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scanman1
join:2010-11-25

scanman1

Member

[CFL] Contractor munimum standards?

I know that Brighthouse does subcontract installation as well as some initial service calls. In fact, I had a contractor who was very professional install a new drop cable, properly ground it and do a great job in turning up my initial service.

There have been ongoing intermittent service outages in my area daily since NYE.

Yesterday it was out once again, and this time I was the first one to report it as I was online when the signal dropped again.

They scheduled a "Truck Roll" for first thing today. A small red suv pulls up with no visible indication that they are Brighthouse. I go outside and then see that there is a 12 inch yellow slap on magnetic sign on the rear hatchback. The contractor wants to come in without anything in his hands except his cell phone to investigate.

I take him to the closet that contains the modem and router and he cannot determine what is the router and what is the modem. He literally cannot identify the modem from the router. Then when I pick up the modem and show him the coax entering it and inform him that it is a customer owned modem, he immediately points to the blinking light that is showing that it is trying to acquire sync and boldly states that this is the problem. "I see this allot with customer modems, the modem is bad." He wants to replace my modem with a rental modem. He has not idea what the lights indicate on my Cisco DPC3000 modem as he has NEVER seen one in his life. I refuse to allow him to declare that my modem is bad with ZERO troubleshooting and ask him what each light means. He cannot answer any of my questions and is now getting frustrated that I called him out on his bold statement.

I unscrew the RG-6 quad shielded coax from the back of my modem and politely ask him to connect his meter to it and measure the signal levels. He looks at the FACTORY crimped connector and points at the white insulation and says that it looks bad to him. It's perfectly flush with the connector. I ask him politely to take a signal measurement and troubleshoot the problem towards the tap on the pole.

He goes outside and grabs his crimp tool and a handful of connectors.

He walks over to the side of the house and when I walk up to him, he has already cut off the connectors on both sides of my ground block of a drop cable that is very new and is re-terminating them. At this point, I ask him again to measure the signal level at the drop cable before going back inside and cutting more cables.

I push him further to get his test set and he finally admits that he does not have one and that they cost $15,000-$20,000 and they break easily and he can do repair service without one.

If he cannot measure signal levels, then how can he actually test anything? All he's doing is blindly replacing equipment, splitters, and connectors and hoping he stumbles on the solution.

Is it a requirement that a contractor sent on a service call have a test set?

I can just picture this guy going out on the next call to a house with 3 splitters and 6 cable boxes and using the same "Lets just replace things till it works" method.

I'm posting this here as a general thread about contractors and what is required of them.

I was informed that the manager of the Melbourne call center was already in contact with Jaguar Tech. regarding my earlier truck roll. I have a proper BH tech. appointment for today between 2-4 that will have the proper equipment.

This is a very frustrating trouble as the problem is intermittent and started new years eve, when the bullets were flying around the neighborhood. The first three times I went to call it in, there were others that already opened tickets and I never made it to the call center after punching in my phone number, so this is effecting more than my drop/modem.

It started working a while ago and I'm online with good signal levels now:

Downstream Channels

Power Level Signal to Noise Ratio
Channel 0: 12.8 dBmV 36.2 dBmV
Channel 1: 14.0 dBmV 36.4 dBmV
Channel 2: 13.0 dBmV 36.4 dBmV
Channel 3: 13.1 dBmV 36.4 dBmV

Upstream Channels

Power Level
Channel 0: 32.3000 dBmV
Channel 1: 32.3000 dBmV
Channel 2: 32.3000 dBmV
Channel 3: 32.3000 dBmV

I contacted the local office and they said that they would leave the truck roll in place as this is an ongoing intermittent issue like when I had water in the tap a while back.
BHNtechXpert
The One & Only
Premium Member
join:2006-02-16
Saint Petersburg, FL

BHNtechXpert

Premium Member

If you want to open a direct forums thread with the usual stuff I will address it.

opp
@bhn.net

opp to scanman1

Anon

to scanman1
I would hope he actually had compression not crimping tool.

mixdup
join:2003-06-28
Alpharetta, GA

mixdup to scanman1

Member

to scanman1
Subcontractors are the worst thing the cable industry has going on. Satellite companies still use them, but have brought large numbers of their installers in-house. Every cable company I've ever been a customer of has terrible contractors (and they have to be horrible, or else they'd demand more money and it wouldn't make economic sense for the cable companies). Yet, if you get an actual employee of the cableco out, they can usually fix it right away. Eventually someone will crack the customer service code (which isn't complicated, it's just "provide good customer service"), at least I hope they will.
scanman1
join:2010-11-25

1 edit

scanman1 to BHNtechXpert

Member

to BHNtechXpert
BHNtechXpert,

I was hoping you would chime in and describe the minimum allowed tools BHN will allow a contractor to have. Do contractors have to have any minimum training?

