RT-AC66U


34764170

join:2007-09-06
Etobicoke, ON

said by 18286719:

if shaw peered with level 3 this could be fixed, i wonder how hard that is

Level3 would never peer with Shaw. Shaw would have to purchase transit from Level3. Shaw is not already a customer of theirs so that is extremely unlikely.

kevinds

join:2003-05-01
Calgary, AB
kudos:2
reply to 18286719

Peering only works if both companies see equal value/traffic



18286719

join:2013-02-02
Whistler, BC

well i actually have a tsi user in my area showing much better pings to the places im having problems, when i ask TSI they say there routing is same as shaw, checkout this thread »Will TSI routing be different then Shaws? ATTN BC CABLE USERS
--
Shaw Broadband 100/5 - Cisco DPC3825 - Asus RT-AC66U


rotohoto

join:2012-03-31
canada
kudos:1

Teksavvy routing will not be the same as Shaw. There was either a communication breakdown when you were asking the question, or the rep may have just been confused.

It looks like Teksavvy handles their western cable stuff under AS20375.
That AS only peers with Hurricane Electric and Peer1.

Hurricane and Shaw are peered with a lot of the same larger providers, so there may be a lot of similarities in that regards.
However a lot of routes are going to be different. Some better, some worse, it will be a crapshoot.



18286719

join:2013-02-02
Whistler, BC

i called shaw today to ask about canceling, and the guy insisted routing was the same and tried to make me feel dumb, he said that the user who posted faster pings was on a better node then me, so i asked i said howcome i get hit vancouver in 8 ms and the other person can hit it in 13 but takes me 125 to dalas and takes then 84, the shaw guy said his node was better, when me pinging vancouver in 8 was outside the node, i honestly just told him he was an idiot and hung up

also i have yet to see anywhere that shaw cable customers in bc can get to any faster then tsi cable customers in bc

THE ONLY PLACE I GET GOOD PEERING WITH SHAW IS WITHIN BC, TO ALBERTA, OR A FEW WESTERN STATES (WASHINGTON, OREGON, CALI, and ID are the only places i get good routing to)
--
Shaw Broadband 100/5 - Cisco DPC3825 - Asus RT-AC66U



rustydusty

join:2009-09-29
Red Deer, AB
reply to 18286719

You are worrying about the most tedious of things. More so than people who 4k/month for fiber circuits...



18286719

join:2013-02-02
Whistler, BC

dont care. it matters to me and i think alot of gamers would switch from shaw to tsi to save money and have better ping times if they knew it was possible!
--
Shaw Broadband 100/5 - Cisco DPC3825 - Asus RT-AC66U



rustydusty

join:2009-09-29
Red Deer, AB
reply to 18286719

Regardless of ISP, they all have bad routes at times, it's called life. By all means, switch.



18286719

join:2013-02-02
Whistler, BC

i think i will but it would probably be a better idea for shaw to pay a few bucks and improve there internet service overall for everyone... telus and tsi have far superiour routing and im yet to see somewhere shaw has better routing, plz show me.
--
Shaw Broadband 100/5 - Cisco DPC3825 - Asus RT-AC66U

Expand your moderator at work

vag16v

join:2001-07-27
hereandthere
reply to 18286719

Re: lol shaw routing

c'mon...gamer traffic isn't going to get treated any different than all the other common traffic on an ISP. Do you honestly think they're going to start massaging routes just to accommodate gamers so their "ping times" get better? Then someone else will cry that their data is taking inefficient paths.
Its a game...its hardly going to take any priority over anything else. The internet for regular users is "best effort", nothing more.

Expand your moderator at work


bucko2012

@telus.com
reply to 18286719

Re: lol shaw routing

Get tsi dsl whenever possible. Way better routing and pings


34764170

join:2007-09-06
Etobicoke, ON

1 edit
reply to 18286719

said by 18286719:

telus and tsi have far superiour routing and im yet to see somewhere shaw has better routing, plz show me.

The situation is more complex than that and there are definitely situations all too often where I see Shaw having better routing to networks versus Telus. Telus has pretty poor routing all too often to networks on the west coast or even the central US due to no transit and almost non existent peering out of Seattle which is pretty ridiculous for a network primarily from the west coast of Canada. For my use over all TSI's mix of connectivity is better, but for other people and their respective networks it might not be. Hurricane in their mix is especially useful with their very open peering policy and having the vast amount of peering that they do.


Shaw250

@shawcable.net
reply to 18286719

From Medicine Hat, AB I get:

64 bytes from 98.139.183.24: icmp_seq=0 ttl=50 time=54.808 ms
64 bytes from 98.139.183.24: icmp_seq=1 ttl=50 time=53.766 ms
64 bytes from 98.139.183.24: icmp_seq=2 ttl=50 time=54.585 ms
64 bytes from 98.139.183.24: icmp_seq=3 ttl=50 time=42.702 ms

That's not that bad for me. . . .



18286719

join:2013-02-02
Whistler, BC

what ip is that? its from newyork lol im not complaining about my routing to newyork
--
Shaw Broadband 100/5 - Cisco DPC3825 - Asus RT-AC66U



theman
Premium
join:2000-08-02
Dallas, TX
reply to 18286719

said by rotohoto:

The second IP you gave is on "The Planet".
The only upstream peer The Planet has is Softlayer.
Softlayer and Shaw don't peer, so any traffic between them needs to go through an intermediary.

I would venture to guess that being that 206.223.116.176 shows up on the path to SoftLayer (and ultimately well... SoftLayer as The Planet is now defunct), that they may potentially peer (whois on that block below):

NetRange:       206.223.116.0 - 206.223.116.255
CIDR:           206.223.116.0/24
OriginAS:
NetName:        EQUINIX-IX-SJO
NetHandle:      NET-206-223-116-0-1
Parent:         NET-206-0-0-0-0
NetType:        Direct Assignment
RegDate:        2000-05-25
Updated:        2012-03-02
Ref:            http://whois.arin.net/rest/net/NET-206-223-116-0-1
 
OrgName:        Equinix, Inc.
OrgId:          EQUINIX
Address:        One Lagoon Drive
Address:        4th Floor
City:           Redwood City
StateProv:      CA
PostalCode:     94065
Country:        US
RegDate:        2002-06-12
Updated:        2013-06-10
Comment:        http://www.equinix.com Abuse reports should be sent
Comment:        to abuse@equinix.com
Ref:            http://whois.arin.net/rest/org/EQUINIX
 

Pay no attention to my signature :)

--
Director of Backbone Engineering -- SoftLayer Technologies, Inc.


18286719

join:2013-02-02
Whistler, BC

so softlayer and shaw dont peer yet i have good routing to texas to there ip's??? i have been doing alot of traceroutes lately, about 9/10 to texas or east/south have poor routing. the only routes that are good ALWAYS GO THROUGH CALIFORNIA. other then that the only good eastcoast routing is stuff that goes directly east like toronto and chicago, still could be better tho
--
Shaw Broadband 100/5 - Cisco DPC3825 - Asus RT-AC66U