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wayner92

join:2006-01-17
Toronto, ON

Anyone having problems with Hitron 3GN?

I upgraded to the Hitron 3GN and faster Ultimate service last Thursday night. Since then I have had internet problems that could only be solved by rebooting the modem on Saturday, Sunday and Tuesday. I am wondering if I have a flaky modem/gateway - anyone else have this problem?

Note that my gateway is in bridge mode - if that makes a difference.



GI Suck
I Got Mail Yay

join:2004-01-14
Oshawa, ON

I too am having a similar problem, and the reports are that this is only a problem in bridge mode. I'm currently testing that theory by putting my CGN3 back into gateway mode, and using my router in bridge mode for wireless connectivity, etc.

Rogers is currently taking these issues one-by-one and is replacing modems which are encountering this problem usually with the $8 DOCSIS 3 modem (not the CGN3 modems.) Those who got replacement CGN3 modems typically don't see the issue resolved.


bigMc

join:2014-01-15
reply to wayner92

The fault is with the 3GN modems themselves. There are a few threads on the Rogers forum about the ongoing issue. These modem lockup periodically and have to be reset.


wayner92

join:2006-01-17
Toronto, ON

Does Rogers buy into this? If I escalate with tech support will I get anywhere? They are sending a tech to my house on Friday and it sounds like that is a waste of money for them and a waste of time for me.

FYI I have posted to some of those threads on Rogers' forum.


Jelllo

join:2013-12-29

You just need to go to a Rogers store and swap out the modem.


wayner92

join:2006-01-17
Toronto, ON

I wish it was that simple - if you read this forum, plus the Rogers community forums and Digital Home Canada forums you will see that there are lots of people reporting the exact same problem. A friend of mine switched from a Cisco modem to a Hitron last week and also suffers from the same problem - internet goes down and you need to do a power cycle on the modem to get it back.

That doesn't sound like the odd defective modem - it sounds like a more pervasive issue that isn't as easily fixed.



Esplanade

@rogers.com
reply to wayner92

Rogers replaced the modem 2 times and the problem still exists. I have to reboot the modem approximately every 44 to 48 hours when the DNS routing hangs up. If you are connected on Skype or remote desktop, the connections still work. The modem may appear to Rogers as being dead but it is still functioning for those connections still active. New connections won't work so there is something broken in the 3GN software. Hitron will have to come out with the software fix which Rogers will have to push out to the modems.


wayner92

join:2006-01-17
Toronto, ON

Sounds exactly like my issue. Although it isn't just DNS. If I try to browse to »74.125.226.146 (which is www.google.com) I'm not using DNS, correct? And that still fails. It looks like you can't initiate new connections or some other problem

There is a thread on Rogers' Community Internet Forum.

»communityforums.rogers.com/t5/fo···7/page/6


wayner92

join:2006-01-17
Toronto, ON
reply to wayner92

@Esplanade - Can you please PM me through this forum? I want to gather more evidence with Rogers. I tweeted about this problem - maybe we need to start a Twitter campaign to get awareness and escalation of this issue?


cepnot4me

join:2013-10-29
Severn Bridge, ON
kudos:1
Reviews:
·TekSavvy DSL
reply to wayner92

I've looked at all the posts about this issue. I've inquired in back channels with friends in various departments at Rogers it doesn't appear to be a known issue with the gateway model. (known issue refers to something very widespread. Duplicated in Test environments and under investigation with Rogers and the vendor.) however, based on it being all over the forums, here, at Rogers and other independent forums, I'd say it SHOULD be a known issue. I've put it to the actual people who fix issues like this, instead of a CSR who just logs it into the abyss.

That should result in a solution sooner than later, IF they can duplicate it in a test environment.

I'm putting my money on some sort of issue between the modem and our DNS server.



GI Suck
I Got Mail Yay

join:2004-01-14
Oshawa, ON

Unfortunately it's not a DNS issue. On Tuesday, I was using remote desktop at my office to my home computer when suddenly I was getting frequent disconnects and extremely slow performance from my session.

There's a software issue with the modem itself related to the LAN ethernet connections.


bigMc

join:2014-01-15

said by GI Suck:

nfortunately it's not a DNS issue. On Tuesday, I was using remote desktop at my office to my home computer when suddenly I was getting frequent disconnects and extremely slow performance from my session.