I'm not asking you to defend this one rouge contractors actions.

If the ongoing intermittent issue goes beyond today, then I certainly will take you up on that offer.

The same thing happens on the Telco side of things, as I had a company called V*** that would be sent out up to three times to fix simple POTS lines before they would roll a company field tech where I used to work. In the end, it was found to be more economical to just roll the company tech and have it repaired correctly the first time.

The loss of customers from multiple repeat service calls and extended outages was more expensive than the savings of hiring the cheap subcontractor for even the most basic tasks.
BHNtechXpert
The One & Only
Premium Member
join:2006-02-16
Saint Petersburg, FL

BHNtechXpert

Premium Member

said by scanman1:

BHNtechXpert,

I was hoping you would chime in and describe the minimum allowed tools BHN will allow a contractor to have. Do contractors have to have any minimum training?

I'm not asking you to defend this one rouge contractors actions.

If the ongoing intermittent issue goes beyond today, then I certainly will take you up on that offer.

The same thing happens on the Telco side of things, as I had a company called V*** that would be sent out up to three times to fix simple POTS lines before they would roll a company filed tech where I used to work. In the end, it was found to be more economical to just roll the company tech and have it repaired correctly the first time.

The loss of customers from multiple repeat service calls and extended outages was more expensive than the savings of hiring the cheap subcontractor for even the most basic tasks.

I am not going to get into a discussion about their training etc other than to say of course they are trained. If you want me to address this specific experience then you know what to do.

TAZ
join:2014-01-03
Tucson, AZ

1 edit

TAZ

Member

Click for full size
Has it ever been considered that perhaps these contractors are cheaper because they don't have the most basic of tools or even the most basic of knowledge?

It's like an electrician showing up to a job, looking at an electric socket, saying "socket's dead" and walking out the door.
Only difference is, if an electrician does it, you'll tell them to GTFO and call another one. Cable company? Well I guess you can switch to another cable company! :P
scanman1
join:2010-11-25

1 edit

scanman1

Member

I guess I really hit a nerve, as I had not one but THREE Bright-house technicians arrive with three white vans at the same time

It was almost like a police raid but with Brighthouse as they all pulled up at the same time. My neighbors were impressed, especially after I kicked the incompetent contractor off my property earlier today.

I was told that there was a bullet that hit the equipment vault and took out the neighborhood by one of the Sr. tech's that called it in directly on NYE.
I did guess this part correctly. (I assumed it was a cable nick)

They looked at my modems web interface screen on my living room TV that I had waiting for them.

This being the same information that I cut/pasted here and told every call center technician.

They agreed almost immediately among the three of them that my modem was being over-modulated with too strong of a signal. They wanted to get my receive level down to below +5 dBmV.

They never did anything on premises other than add a 9 dB attenuator on the side of the house.

I refreshed the web interface of the modem and this brought my levels down to:

Cable Modem Status: Operational

Downstream Channels

Power Level Signal to Noise Ratio
Channel 0: -3.0 dBmV 37.9 dBmV
Channel 1: -2.7 dBmV 38.3 dBmV
Channel 2: -1.7 dBmV 37.9 dBmV
Channel 3: -1.5 dBmV 38.6 dBmV

Upstream Channels

Power Level
Channel 0: 41.8000 dBmV
Channel 1: 41.8000 dBmV
Channel 2: 41.8000 dBmV
Channel 3: 41.8000 dBmV

If this crack team of experts determined and corrected this issue with the same information as I posted here, I'm curious as to why nobody, (not even the non BHN techs knew that 15 dBmV is such a strong signal as to cause distortion)???

Even BHNTechExpert could have made this determination based on what I posted earlier.

In any case, the modem has been online since they added the 9 dB of attenuation.

If I was an idiot, I would have allowed the first contractor to tell me that my expensive modem was defective and allowed them to replace it with a $5 a month rental modem.

My advise to anyone that has a customer owned modem is to be very cautious of any tech that walks in and blames your modem.

BTW: My neighbor to the right of me also has her internet down and has a tech call for tomorrow morning with likely too high a signal as well. If the head end is then adjusted down, is the attenuator they added to my house then going to make my levels low?

Only time will tell.

mixdup
join:2003-06-28
Alpharetta, GA

1 recommendation

mixdup

Member

It's sad that you have to complain online or call corporate offices to get good service. To answer the original question, the "minimum requirement" to be a cable contractor is to be the lowest bidder on the contract, that's it, and that's why an official rep won't say anything about it.

