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mbernste
Boosted
Premium,MVM
join:2001-06-30
Piscataway, NJ
reply to limegrass69

Re: Optimum Smart Router Offer

Another thing to keep in mind with the OptimumWIFI hot spot on the router is that you will be part of the wi-fi hotspot consortium (aka CableWIFI). I large percentage of New Jersey is ComcastXfinity and as such many Cablevision subscribers have friends and family who have Xfinity. This is true for the Time Warner areas of NYC as well. I see this as a pretty nice benefit.

I still won't use a cable company managed router and will continue to use my own Asus that supports up to six SSIDs.



Darknessfall
Premium
join:2012-08-17
kudos:5
Reviews:
·Comcast
·AT&T U-Verse
reply to limegrass69

I would like to pop in and say that Comcast has been deploying the "xfinitywifi" signals off their Arris TG862/TG852 models.

The Comcast gateways do not broadcast "CableWiFi" though and are not listed on the coverage map.

Do these Optimum routers broadcast "CableWiFi" along with optimumwifi?



Thinkdiff
Premium,MVM
join:2001-08-07
Bronx, NY
kudos:11

They don't. Just optimumwifi



Johnm

@optonline.net
reply to limegrass69

I installed the free router from Cablevision yesterday. It works very well, but I discovered a strong signal from Optimum Wifi in my house after install. When I turned the router off the Optimum Wifi signal disappeared. Not sure I like Cablevision using my bandwidth as a hotspot for optimum wifi.



Thinkdiff
Premium,MVM
join:2001-08-07
Bronx, NY
kudos:11

They're not using your bandwidth (supposedly). The modem is capable of applying multiple separate bandwidth limitations at the same time. Bandwidth used by optimumwifi should not affect your own limit.
--
University of Southern California - Fight On!


JosephB

join:2012-10-19
Manhasset, NY

1. My concern is that from time to time security flaws/exploits are found in the firmware of routers. There is always a possibility of a security flaw being discovered in the future that might let someone accessing the optimumwifi end of the router get unexpected access to the lan side of the router and thus your pc's, nas connected to the router. Why should one have to take the chance. Now, if they gave an option in the firmware to "disable" the optimumwifi ssid broadcast, then I would feel comfortable in using this smart router. But, this is just my opinion.

2. The second concern, as far as I know, the "smart router" is *not* an AC band router, just an "N" band router. At this point, I would like to upgrade to an AC router and get "AC" wireless adapters for my pc's.



Booost

@optonline.net

said by JosephB:

There is always a possibility of a security flaw being discovered in the future that might let someone accessing the optimumwifi end of the router get unexpected access to the lan side of the router and thus your pc's, nas connected to the router.

Bingo! And you can't update the firmware!

said by JosephB:

2. The second concern, as far as I know, the "smart router" is *not* an AC band router, just an "N" band router. At this point, I would like to upgrade to an AC router and get "AC" wireless adapters for my pc's.

N is not a band. Neither is AC. In any case, it sounds like the best option for you is to return the smart router and purchase your own.

JosephB

join:2012-10-19
Manhasset, NY

said by Booost:
Bingo! And you can't update the firmware!

I am sure that in a situation like this that the firmware would be applied automatically/remotely as soon as the firmware upgrade was released.
... The only issue would then be the length of time between a security issue being discovered and firmware update developed by the router manufacturer. You could always in this siutation (if it ever occurred) disconnect the router, but then you would have to rush to obtain another router, in order to have continued wireless internet connectivity.

said by Booost:
N is not a band. Neither is AC. In any case, it sounds like the best option for you is to return the smart router and purchase your own.

Yes, your right, I knew that it, I meant to say a 802.11ac router vs a 802.11n router.
Actually, I did not get one, I was just considering what router to use next, as an upgrade.

1. So the bottom line is that the Firmware should be updated with an option to "Disable" the optimumwifi ssid broadcast, for those that don't want it. INMO
2. Offer an "802.11 AC - Smart Router option" (or at least indicate when it will become available, so one could plan for it, in terms of getting wireless 802.11ac adapters).


