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NormanS
I gave her time to steal my mind away
MVM
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NormanS to Snowy

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to Snowy

Re: HP to begin charging for firmware updates and service packs for servers

said by Snowy:

Personally, I believe when HP dumped Carly Fiorina they kick started their road to mediocrity.

Trust me, the mediocrity was already evident when HP brought Carly Fiorina in.

Hank
Searching for a new Frontier
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join:2002-05-21
Burlington, WV
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Hank

Premium Member

said by NormanS:

mediocrity was already evident when HP brought Carly Fiorina in.

As a former HP customer and employee you are correct, but there were a few after that who where much worse.

therube
join:2004-11-11
Randallstown, MD

therube

Member

Our Texas Instruments computer system had paid hardware & software support.
Seem to recall that being a couple thousand per year.
But then the computer was $20K, not $300.

And paid support was the norm for all systems at the time.

And support they gave.
If there was a problem, there was a man out - that day.
Even if they knew they couldn't fix the problem that day, even if they were overnighting parts, they still sent the man.

So they're not really doing anything new, they're just returning to what they've always done. Now doing that on a $300 machine... Well if you're an Enterprise customer & you have 1000 of those machines is one thing. But if you have one or two in your office, to me, that's something else again.

Buy a motherboard for $50, you get "lifetime" updates. No "support", necessarily, but as they tweak & find & fix, you can download updates, for free. (But updates only last so long, given the short lifespan of a particular hardware series. They're not fixing anything "for you", but as a normal course of their business r&d, you get the fixes.)

OldMember
@comcast.net

OldMember

Anon

said by therube:

So they're not really doing anything new, they're just returning to what they've always done. Now doing that on a $300 machine... Well if you're an Enterprise customer & you have 1000 of those machines is one thing. But if you have one or two in your office, to me, that's something else again.

Buy a motherboard for $50, you get "lifetime" updates. No "support", necessarily, but as they tweak & find & fix, you can download updates, for free. (But updates only last so long, given the short lifespan of a particular hardware series. They're not fixing anything "for you", but as a normal course of their business r&d, you get the fixes.)

The following scenario from the article is typical of the types of issues you can run into that requires a firmware fix, except now you'll pay for that fix.
said by »www.zdnet.com/hp-to-begi ··· 0026110/ :
The HP ProLiant MicroServer N40L, for example, was available for sale in 2012 at heavily discounted prices from online sellers, typically under $300. But this widely used server, which contains four drive bays in a compact box that is well under 1 cubic foot, wouldn’t run Windows Server 2012 R2 (or, for that matter, Windows 8.1) for months after their release to manufacturing. Windows Server 2012 R2 was released to MSDN and TechNet subscribers in September 2013 and was generally available in October 2013. But trying to install that OS on a ProLiant MicroServer resulted in a series of errors, with the system hanging at boot. The only workaround was to disable the built-in Gigabit Ethernet controller, a serious limitation for a server.

HP released a firmware fix for the issue in mid-November, 2013. The ProLiant MicroServer N54L, a later version of the N40L with a beefier processor in the same enclosure, suffered from the same flaw, fixed with a firmware update at the same time.

..Under the new policy, access to the firmware after the warranty expires would require the purchase of an HP Care Pack, at current prices of between $126 and $200, at least half the cost of the original hardware. That’s a hefty price to pay to fix what is arguably a defect in the original product.
That's almost ransom to me. You're okay with that, therube See Profile ?

therube
join:2004-11-11
Randallstown, MD

therube

Member

No, not really.
But unless everyone goes to that model, you still have choices.

So what kind of price can I get on 1,000 HP "servers" with 3-years support included?
And what kind of price can I get for similar from Dell?

If HP is priced lower including "support", then it doesn't matter.
Otherwise I can go with Dell, at a lower price, with support included, "free".

If HP is overpriced, then they've priced themselves out of the market.

The box doesn't matter.
There's nothing magical about HP. It's just a box.

If I'm a onesie twosiey & I know I'm going to have to layout $$ for "support", then the same way. How much is the box+support vs. Dell's box, support included? Whichever method works out to my advantage is how I'm going.

Or I can decide I'll do without support, like will happen with XP.

OldMember
@comcast.net

OldMember

Anon

said by therube:

No, not really.
But unless everyone goes to that model, you still have choices.

I agree there are choices, and the choice will not be to purchase support on units that I would not have before, but go with someone else. Someone who wouldn't expect me to purchase a fix for something that should have worked as purchased.

Unfortunately, I have many HP units currently in place now. We're a shoe-string business, like many are these days. When you need a fix of this kind, it's many times a pressured situation to get it resolved. I don't believe it's hyperbole to call it ransom to expect hundreds of dollars to get the fix needed.

The fact that HP would pull this on their business customers is a sorry move. While HP might think they are bringing in revenue on forcing support, they sure will lose customers, and some long-standing. Not only over the money, but the quality of their brand which was once linked to quality business systems.
SpHeRe31459
Premium Member
join:2002-10-09
Sacramento, CA

SpHeRe31459

Premium Member

said by OldMember :

The fact that HP would pull this on their business customers is a sorry move. While HP might think they are bringing in revenue on forcing support, they sure will lose customers, and some long-standing. Not only over the money, but the quality of their brand which was once linked to quality business systems.

Yep, it smells of desperation and shows a total lack of class or courtesy when it comes to their business/enterprise customers. I thought biz stuff was the higher margin equipment, no? so then why nickel and dime business-class users like a cheap consumer PC user who gets charged $20 for OS restore discs.

OldMember
@comcast.net

OldMember

Anon

said by SpHeRe31459:

said by OldMember :

The fact that HP would pull this on their business customers is a sorry move. While HP might think they are bringing in revenue on forcing support, they sure will lose customers, and some long-standing. Not only over the money, but the quality of their brand which was once linked to quality business systems.

Yep, it smells of desperation and shows a total lack of class or courtesy to their business/enterprise customers.

Exactly.