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Tirael
BOHICA
Premium
join:2009-03-18
Sacramento, CA
kudos:2
reply to cat666

Re: Elder SCrolls Online NDA has been lifted!

said by cat666:

ESO has nothing new, and nothing to justify it's whopping great price tag.

I think ESO will hold the attention of plenty of people past the CoD release. Most of the new CoDs have nothing new, yet people still buy them. I would argue that there is plenty of new things that ESO brings (3 faction pvp, combat system, non-linear questing) to the MMO genre that warrant its price tag. The average cost of a game is $60 on new release. Pre-ordering ESO gets you 5 days of early access (which is probably the reason it costs as much as it does). I would bet that after the release, the digital edition will go down to $40.

As far as the game is concerned, this was a beta test (more apt, a stress test). I expected (and you all should have) there to be things that were not completely polished. I am sure by the time ESO is released, the only issue with the game will be server related. I pre-ordered the CE and I do not even like Elder Scrolls that much. I expect it will get some play time in between me leveling my Crusader in D3:RoS.
--
“Reality doesn't bite, rather our perception of reality bites.” - Anthony J. D'Angelo


bionicRod
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said by Tirael:

As far as the game is concerned, this was a beta test (more apt, a stress test). I expected (and you all should have) there to be things that were not completely polished.

Of course. But the game comes out in a month. The build we played this weekend has to be pretty close to the final build because there isn't time for it to be otherwise.
--
The world was movin' she was right there with it and she was


Tirael
BOHICA
Premium
join:2009-03-18
Sacramento, CA
kudos:2
The game that ships in the box is most likely the one we played this weekend. However, with day 1 patching, they still have time to fix plenty of problems.
--
“Reality doesn't bite, rather our perception of reality bites.” - Anthony J. D'Angelo


cat666

join:2013-04-26
reply to Tirael
said by Tirael:

I think ESO will hold the attention of plenty of people past the CoD release. Most of the new CoDs have nothing new, yet people still buy them. I would argue that there is plenty of new things that ESO brings (3 faction pvp, combat system, non-linear questing) to the MMO genre that warrant its price tag. The average cost of a game is $60 on new release. Pre-ordering ESO gets you 5 days of early access (which is probably the reason it costs as much as it does). I would bet that after the release, the digital edition will go down to $40.

The CoD comment was more based at console gamers. They are not used to subs based gaming and will add up the price across the year, realise they could get another couple of games for that price and not bother. PC gamers are more open to subs based gaming, which is where ESO has to offer something new.

3 faction PvP isn't new, RIFT has it. The combat system is similar to GW2's and MMO's have been doing non-linear questing for years.

I really want to actually try the game myself, but it's a hefty investment for a game my gut is telling me isn't going to stand the test of time.


bionicRod
Funkier than a mohair disco ball.
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reply to Tirael
Day 1 patching won't re-polish the world. I'm guessing what we played will be pretty representative of what will be played after launch.

Did you buy a boxed CE? I haven't seen that, I bought the digital Imperial Edition, is there any difference, like a figurine or map or anything?
--
The world was movin' she was right there with it and she was


Woody79_00
I run Linux am I still a PC?
Premium
join:2004-07-08
united state
reply to bionicRod
said by bionicRod:

said by Tirael:

As far as the game is concerned, this was a beta test (more apt, a stress test). I expected (and you all should have) there to be things that were not completely polished.

Of course. But the game comes out in a month. The build we played this weekend has to be pretty close to the final build because there isn't time for it to be otherwise.

The game we played this weekend is 2 builds behind the current one. The Open Beta people played the same build as the last beta as it was just a stress test. to gauge server load, nothing more. We did not play the newest version of the game.

»forums.bethsoft.com/topic/149222···ts-here/

»i.imgur.com/OatTNDR.png

There is still a separate "Closed Beta" going on and that build is 2 builds ahead of what we played this weekend....there is over 1,000 bug fixes in the closed beta. What was played this weekend is not close to what the game will be at launch.

my guess is the last beta before launch will include this updated build and will be a significant download.

--
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bionicRod
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said by Woody79_00:

said by bionicRod:

said by Tirael:

As far as the game is concerned, this was a beta test (more apt, a stress test). I expected (and you all should have) there to be things that were not completely polished.