Guide_Tim
join:2012-02-28
Taft, CA

Guide_Tim to scanman1

Member

to scanman1
I guess we are lucky here in my area they ALWAYS send the BHN cable guys to our homes they roll up with the BHN vans. No 3rd party contractors to deal with.
scanman1
join:2010-11-25

1 edit

scanman1

Member

There is defiantly a two tier system here. I will NEVER allow a contractor into my home again. Unless the cable is physically cut, or you are too feeble to remove/replace the cable box/modem yourself, this is all that they know how to do.

If I call for service, it is 100% of the time an outside plant issue. My new rule is that they require a test set to enter the house. Otherwise, they are absolutely worthless as a "technician". (Using that term very loosely.)

If I had any rented BHN equipment, I'd simply take it down to the local office and exchange it before I'd let a shady contractor in my home again. It seemed as if he was casing the place with his eyes.

DanG1974
join:2005-06-26
Saint Petersburg, FL

DanG1974 to scanman1

Member

to scanman1
I've never had a good experience with a contractor. I learned several years ago that when placing a service call, tell the phone rep that you don't want a contractor. They will put it in their notes and you will get a BH technician at your door.
BHNtechXpert
The One & Only
Premium Member
join:2006-02-16
Saint Petersburg, FL

BHNtechXpert to scanman1

Premium Member

to scanman1
Guys the vast majority of contractor experiences are very positive. In the past I have asked you to be my eyes and ears and immediately report any experience that is out of the norm and I meant it. I don't want to hear general statements like I have seen in this thread unless you have also reached out to me so I can get to the bottom of the specific experience.

And so far none of you have done that....despite my request for you to do so.

geo44
join:2013-03-20
Saint Petersburg, FL

geo44 to scanman1

Member

to scanman1
said by scanman1:

If this crack team of experts determined and corrected this issue with the same information as I posted here, I'm curious as to why nobody, (not even the non BHN techs knew that 15 dBmV is such a strong signal as to cause distortion)???

I looked up the specs for your modem:
this is from the data sheet:
Operating Level Range -15 to +15 dBmV

So while the levels were on the high side they were still in spec
as listed in your original post.

data sheet link:
»tools.cisco.com/search/r ··· =DPC3000

TAZ
join:2014-01-03
Tucson, AZ

1 recommendation

TAZ to BHNtechXpert

Member

to BHNtechXpert
said by BHNtechXpert:

Guys the vast majority of contractor experiences are very positive. In the past I have asked you to be my eyes and ears and immediately report any experience that is out of the norm and I meant it. I don't want to hear general statements like I have seen in this thread unless you have also reached out to me so I can get to the bottom of the specific experience.

And so far none of you have done that....despite my request for you to do so.

Why is it your customers' job to be your eyes and ears?

Hint: because they aren't going to switch to another cable company.

The advantage to hiring a contractor is economies of scale. However, in any given area, there aren't very many customers for cable technicians. (The only exception would be overbuilt areas where perhaps more than one cable company could be hiring the same contractors.) That means there are no economies of scale. All it means is there's going to be another person/company in the middle wanting to make their cut. And they're cheaper specifically because they cut every corner possible.

If you want happy customers (I realize you, just like every other cable company that isn't specifically an overbuilder, don't really care), hire in-house technicians, pay them well, treat them well, train them well, and equip them with the appropriate tools. Hell, it sounds like you're already doing this to some extent (since people seem to have positive experiences with in-house techs). Keep doing it, get rid of the contractors, perhaps offer the best contractors (i.e. the ones with the fewest or no complaints) in-house positions.

No other industry operates this way. Having a monopoly must be real nice!

telijah
Premium Member
join:2013-04-22
Brandon, FL

telijah

Premium Member

Are you kidding? There are thousands of people who have positive experiences. The problem is the Internet is a dumping ground for the negative experiences. Very few, if any, people go online just to give praise on their positive experiences, but you can almost guarantee anyone with a negative experience goes on a complains to everyone under the sun. So of course, it sounds like everyone on the Internet hates company ABC because no one else is posting about their good experiences. I have yet to have a seriously negative experience on BHN.

Also, how else would you expect BHN to know about their bad experiences with contractors other than having the customers be the "eyes and ears"? You want a BHN rep to follow every contractor on every call?

TAZ
join:2014-01-03
Tucson, AZ

TAZ

Member

said by telijah:

Also, how else would you expect BHN to know about their bad experiences with contractors other than having the customers be the "eyes and ears"? You want a BHN rep to follow every contractor on every call?