Booost

@optonline.net

I'm using a b/g router. Doesn't really matter for Internet speeds, but I'm tired of slow LAN transfers. I was going to get a N/600/750/900 Netgear or ASUS router. Not going with AC.



Elite

join:2002-10-03
Orange, CT
Reviews:
·Optimum Online
reply to limegrass69

I've got some doubts about OOL provisioning a separate service flow for the optimumwifi nonsense. I don't believe my modem ever rebooted after ordering and setting up the smart router, however I may be wrong. I did see "Service Delete rejected - Service flow not found;CM-MAC=xx:xx:xx:xx:xx:xx;CMTS-MAC=xx:xx:xx:xx:xx:xx;CM-QOS=1.1;CM-VER=3.0;" a week or so later though. Not sure what this is. From my understanding, OOL reboots the modem when you change your tier of service. They rebooted my modem on the spot when I upgraded from basic OOL to Ultra 50 a couple months back. I believe this has always been the case (and yes, I know you can change things on the CMTS side, but I don't think OOL is set up this way).

Also, wouldn't you have to provision this second tier of service over a separate interface? I fail to see them provisioning a second 15/4 pipe over the same ethernet interface, unless they were "tagging" the traffic from the two SSIDs. Maybe some kind of trunking or VLAN magic at work here? Still doubting it.

Lastly, wouldn't you notice some kind of degradation of WiFi throughput, as you're broadcasting over a second SSID on the same channel? You're basically just adding more clients to the WLAN.

Please bash me if I'm wrong.


TheWiseGuy
Dog And Butterfly
Premium,MVM
join:2002-07-04
East Stroudsburg, PA
kudos:3
Reviews:
·Optimum Online

Have you managed to connect via the hotspot SSID yet?

A router can support several public WAN IPs, as an example the static routers support up to 27. They would have different MAC addresses on the router and the Modem would associate the service stream with the MAC addresses. Thinkdiff See Profile mentioned the BSSID is different for the OOLwi-fi see the link below on BSSID. The modem already associates a differdnt MAC with a different service flow for VOIP.

»www.juniper.net/techpubs/en_US/j···sid.html

All of this would be done in the config file, so I believe you are correct a reboot is required. If you can not connect the flows may not have been set up. If you can connect check via the Dslreports tool your public IP. See if it is different via the hotspot.

Whether wi-fi speeds would degrade would depend on the max bandwidth of the router.
--
Warning, If you post nonsense and use misinformation and are here to argue based on those methods, you will be put on ignore.



Elite

join:2002-10-03
Orange, CT
Reviews:
·Optimum Online
reply to limegrass69

Spoofed my WiFi mac on my desktop, and was able to connect to optimumwifi and run some speedtests. Getting just under 18Mbit down and just under 4Mbit up. Ran some speedtests from my phone on my SSID while the desktop was speedtesting on optimumwifi. Downstream seems to take a hit in terms of wireless bandwidth available, but I can simultaneously get 26Mbit up and ~4Mbit up testing both devices at the same time. Oddly, when I switched back to my SSID and speedtested both devices for the hell of it, I was supposedly getting around 19Mbit up on my phone and 26Mbit up on my desktop. Didn't see "double" the downstream though. Maybe 30Mbit down on the desktop and 20Mbit down on the phone simultaneously. Probably something weird relating to how the frames are sent to the router from clients.

TLDR: I'm probably wrong. Maybe I'll test over ethernet later.



sporkme
drop the crantini and move it, sister
Premium,MVM
join:2000-07-01
Morristown, NJ

If they are using the same wireless channel for both, it certainly could impact your bandwidth - not necessarily on the cable side, but the wireless side. More clients associated and moving traffic = less speed.



Jackarino
YacCity
Premium
join:2006-12-28
Allendale, NJ
kudos:1

If the channel is set to automatic then they can adjust accordingly



Thinkdiff
Premium,MVM
join:2001-08-07
Bronx, NY
kudos:11

said by Jackarino:

If the channel is set to automatic then they can adjust accordingly

The optimumwifi and your own SSID are both on the same channel (the AP cannot simultaneously send/receive on two different channels at the same time), so no, that setting would have no effect.