Of course. But the game comes out in a month. The build we played this weekend has to be pretty close to the final build because there isn't time for it to be otherwise.

The game we played this weekend is 2 builds behind the current one. The Open Beta people played the same build as the last beta as it was just a stress test. to gauge server load, nothing more. We did not play the newest version of the game.

»forums.bethsoft.com/topic/149222···ts-here/

»i.imgur.com/OatTNDR.png

There is still a separate "Closed Beta" going on and that build is 2 builds ahead of what we played this weekend....there is over 1,000 bug fixes in the closed beta. What was played this weekend is not close to what the game will be at launch.

my guess is the last beta before launch will include this updated build and will be a significant download.

That is great to know, thanks!
--
The world was movin' she was right there with it and she was


Ghastlyone
Premium
join:2009-01-07
Las Vegas, NV
kudos:5
reply to cat666
said by cat666:

I really want to actually try the game myself, but it's a hefty investment for a game my gut is telling me isn't going to stand the test of time.

You haven't even played it yet? You've been talking this whole time as if you've actually invested 10-20 hours in the Beta.


gaforces
United We Stand, Divided We Fall

join:2002-04-07
Santa Cruz, CA
reply to Woody79_00
I'm thinking the character development will be the sticking point for me. I can build the chars I want, and not be limited by arbitrary development decisions.

If I want to model the char similar to specification of a book or movie or real life, I can.
The classic paladin, or ranger, or front line melee or caster.
These characters should also be very versatile depending on the gear sets (light medium heavy) and a quick change mod.
--
Let them eat FIBER!


Tirael
BOHICA
Premium
join:2009-03-18
Sacramento, CA
kudos:2

1 recommendation

reply to bionicRod
said by bionicRod:

Did you buy a boxed CE? I haven't seen that, I bought the digital Imperial Edition, is there any difference, like a figurine or map or anything?

Figurine, Artbook, and Map.

said by Woody79_00:

he game we played this weekend is 2 builds behind the current one. The Open Beta people played the same build as the last beta as it was just a stress test. to gauge server load, nothing more. We did not play the newest version of the game.

I can almost bet that if you bought a hard copy of the game (i.e. the boxed version), then you will be downloading a significant patch on Day 1.
--
“Reality doesn't bite, rather our perception of reality bites.” - Anthony J. D'Angelo


Grimm

join:2011-05-23
reply to cat666
I have a general question for some of you. I've put plenty of time(years) into WoW and way back when, Everquest. I've played many an RTS and some Diablo. I am familiar with a sub based game and pc games in general.

On that note, I have not played WoW since August '11 and played Diablo for maybe a month or two after release. I have been mainly on my console since then(which I have gamed on since NES days).

So my question is: What would you call me? A console gamer or a PC gamer? Because it always seems like it's one or the other. I'd personally call myself a console gamer.

The reason I ask this is because I have been yearning for a true MMORPG to come to console for ages and I doubt I'm the only one, sub or not. I honestly don't think having a sub factor into the game selling be any different on console vs pc. If the game is good (which based on the last beta, I thought so) I personally think it'll do well in the console market.


bionicRod
Funkier than a mohair disco ball.
Premium
join:2009-07-06
united state
kudos:2
reply to Woody79_00
I have been watching Force Strategy's videos since finding out we were not playing the current build, and there have been some improvements. Namely, they are making the tutorial islands optional, meaning you can escape Coldharbor and then go straight to the main continent if you want. Second, they are adding collision detection to mobs and NPCs, which is supposed to give the combat more weight.

Now I'm not sure how much of what we saw in that last stress test is representative of the game. A lot of people are understandably judging the game based on the stress test thinking this is what the game is going to be at launch. I'm not sure how smart that is marketing-wise. Anyway, I'm looking forward to the next beta with the newer build.

»www.youtube.com/user/ForceSC2str···re=watch
--
The world was movin' she was right there with it and she was


Nightfall
My Goal Is To Deny Yours
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join:2001-08-03
Grand Rapids, MI
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Anyone know when the next beta will be? I am assuming the beta will be the last one before release. Probably not the last build for release obviously, but the last beta. If I had to guess, it will be in 2 weeks.
--
My domain - Nightfall.net


bionicRod
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said by Nightfall:

I am assuming the beta will be the last one before release.