No, all they have to do is put 1 + 1 together: the contractors, whose only customer is Bright House, could not possibly do a better job at a cheaper price than Bright House themselves. So if they are cheaper, it's only because of extreme cost-cutting measures... things like sending "cable techs" out without a basic signal tester!
BHNtechXpert
The One & Only
Premium Member
join:2006-02-16
Saint Petersburg, FL

BHNtechXpert

Premium Member

said by TAZ:

said by telijah:

Also, how else would you expect BHN to know about their bad experiences with contractors other than having the customers be the "eyes and ears"? You want a BHN rep to follow every contractor on every call?

No, all they have to do is put 1 + 1 together: the contractors, whose only customer is Bright House, could not possibly do a better job at a cheaper price than Bright House themselves. So if they are cheaper, it's only because of extreme cost-cutting measures... things like sending "cable techs" out without a basic signal tester!

And your cable experience other than being a customer is....? And to be clear you are in AZ and we don't service your area right.....

I didn't think so....thanks for your input however our folks here know I want to know about all experiences good, bad and ugly and they know why. And they also know I will handle any such experiences on a one by one basis as needed.

TAZ
join:2014-01-03
Tucson, AZ

TAZ

Member

I'm not a Bright House customer. Doesn't matter though, the whole cable contractor deal is the same no matter what company.

Your customers don't want to deal with BS then come on here to get good service. They want to get good service from the start.
BHNtechXpert
The One & Only
Premium Member
join:2006-02-16
Saint Petersburg, FL

BHNtechXpert

Premium Member

said by TAZ:

I'm not a Bright House customer. Doesn't matter though, the whole cable contractor deal is the same no matter what company.

Your customers don't want to deal with BS then come on here to get good service. They want to get good service from the start.

No it's not and frankly it's inappropriate for you to comment on contractors meaning BHN that you have no experience with.

Now I have given you some lattitude on your posts but that stops now. Most contractors and techs do an outstanding job in their respective positions. Is that to say that every single customer experience will be perfect...nope...people are human... they make mistakes or have a bad day or whatever it might have been that resulted in an experience that fails to meet our high standards.

Because it means so much to us we ask that our customers take the time to make us aware of these situations so we can do what needs to be done to ensure it doesn't happen again and make it right with our customer.

Now you are free to take the stance you have with your own provider but I think it's highly inappropriate for you to interject in this discussion when you have no experience basis with us or our field folks. If that should that ever change look me up and I'll be happy to talk with you about it.

Thanks....

mixdup
join:2003-06-28
Alpharetta, GA

1 recommendation

mixdup

Member

said by BHNtechXpert:

Now I have given you some lattitude on your posts but that stops now.

You do realize BHN doesn't own this site, right? There are no rules from BBR preventing people from commenting here. I'll pipe in and say I've had a bad experience with a BHN contractor in Birmingham in the past as well, so while every single contractor may not be horrible, they do leave much to be desired. I'm pretty sure most of the Southern Cable trucks I see running around Birmingham with "Contractor for BHN" on the side would fail a safety inspection in a state that required them.
BHNtechXpert
The One & Only
Premium Member
join:2006-02-16
Saint Petersburg, FL

BHNtechXpert

Premium Member

said by mixdup:

said by BHNtechXpert:

Now I have given you some lattitude on your posts but that stops now.

You do realize BHN doesn't own this site, right? There are no rules from BBR preventing people from commenting here. I'll pipe in and say I've had a bad experience with a BHN contractor in Birmingham in the past as well, so while every single contractor may not be horrible, they do leave much to be desired. I'm pretty sure most of the Southern Cable trucks I see running around Birmingham with "Contractor for BHN" on the side would fail a safety inspection in a state that required them.

Mixdup don't even start....you have done really well lately and I'd like to see you on the productive side of discussions as you have been recently despite your non-customer status...you have actually been very helpful to folks....please don't digress.

weaseled386
join:2008-04-13
Edgewater, FL

weaseled386 to mixdup

Member

to mixdup
said by mixdup:

You do realize BHN doesn't own this site, right?

They may not own it, but they also don't have to stay quiet when people open their mouths to comment on things they have no first hand experience in.

TAZ
join:2014-01-03
Tucson, AZ

1 recommendation

TAZ to BHNtechXpert

Member

to BHNtechXpert
said by BHNtechXpert:

No it's not and frankly it's inappropriate for you to comment on contractors meaning BHN that you have no experience with.

I don't need experience with your specific contractors to know that the practice is fundamentally unsound and never will result in a better average customer experience than your company's own employees.