There's a software issue with the modem itself related to the LAN ethernet connections.

Ditto. The firmware on these modems are garbage. And contrary to cepnot4me it is a known issue, not widely known, but known none the less.


LYuan

@rogers.com

I can attest that the issue is not with DNS, and it's not with the CGN3's connection to the Rogers' broadband network. The issue is on the LAN side of things on the device. I've posted in more detail on the Rogers forum about this, but I found something really strange about the device:

Using a device wired direct to the Rogers gateway to ping its IP address (in this case assuming 192.168.0.1 and in gateway mode); Using the older Hitron CGN2 or the Cisco DOCSIS 3.0 modem, I get a steady " 1ms" latency.

Try doing the exact same thing on the Hitron CGN3 modem and see what happens. You'll get latency fluctuating between 1ms to over 10ms or more. This is right after a reboot as well. Closer to when the modem actually hangs, the latency gets larger, and you start seeing timeouts. When the modem finally hangs, you will not be able to ping the LAN address anymore, but funny enough, Rogers will still be able to see your modem. They will tell you that your signal is fine and your settings are correct.

What processes could on the CGN3 could cause that type of latency on the LAN interface?

L



Vise

@rogers.com

Just posted this on the Rogers forum as well, what is being described above does appear to explain my issue exactly... have to hard reboot the CGN3 every day or so after the internet connection dies a slow death. When it is up the speeds are amazing (I'm getting 326/21 on Ultimate) but clearly there are issues. I've been pulling my hair out the past week trying to diagnose given I also installed a new router the day before the new modem (Netgear R7000).

I swapped out the modem the first day as I had an issue where it would not go back online after a reboot... but otherwise my symptoms are exactly the same as the rest described here. Any suggestions on how to deal with Tech Support (aside from another useless modem swap) would be appreciated but it doesn't sound like there is a fix available yet.


wayner92

join:2006-01-17
Toronto, ON

@vise - are you running in Gateway mode or bridged mode?



Vise

@rogers.com

Bridge mode, as mentioned I have a pretty decent router (Netgear R7000) so I really only need a modem from Rogers... which I cannot get unfortunately. :-(



LYuan

@rogers.com

That's not a pretty decent router. That's the best router on the market. Runs dd-wrt like nobody's business...


wayner92

join:2006-01-17
Toronto, ON

@vise - Please continue bugging Rogers - the more the better - tweet @Rogershelps about your modem troubles.



Vise

@rogers.com
reply to LYuan

Hah yeah I'm actually running DD-WRT on my R7000 and it is awesome. I have my old router (Netgear R6300) setup as a wireless bridge in my basement rec room and it is pulling down awesome speeds over 802.11ac. Extremely happy with my setup including the faster Rogers internet aside from the issues... I will try @Rogershelps via Twitter as well, see what happens.



GI Suck
I Got Mail Yay

join:2004-01-14
Oshawa, ON

I got a DM from @rogershelps that this situation is escalated to the network engineering team for further investigation.

So far patience and persistence is paying off.



SimplePanda

join:2003-09-22
Toronto, ON
Reviews:
·TekSavvy DSL

said by GI Suck:

I got a DM from @rogershelps that this situation is escalated to the network engineering team for further investigation.

So far patience and persistence is paying off.

Good to hear. I periodically tweet @rogershelps asking if Rogers finally sells / offers a standalone D3 modem. I know the answer but I like to keep them reminded that some of us aren't interested in their, erm, less functional offerings.

cepnot4me

join:2013-10-29
Severn Bridge, ON
kudos:1
Reviews:
·TekSavvy DSL
reply to bigMc

"Known issue" at Rogers means the have an open ticket for backend to look into it, if that Ticket is open and you call in with the symptoms described by everyone else, the Rep forwards your account to be included in the ticket. They will not roll a technician for a known issue. That being said YOU guys know of this issue, and clearly as I see just by googling "cgn3" your not alone.

However internally Rogers doesn't see it as a "known issue" which means calls into tech support will go through the standard troubleshooting steps (reboot, reboot, reboot... is it working now?... no... let's try rebooting..) they will treat each case as an individual problem, submit individual tickets or Roll technicians to fix it.. but we won't have any idea what it is.

There are some known issues with this modem, but not for this. And those issues are resolved with a slight account adjustment that can be done in 10 minutes on the phone with you.