And it is likely the cause of the differences in Elite See Profile's testing. Proper test would be one client on ethernet and another one optimumwifi, both at full utilization. As an alternative, one client could be on the 2.4GHz network and another on the 5GHz network. Assuming the WiFi chipset is robust enough, this should still be able to max out both pipes.

Not sure I care enough to test, but I have been trying to capture what's going on with the WAN side of things. Unfortunately, I think I threw out my last hub a year ago.
--
University of Southern California - Fight On!

majortom1029

join:2006-10-19
Lindenhurst, NY
kudos:1
reply to limegrass69

I still don't see how having optimum wifi at every house will be worth it. With most Ap's your lucky enough if it reaches the street.


cabletecht

join:2012-06-08
reply to Elite

said by Elite:

I've got some doubts about OOL provisioning a separate service flow for the optimumwifi nonsense. I don't believe my modem ever rebooted after ordering and setting up the smart router, however I may be wrong. I did see "Service Delete rejected - Service flow not found;CM-MAC=xx:xx:xx:xx:xx:xx;CMTS-MAC=xx:xx:xx:xx:xx:xx;CM-QOS=1.1;CM-VER=3.0;" a week or so later though. Not sure what this is. From my understanding, OOL reboots the modem when you change your tier of service. They rebooted my modem on the spot when I upgraded from basic OOL to Ultra 50 a couple months back. I believe this has always been the case (and yes, I know you can change things on the CMTS side, but I don't think OOL is set up this way).

Also, wouldn't you have to provision this second tier of service over a separate interface? I fail to see them provisioning a second 15/4 pipe over the same ethernet interface, unless they were "tagging" the traffic from the two SSIDs. Maybe some kind of trunking or VLAN magic at work here? Still doubting it.

Lastly, wouldn't you notice some kind of degradation of WiFi throughput, as you're broadcasting over a second SSID on the same channel? You're basically just adding more clients to the WLAN.

Please bash me if I'm wrong.

double checked today, the wifi service flows are there. set at 19.5dn 4.4 up


Fallen_Anjel

join:2011-04-07
Rocky Point, NY
reply to Attitudeda

well that makes no sense. My friend just got one and she most certainly had a router because I got her one for her birthday! lol



happyinfidel

@optonline.net
reply to rjtrucker

I don't know what all the insanity is about. I was clearly told of all the benefits and the link associated with the router explained it as well the hot spot portion isn't taking anymore electric than when is on for my own Wi-Fi. That argunent seems silly. As far as the pool folks are concerned you would do the same thing if it was available duh



mrsubway

@optonline.net

Got my router today and was furious about the optimumwifi thing. I don't want some perv downloading kiddy porn and the cops breaking down my door. Not sure what to do here. I might return the router. They CLAIM it's separate, but still


nas769

join:2005-11-25
Old Bridge, NJ
reply to limegrass69

Just a heads up if some one is in the same situation as me. This is what I emailed Optimum yesterday:
"I just received an email stating that I need to connect my Smart Router or be charged $80 if I don't return it. I have been using my Smart Router ever since I received it. I did notice that when I go to The Basic Settings web page, it says "Router is Off Line". My cable modem is hooked up to a wired router in the basement and then feeds my Smart Router on the first floor. Why do you see my router as being offline?

Optimum's response: "In order for us to see that the device is online, it has to be directly connected to our modem.

I don't understand why they can't see that the Smart Router is activated. I have decided to return the router and avoid the $80 charge. I will replace it with a router of my choosing.


TheWiseGuy
Dog And Butterfly
Premium,MVM
join:2002-07-04
East Stroudsburg, PA
kudos:3
Reviews:
·Optimum Online

said by nas769:

I don't understand why they can't see that the Smart Router is activated. I have decided to return the router and avoid the $80 charge. I will replace it with a router of my choosing.