It's simple:
- You have in-house techs, who are given a certain amount of training and tools. Based on user experiences posted here, it sounds like these guys provide a reasonable customer experience. They also cost the company accordingly.
- You have contractors, who work for some other company who themselves is trying to make a profit. Since there aren't exactly a dozen cable companies to choose from, most of these contractors have exactly one customer (you).
- The only possible reason you would send contractors to a job instead of your own people, is because the contractors are cheaper.
- Since there are no economies of scale here, with the contractors' only customer being you, they can only be cheaper for one possible reason: they cut corners and don't provide the best customer experience.

I invite you to point out any flaws you see in my logic.
BHNtechXpert
The One & Only
Premium Member
join:2006-02-16
Saint Petersburg, FL

BHNtechXpert

Premium Member

said by TAZ:

said by BHNtechXpert:

No it's not and frankly it's inappropriate for you to comment on contractors meaning BHN that you have no experience with.

I don't need experience with your specific contractors to know that the practice is fundamentally unsound and never will result in a better average customer experience than your company's own employees.

It's simple:
- You have in-house techs, who are given a certain amount of training and tools. Based on user experiences posted here, it sounds like these guys provide a reasonable customer experience. They also cost the company accordingly.
- You have contractors, who work for some other company who themselves is trying to make a profit. Since there aren't exactly a dozen cable companies to choose from, most of these contractors have exactly one customer (you).
- The only possible reason you would send contractors to a job instead of your own people, is because the contractors are cheaper.
- Since there are no economies of scale here, with the contractors' only customer being you, they can only be cheaper for one possible reason: they cut corners and don't provide the best customer experience.

I invite you to point out any flaws you see in my logic.

And again you are making assumptions you have no first hand or working experience in by your own admission. There is nothing to be gained by arguing this point with you because we are not on common foundations or working experience for that matter.

As I stated earlier when you actually gain that experience in all areas let me know and we can certainly have a discussion about it.

TAZ
join:2014-01-03
Tucson, AZ

TAZ

Member

Please feel free to correct whichever of my statements you believe to be incorrect then. Thanks!
BHNtechXpert
The One & Only
Premium Member
join:2006-02-16
Saint Petersburg, FL

BHNtechXpert

Premium Member

said by TAZ:

Please feel free to correct whichever of my statements you believe to be incorrect then. Thanks!

No... one last time.... It is pointless to discuss this with you because we are not on common foundations...period. You have no first hand experience with our techs (contractor or otherwise) nor do you have any experience in the industry to frame your opinions around other than your own personal experience as a customer with your local provider.

Now I'm sorry for you if your local experience has been bad...perhaps if you took the time to let your local providers management team know the experience would be better. You have made that decision on your own however and others should not allow themselves to follow in your footsteps especially as it applies to us HERE.

We want to know, we can't follow these guys around 24/7/365...it is simply impossible shy of attaching a camera to their heads and streaming the experience back realtime which is frankly a bit creepy so that isn't going to happen.

But you aren't helping the situation either by doing nothing about it other than to post online in another providers forums section....really? If it matters enough for you take the time to troll another providers forums certainly it's worthy of picking up the phone and sharing the experience with the people who can help you...otherwise you're wasting everyones time including your own.

TAZ
join:2014-01-03
Tucson, AZ

TAZ

Member

Since you can't point out any inaccuracies in my statements, I stand by them. (But I'm still happy to be corrected, and am happy to acknowledge any accurate corrections.)

Also, you seem to be under the impression I'm here ranting about a poor experience with my own provider (or any other provider I've used, for that matter). That's not the case. Not that it's relevant here, but AFAIK my provider doesn't send contractors on customer visits (at least they never have to me).

I've pointed out how the practice is fundamentally flawed, no matter who's doing it, and that doesn't need to be based on any personal experience.
BHNtechXpert
The One & Only
Premium Member
join:2006-02-16
Saint Petersburg, FL

BHNtechXpert

Premium Member

LOL....

DCELL
CC/Nature Coast
join:2010-06-17
Inglis, FL

DCELL to telijah

Member

to telijah
said by telijah:

Are you kidding? There are thousands of people who have positive experiences. The problem is the Internet is a dumping ground for the negative experiences. Very few, if any, people go online just to give praise on their positive experiences, but you can almost guarantee anyone with a negative experience goes on a complains to everyone under the sun. So of course, it sounds like everyone on the Internet hates company ABC because no one else is posting about their good experiences. I have yet to have a seriously negative experience on BHN.

Also, how else would you expect BHN to know about their bad experiences with contractors other than having the customers be the "eyes and ears"? You want a BHN rep to follow every contractor on every call?

Hear, hear!