I think you guys are right with your diagnosis, but I think it's something the vendor (Hitron) needs to resolve. Which in my experience means hurry up and wait.

However, don't stop calling. Tweet, attack on the community forums, flood Rogers with examples and calls. That's what gets them to acknowledge it's a known issue and then it's fast tracked for a solution.

Like I said, I'm pushing it internally on your behalf. So hopefully my people get on it.

And just for reference.. next boxes rebooting at 2am has been an unresolved known issue for a year and a half. Rogers is going to be at the mercy of Hitron on this one, they will be the ones to resolve it..

And in my personal opinion.. The best modem Rogers had was an SB5100/5101. I hate the Hitrons, hate the SMC's.. tolerate the Cisco..(best of the bunch, but still not great)

Why Rogers stopped buying Motorola products is beyond me. Everything they get from everywhere else... just sucks. And that's the opinion of the guy installing them.


cepnot4me

join:2013-10-29
Severn Bridge, ON
kudos:1

The irony is that all of our other issues with all the other modems (customer complaints and technician complaints) were answered by Rogers, by launching the CGN3..

Which seems to be an out of the frying pan and into the fire solution.



LYuan

@rogers.com

So as a technician, you personally are aware of the issue, and you're aware that we are aware of the issue.

I have a technician that is coming on Thursday, who is bringing a CGN3 with him, as I have downgraded back to the Cisco device. If I show him the problem, what should I be asking him to do to get this closer to becoming a "known issue"? What I initially planned to do was show him the latency pinging to a Cisco on the LAN, then show him the same thing but on the CGN3 and ask him what the discrepancy meant, but beyond that, what can he do?

I posted in the rogers forums regarding my conversation with a supervisor, whom I was able to get to replicate the issue (latency on the LAN interface from a local, wired device), but he didn't think those numbers were odd (he just didn't know better), and I had to beg him to agree to even bring the issue up with a supervisor. After that hour long dialogue where I was able to get them to reproduce the problem, all I got was a "promise" that he'll bring it up with his manager - Whether he follows up or not is another story.

So, is having the technician over going to be that all over again, but in person?

L.


cepnot4me

join:2013-10-29
Severn Bridge, ON
kudos:1
Reviews:
·TekSavvy DSL

I'm not your average tech, I do escalations, chronic issues, etc. AND I pay attention to boards like these. I'm personally interested and invested in the products. Im what you would consider above average for a field tech.

Most of the techs are trained to make sure the signal levels are in spec. Physical issues, there is no training on software, firmware or any Virtual type issues for us. We are trained to assume if the signal is good, clean and in spec, that the equipment connected to it will work. We don't troubleshoot equipment, we just swap it.

We are not allowed to touch your computer, or your equipment.

Those of us that are technically inclined, will test with our laptops to see how it runs. A really good tech will call field support to have them look at it. But both the tech and our support staff are probably under qualified to handle this.

When the tech comes explain what you have figured out, and what everyone here is saying.

The guy should look lost...

If you get a Rogers senior tech, he will escalate it and provide you reference number. If you get a regular tech (most likely) prove to him whatever he changed outside didn't work, then I would urge him (politely) to refer to his supervisor, this is a prime example of supervisor territory (This is assuming they don't already send a supervisor or Rogers Senior if enough techs have been out already they may actually do that). A supervisor or Rogers senior will escalate the hell out of it. And leave you their business card and probably a reference number for the escalated ticket. That is the best Avenue to get this escalated into "known issue" territory. At the same time, my escalations and the escalation to network engineering posted earlier seems to be gaining momentum, I'm seeing "we are looking into it" emails.

In short. Your either booking for a supervisor, or getting a IT or C ticket created. Or both.

Settle for nothing less.

If you have to, demand the tech refer to supervisor.


wayner92

join:2006-01-17
Toronto, ON

The problem is that the problem is so intermittent. All that the tech can do is replace the modem and then everything works for hours/days, etc. so it "looks" like the issue was fixed. But then it reappears.

I had a tech visit scheduled from 4-6 yesterday. He called ahead of the visit and asked if it is working. I said "yes, but..." He said that there is no point in his coming since everyone with this modm has thes issues and I can try swapping the modem but the issue will come back. He said he doesn't have a spare in his truck. So it seems like this problem is very well known to the guys in the field.


cepnot4me

join:2013-10-29
Severn Bridge, ON
kudos:1
Reviews:
·TekSavvy DSL

We know of other issues. Or perhaps there are enough trucks rolling now that the guys are seeing the trend.

