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ice
Sleep Less, Game More
join:2002-07-01
Wind Gap, PA

ice

Member

UPS Charging Question

I have an APC Back UPS XS 1300. For about a year the stock battery was dead and kept shutting the UPS off completely every now and then, so I finally bought a new battery. I didn't go with APC but a "compatible" brand that had good reviews on Amazon, and now it's been so long since I had a functioning battery I don't remember if this is normal. I noticed the battery level is very rarely at 100% while it's plugged in and charging. It seems to drop any time something is being done on the computer, but if the computer is idle, the charge catches up again. Right now it's sitting at 80% after being idle all night. I pulled the plug on it and it ran my PC fine, I let it get to about 40% battery before plugging it back in thinking that might reset something and let it charge, but is it normal for the battery level to drop even when plugged in?
HarryH3
Premium Member
join:2005-02-21

HarryH3

Premium Member

I have 3 smaller APC's (450, 725 and 750) here and all of them always report 98-100% charged unless the power has been off for a while.
ice
Sleep Less, Game More
join:2002-07-01
Wind Gap, PA

ice

Member

That's kind of what I thought. I wonder if it's somehow not reporting the charge properly or something.
HarryH3
Premium Member
join:2005-02-21

HarryH3

Premium Member

What does a voltmeter across the battery terminals report?
bbear2
Premium Member
join:2003-10-06
dot.earth

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I'm curious which battery (s) you ended up purchasing cause I have to replace some of mine.

Also, I'm guessing that the XS1300 is one of the more sophisticated ones and you might need to manually run the "self test" (I'm thinking it was called that). This is somewhat of a misleading name for it, if I have the name right, because it actually does a calibration and more. And if this program hasn't been run on the new batteries then it could be using the old battery data.

Bottom line is that the battery should stay topped up at 98+ regardless of the power draw while plugged in to a good circuit. It should not dip. And if it does, I don't understand how that could be a function of the batteries vs. the UPS.
ice
Sleep Less, Game More
join:2002-07-01
Wind Gap, PA

ice

Member

I wound up going with these:

»www.amazon.com/gp/produc ··· F8&psc=1

I was watching a show and outputting the display to my TV via HDMI and now the battery is saying 49%. There's definitely something up with it. I did run the self test when I first installed them, and I also set the date I replaced them in APC's software as well.

I'm not sure what a voltmeter says, I'd have to disconnect everything again and it's a bit of a pain to do so, I haven't gotten there yet. Maybe I'll give it a shot.

EDIT: I just ran another self test (which it passed again), and the battery jumped up from 49% to 55%.
bbear2
Premium Member
join:2003-10-06
dot.earth

bbear2

Premium Member

What was the amp hour rating of the original batteries?
ice
Sleep Less, Game More
join:2002-07-01
Wind Gap, PA

ice

Member

9ah, same as these are supposed to be. They say 9ah on the side.

I'm about to try resetting it by attaching 30% load and letting it run dead, then charging.
bbear2
Premium Member
join:2003-10-06
dot.earth

bbear2

Premium Member

I don't think draining them is a good idea. If they were nicads yes, but not lead acid. They like to stay at near top charge always and only can provide a few deep cycles.
ice
Sleep Less, Game More
join:2002-07-01
Wind Gap, PA

ice

Member

I've read these instructions from numerous places including APC support themselves, seems pretty common.
bbear2
Premium Member
join:2003-10-06
dot.earth

bbear2

Premium Member

Sure, they want you to kill the batteries sooner so that they can sell you more .
ice
Sleep Less, Game More
join:2002-07-01
Wind Gap, PA

ice

Member

Either way they won't get my money, and either way something is wrong with the setup so at this point I'll try anything. I'm letting it charge again with no power being drawn from it and I'll see if that helped at all. If not I'll get in touch with the place I ordered from. It's at 5% right now.
bbear2
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join:2003-10-06
dot.earth

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said by ice:

9ah, same as these are supposed to be. They say 9ah on the side.

I'm about to try resetting it by attaching 30% load and letting it run dead, then charging.

OK. On the APC site, nowhere do the seem to publish this 9AH spec, including in the manual. So if this is the correct battery set »www.apc.com/products/res ··· PCRBC123 they sell it for $59.99. Per your link, the Beiter's are selling for $25.63. I'm not saying you got a bum deal, but that's a huge difference in price for the seemingly exact same product. Looking at some of the 1,2, and 3 star reviews, they seem to imply that these don't have they quality and reliability as you might have hoped for.

Again, out of curiosity, can you see who the OEM is for the original APC batteries?
ice
Sleep Less, Game More
join:2002-07-01
Wind Gap, PA

ice

Member

This is the OEM battery from APC with the 9AH rating:

»www.apc.com/products/res ··· PCRBC109

Given the number of positive reviews and few number of bad reviews I chalked it up to being a few bum units. Maybe I just got one of the bum units.

I'm not sure who the manufacturer is for the OEM, let me see if it says anywhere.