The wired router prevents them from connecting to the smart router. Since it is a managed router, they need to be able to connect to it and be able to manage it. Choosing your own router makes sense.
--
Warning, If you post nonsense and use misinformation and are here to argue based on those methods, you will be put on ignore.

cablewizzard

join:2009-06-14
Hicksville, NY
kudos:1

said by TheWiseGuy:

said by nas769:

I don't understand why they can't see that the Smart Router is activated. I have decided to return the router and avoid the $80 charge. I will replace it with a router of my choosing.

The wired router prevents them from connecting to the smart router. Since it is a managed router, they need to be able to connect to it and be able to manage it. Choosing your own router makes sense.

As you saw on earlier Netgears with earlier firmware, TR069 was enabled with an optimum.net host to connect to. So yes, for TR069 to work, some inbound connection from the (CV infrastructure) network into the router has to work. See »en.wikipedia.org/wiki/TR-069 , "Connection request" section.

I would be surprised if you could manage the router via the optimum.net page AT ALL as long as it's behind another NAT - I don't think NAT traversal with STUN is functional, or even desirable to them.


RickNY
Premium
join:2000-11-02
Farmingville, NY
Reviews:
·Optimum Online
reply to mrsubway

said by mrsubway :

Got my router today and was furious about the optimumwifi thing. I don't want some perv downloading kiddy porn and the cops breaking down my door. Not sure what to do here. I might return the router. They CLAIM it's separate, but still

Users on the optimumwifi SSID are assigned a completely different WAN IP address than the WAN IP your private machines use.. My LAN & private WiFi clients show 67.82.x.x. when checking my IP, while the optimumwifi clients show some 45.x.x.x IP.

dm145

join:2009-12-12
Clifton, NJ
Reviews:
·Optimum Online
reply to limegrass69

By not disclosing this feature Cablevsion comes off a little shady
It's not clear in any of their ads or website.

This is what is says:
Lets you provide WiFi access to friends and family in your home without having to share your password.



RickNY
Premium
join:2000-11-02
Farmingville, NY
Reviews:
·Optimum Online

1 edit

said by dm145:

By not disclosing this feature Cablevsion comes off a little shady
It's not clear in any of their ads or website.

This is what is says:
Lets you provide WiFi access to friends and family in your home without having to share your password.

Whats shady about it? In addition to your password protected SSID, you can also create a guest SSID that's protected with a password you are willing to give out to friends or family.

The optimumwifi SSID has nothing at all to do with your network connection or your bandwidth.. It gets its own set of service flows that is independent of your level of service (as posted above, 19.5 down, 4.4 up). The only thing it is sharing with you is the 8 channels of downstream and 2 channels of upstream (which I believe the external APs do as well). Its SSID utilizes a different MAC address than those of your private network, clients are assigned a DHCP address the same way a regular Optimum hotspot does (A 25.x.x.x address that is outside of your LAN space), and the WAN gateway is different than it is for your private LAN (Checking now, the WAN IP seen externally is 47.18.108.x, while my private LAN has 67.82.x.x)

What exactly is shady? It is using none of your resources - other than the fact that the SSIDs are sharing the same 2.4/5Ghz channels.

dm145

join:2009-12-12
Clifton, NJ

I thought that was clear in my original post?
I feel not telling customers they will be hosting an optimumwifi hot spot is shady regardless of the technical and security reassurances you mentioned.


root

join:2002-12-11

said by dm145:

I thought that was clear in my original post?
I feel not telling customers they will be hosting an optimumwifi hot spot is shady regardless of the technical and security reassurances you mentioned.

Nothing is free in life. There is a reason Cablevision bought a metric ton of these routers and that reason is easier troubleshooting and adding to the optimum wifi mesh.

dm145

join:2009-12-12
Clifton, NJ

Agreed
That's why it's slim shady



RickNY
Premium
join:2000-11-02
Farmingville, NY
Reviews:
·Optimum Online

2 recommendations

said by dm145:

Agreed
That's why it's slim shady

We can agree to disagree.. Fortunately, as a reader of these forums, you have the information to make an informed decision to not request a smart router. Additionally, if I am to believe another user of the smart router that I know, he was able to have the optimumwifi hotspot turned off - but I can't verify that.