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Mango
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reply to nunya

Re: [Electrical] Wired a panel for the first time.

Out of curiosity what cable clamps do you use?

said by nunya:

Google "BR hold down kit".

Thanks; so I insert this whenever I need to work on the panel so I don't accidentally turn it on?

said by nunya:

Otherwise, it looks like a total piece of fuck! J/K - I think it looks good.

lol! Thanks.


nunya
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said by Mango:

Thanks; so I insert this whenever I need to work on the panel so I don't accidentally turn it on?

No. It keep the breaker from sliding off the stabs. It would probably never happen, but it's required on the backfeed breaker (Here in the US. Probably the same in Canada).

For romex entry clamps I use plain jane's (841) or Arlington NM74.
--
If someone refers to herself / himself as a "guru", they probably aren't.


Jack_in_VA
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North, VA
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What's to keep any breaker from "slipping" off the stabs? That's why for only a few dollars more buy and install a bolt in breaker panel. Eliminate a potential problem.


Mango
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said by nunya:

No. It keep the breaker from sliding off the stabs.

Thank you for being kind to my utter misunderstanding of what you were suggesting.

said by Jack_in_VA:

What's to keep any breaker from "slipping" off the stabs?

When there are two breakers side by side, they are much more secure - perhaps that helps?


Jack_in_VA
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The backfed breaker is no more prone to "slide" off than any other double pole breaker.



Jack_in_VA
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reply to Mango

said by Mango:

Out of curiosity what cable clamps do you use?

said by nunya:

Google "BR hold down kit".

Thanks; so I insert this whenever I need to work on the panel so I don't accidentally turn it on?

said by nunya:

Otherwise, it looks like a total piece of fuck! J/K - I think it looks good.

lol! Thanks.

Your panel looks really good. You did good.


LazMan
Premium
join:2003-03-26
canada
reply to Jack_in_VA

said by Jack_in_VA:

The backfed breaker is no more prone to "slide" off than any other double pole breaker.

Maybe not - but the manufacturer says a retaining clip is required for back-feed applications.

Therefore, a retaining clip is required...


Pow Boom

@mycingular.net

1 recommendation

reply to Jack_in_VA

said by Jack_in_VA:

The backfed breaker is no more prone to "slide" off than any other double pole breaker.

If a branch circuit breaker slides off, it's dead whereas a backfed breaker can and probably will be hot. I've seen the mess it makes when a backfed 100A Cutler-Hammer type CH breaker without the proper hold-down strap slides off.


Jack_in_VA
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And what did it do. Unless the stabs ground to metal the breaker will just swing free. The breaker panel cover should hold all the breakers in tight not allowing the stabs to raise up off the buss

I have the push on breaker panel but "if" I ever change it out which I might have to it will be replaced with bolt on type breakers. No c stabs to loosen up over time. However they are held tight on the buss by the breaker cover.



Pow Boom

@mycingular.net

The reasonably experienced homeowner was installing an additional circuit. In the process, he moved the #2 feeders in order to access the connector locknut. When he pushed the feeders back toward their original location, he unknowingly dislodged the breaker. When he went to pull the cable through the connector, the breaker fully disengaged and slid back to the point where the exposed buss stabs on the type CH breaker made contact with the metal breaker retaining rail. The resulting arcing destroyed the breaker, caused enough damage to the panel to warrant replacement and landed the homeowner in the ER with facial and corneal burns. Without entering into a debate as to whether non-qualified people have any business in the panel to begin with, the proper breaker hold-down strap (as required by the NEC and the panel manufacturer when back-feeding breakers) would have prevented the entire ordeal. Of course, had the breaker been one that used enclosed slot stabs such as GE type THQL, Eaton type BR, Siemens/Murry or Square D Homeline, it probably would have been averted then too.


Mango
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Do any of the Canadians here know where I could get one of these? Home Depot, Rona, Home Hardware, and Canadian Tire don't have them, at least not that I could find online.



Jack_in_VA
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4 edits
reply to Pow Boom

said by Pow Boom :

The reasonably experienced homeowner was installing an additional circuit. In the process, he moved the #2 feeders in order to access the connector locknut. When he pushed the feeders back toward their original location, he unknowingly dislodged the breaker. When he went to pull the cable through the connector, the breaker fully disengaged and slid back to the point where the exposed buss stabs on the type CH breaker made contact with the metal breaker retaining rail. The resulting arcing destroyed the breaker, caused enough damage to the panel to warrant replacement and landed the homeowner in the ER with facial and corneal burns. Without entering into a debate as to whether non-qualified people have any business in the panel to begin with, the proper breaker hold-down strap (as required by the NEC and the panel manufacturer when back-feeding breakers) would have prevented the entire ordeal. Of course, had the breaker been one that used enclosed slot stabs such as GE type THQL, Eaton type BR, Siemens/Murry or Square D Homeline, it probably would have been averted then too.

The code calls for the restraint therefore it should be installed. No debate on that and is a non-issue.

The homeowner was by letting this happen could not be considered reasonably experienced. His panel obviously did not have the restraint on the back fed breaker and he failed to take the necessary precautions on working in the panel.

You cannot make statements like that to ignore the fact the homeowner was not qualified thus allowing the incident to happen. It's his own fault and not the equipment. It's bad he was injured but that's what happens sometimes when unqualified people work on energized electrical equipment.

Any experienced and trained electrician understands the hazards of working a panel "hot" and the added back fed breaker. All that is needed is to hold the breaker in place with a electrical gloved hand while moving the wires feeding it with the other hand. Or better yet given he was unqualified he should have just killed the power to the backfed breaker thereby killing the power to the entire panel while working on it.


LazMan
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canada

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reply to Mango

said by Mango:

Do any of the Canadians here know where I could get one of these? Home Depot, Rona, Home Hardware, and Canadian Tire don't have them, at least not that I could find online.

Westburne would be a good starting point...

»west.westburne.ca/branchLocator.···=locator

It's not something your average weekend warrior would need; so not at all surprised a big-box store wouldn't have them; or likely even know they existed...