EDIT: No clue, the original battery is already at the office to be recycled.
bbear2
Premium Member
join:2003-10-06
dot.earth

bbear2

Premium Member

Usually the OEM name is under the plastic wrapper or a sticker and you have to dig for it. I guess if you don't recall it operating in this manner, it probably didn't. And perhaps only one of the two are sub-par, but would be difficult to tell which.
ice
Sleep Less, Game More
join:2002-07-01
Wind Gap, PA

ice

Member

Well, I woke up this morning and it was charged to 88%. Hopped on the pc and it dropped to 84%. Keep in mind this is with nothing drawing power from it at all. I left for a few hours and when I got back it was charged to 100%. I still emailed the vendor and told them what's going on.

Dustyn
Premium Member
join:2003-02-26
Ontario, CAN
·Carry Telecom
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I have a really annoying problem with my APC Back-UPS 1000XS. I can't figure out what the hell is going on with it, but it seems like it doesn't want to start re-charging properly after going on battery for a power disruption. Windows PowerChute CLAIMS it's charging... but I don't think it is. Why would the charge level drop if it's charging? I've tried unplugging the UPS, re-plugging it back in and it still won't charge. What seems to work 90% of the time is opening the battery compartment door... removing the battery... brain dead the UPS... plug the battery back in... plug the UPS into A/C utility, and THEN it should start charging again.

It's a stock UPS battery from APC that came with the unit. These issues happened almost immediately after purchase. Maybe it is the battery... but I've Googled around about the APC Back-UPS 1000XS and have found many similar issues to what I am experiencing. IF it's not in fact a battery issue, and perhaps a unit issue, I'm wondering if a firmware update could correct the odd charging issue?

Don't think I'll buy NEW APC units ever again. I prefer the old school APC Smart-UPS 1500 units.
ice
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join:2002-07-01
Wind Gap, PA

ice

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That could very well be the case too I guess. I really don't know what to try, I suppose I should just get a voltmeter and check what it's at. Since I made my post, Powerchute is saying it's down to 94% again. How is that possible with ZERO load and constant charging?
bbear2
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join:2003-10-06
dot.earth

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By vendor, you mean APC or the new batteries?

FWIW, here's a post with a slightly different issue but with a similar model that proved to be a faulty UPS. Thought it might give you another perspective: »forums.apc.com/thread/72 ··· tstart=0
ice
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join:2002-07-01
Wind Gap, PA

ice

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I emailed the place I got the new batteries from. I figured trying to get in touch wtih APC would be sort of useless once they found out I didn't get a "genuine" battery from them.

I'll check that thread out.

weaseled386
join:2008-04-13
Edgewater, FL

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said by ice:

That could very well be the case too I guess. I really don't know what to try, I suppose I should just get a voltmeter and check what it's at. Since I made my post, Powerchute is saying it's down to 94% again. How is that possible with ZERO load and constant charging?

Keep this in mind: A battery can have the correct voltage, but still be defective. I'd recommend using your meter to check for voltage, and then hooking a car headlight up to it to ensure it can carry a load. If there are 100 companies selling batteries there are only a handful producing them. There is no guarantee that the batteries APC sells is superior to the generic ones you bought.

Keep your meter hooked up and see what they do (intensity and voltage) in 10 minute intervals. Within 30 minutes I'd suspect a defective battery to show itself.
IamGimli (banned)
join:2004-02-28
Canada

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Something else to check is whether your line power is stable enough or if your UPS is constantly running in power trimming/boosting mode. Powerchute should be able to tell you your current line power (the current provided by your electrical company) and whether it,s within the tolerances you set on your UPS.

If your utility supplier often drops voltage below the UPS tolerance the UPS will kick in to boost the voltage, during which time it'll discharge even though it's receiving current from the utility and there's no "power outage" per se.

Thane_Bitter
Inquire within
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join:2005-01-20

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Take weaseled386 advice and do a test of the battery. Just a long shot but it is possible that one of the batteries has an internal defect. If this does use more than one battery are you sure you connected them correctly, depending on the UPS sometime the cells are put in parallel or series, and occasionally both if there are more than three batteries in the RBC. Just double check the wiring to ensure you have the batteries connected correctly. In your case it appears that the cells are connected in series so that the UPS receives 24 volts.

Someone mentioned doing a run time calibration, while it is true running down a lead acid battery till it has zero capacity is hard on it, it is also the only way of establishing its full capacity and thus runtime. As batteries age this runtime drops (case in point I am getting close to replacing 8 batteries in my UPS, overall runtime has dropped by 20 something minutes since it was put into service, that is about half the runtime I had when they were new, correcting for load differences) and eventually it gets to the point that either you don't have enough time to safely shutdown the equipment (APC often throws the error 'runtime exceeded' or in the extreme you have no runtime at all. You probably don't want to run a calibration test any more than once a year to maintain a good track on wear and preserve battery life.

The self test only checks to see if the UPS can run on battery power, it does not drain much of the batteries, by default most APC UPS are factory set to do a self-test every two weeks.