In my opinion, we field techs see and know all kinds of things... but no one asks us. So there is a communication disconnect between us and the people able to fix it. That bothers me to no end. I diagnosed an issue with the Scientific Atlanta modems years and years ago. Any of these modems with a serial number starting with 207 or 201 would do about 1mbps max. I cleared my reports, I returned the equipment with explicit details on the issue. We all knew these modems were bad, but Rogers didnt.

I finally through different avenues made a few friends, I pointed out the modems, the evidence, and they escalated it a TM, the TM escalated it to product. Product responded back that there wasn't a problem. I replied ALL to the email chain including managers, directors, employees etc a list of addresses, screen shots, and so on of irrefutable evidence. Then product looked into it.

Book another service call. If they say "we know" ask them to provide the incident number or case ID number.

If they can't, tell them how many modems you've had, how many service calls you've booked, and you would appreciate it if they referred it to their supervisor.

If you don't have a case ID or ticket number.. no one in the Rogers company of products knows your issue is unresolved.
Keep booking appointments. Don't let up.

If I got your order, I'd escalate it. I'd get my field support to transfer me to engineering. I'm wouldn't leave till I got a ticket opened. But like I say... I'm not your average tech. however, I approach things like a supervisor is supposed to.


cepnot4me

join:2013-10-29
Severn Bridge, ON
kudos:1
Reviews:
·TekSavvy DSL

Also, at this point. You should be dealing with the office of the President when you call in. Try to push for that, office of the President will ensure a Rogers senior tech or contractor supervisor comes out. As well as logging an engineering ticket.

This issue is too widespread, EVERYONE with it, needs to keep calling Rogers. 200 phone calls with the same problem is hard to chalk up as a "one off."


wayner92

join:2006-01-17
Toronto, ON
reply to wayner92

I would like to see Rogers acknowledge that many (most/all?) people using this modem have problems and that Rogers is working to resolve it. I understand that the resolution will be a firmware upgrade or a modem replacement. So my options now are:
(1) continue with the CGN3 with the understanding that I will have to regularly reset the device, or
(2) downgrade to one of the other modems but continue to receive the parameters of the Ultimate service where possible - this means a 1TB data cap and higher than 10Mbps up speed, if possible.



LYuan

@rogers.com
reply to cepnot4me

*Posted on DSL Reports and Rogers Forums*

I just got off the phone with Rahim from the customer advocacy team at Rogers, who was very patient and most technical out of anyone that I have talked to so far in the chain. I think I'm getting somewhere, or maybe that's the genius of Rogers; make you *THINK* you're getting somewhere I don't think I can push for the office of the President as I don't have the CGN3 anymore, but I explained to him what was going on from the beginning. We discussed the following.

1) My personal experience in this field
2) My initial symptoms in bridge mode
3) Latency pinging to the LAN interface in gateway mode; compared to CGN2 and Cisco
4) Emphasized that the problem is not the Rogers network or the modem's signals, as they have been great in my area.
5) I did not expect Rogers to be able to do something immediately, as if what I think is going on is true, the fix would have to come from Hitron's side. I just need Rogers to acclimate to the fact that this is actually a widespread issue, and like cepnot4me said, award it a "known issue" status. That's all I want.

Rahim did notice that I do use a lot of upload, and that may be causing the latency. I explained to him, that any latency caused by flooding the upstream channels would manifest on the WAN side of the gateway and would not effect the LAN/gigabit interface.

He agreed that pinging the LAN interface in a gigabit network should not result in these high pings, and anything above 1ms is not ideal. Based on these facts and the fact that he did believe that I knew what I was talking about, he agreed to have engineers look into this, and he would also be doing some research on this.

Rahim himself has not personally heard of any problems with these devices, which I find a bit worrying, but I referenced both DSL Reports and the Rogers Community forums as places to look. He has agreed to take this on.

We hung up, and he called back a few minutes later, and told me that I had a truck coming on Thursday, which was true. I asked him if it was still needed, and he said no, and that he was on top of it. He also said that if he needed any more instruction during his testing as to process, he would reach out to me. All in all, I feel productive, and I am thankful that I got to speak to Rahim, who seems eager to take this on.

If you're reading this, thanks a bunch Rahim!