If I was a betting man that's where I'd put my money.
--
The world was movin' she was right there with it and she was


Nightfall
My Goal Is To Deny Yours
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Grand Rapids, MI
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said by bionicRod:

said by Nightfall:

I am assuming the beta will be the last one before release.

If I was a betting man that's where I'd put my money.

I wish we would see 2 betas, but it just won't happen.
--
My domain - Nightfall.net

Gandalf4503

join:2002-06-27
Cohoes, NY

1 edit
reply to Woody79_00
Two pieces of information from the PTS:

1. Enemy NPC's now have collision detection. This means that you don't have to worry about running through enemies anymore (or them running through you). This addresses the major problem a lot of people had with the combat previously. Players can still run through each other for obvious reasons.

2. You can skip the starting area and are automatically granted the experience and such you would have gained from questing there. As far as I'm aware you don't get the Skyshards from the starter island, though, so you might want to do it just for those.

3. Random, but kind of neat to me. The Prophet in ESO is voiced by the actor that played Dumbledore in Harry Potter. He does just as good of a job here as he did in the Harry Potter movies.

I figured the above was worth sharing.

Also, a sorcerer with heavy armor and dual wield is pretty fun and viable. Since you can forge your own armor, even early on, you can easily create heavy armor that caters towards your personal needs. Just keep those greens you pick up along the way for research. I wasn't worrying about the quest rewards because I was breaking down all of the iron armor I got and making my own without spending a single gold to do so.

At level 15 you can equip a secondary weapon (or weapons) with its own skill bar that you can switch between at any time in or out of combat, so it also gives you some extra options as to how you level up, which skills you might want to choose, and how you equip yourself.


cat666

join:2013-04-26
reply to Ghastlyone
said by Ghastlyone:

said by cat666:

I really want to actually try the game myself, but it's a hefty investment for a game my gut is telling me isn't going to stand the test of time.

You haven't even played it yet? You've been talking this whole time as if you've actually invested 10-20 hours in the Beta.

I've said all along I've only watched videos and read reviews, the one beta weekend I could do I didn't find out until late that I was able to do it and by that time the download would have taken the vast majority of the beta weekend.

This topic has been a great place for opinions, people have posted various playthrough videos and my friend took part in one beta. Like me he wasn't sold on GW2 either but did say ESO was better than GW2, but still not good enough to warrant the price if I was on the fence.


Nightfall
My Goal Is To Deny Yours
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join:2001-08-03
Grand Rapids, MI
Reviews:
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said by cat666:

said by Ghastlyone:

said by cat666:

I really want to actually try the game myself, but it's a hefty investment for a game my gut is telling me isn't going to stand the test of time.

You haven't even played it yet? You've been talking this whole time as if you've actually invested 10-20 hours in the Beta.

I've said all along I've only watched videos and read reviews, the one beta weekend I could do I didn't find out until late that I was able to do it and by that time the download would have taken the vast majority of the beta weekend.

This topic has been a great place for opinions, people have posted various playthrough videos and my friend took part in one beta. Like me he wasn't sold on GW2 either but did say ESO was better than GW2, but still not good enough to warrant the price if I was on the fence.

Still helps to play the game in order to have an informed opinion.
--
My domain - Nightfall.net

liquoranne

join:2009-01-14
reply to cat666
I am with Cat on this one. Played this weekends beta, and while the game was enjoyable, I just dont think its worth a sub. Initial cost? no problem. This would be a great filler game for people that raid on WoW or people that like to game hop. With a sub, for most people, that makes it more difficult to justify. Paying 2 monthly subs with limited time spent on various games doesnt make it sensible. Thats my standpoint now. For me to fully swap to ESO they need to offer more than just pvp at "end game", which i think is lacking (from what ive read)


Nightfall
My Goal Is To Deny Yours
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said by liquoranne:

I am with Cat on this one. Played this weekends beta, and while the game was enjoyable, I just dont think its worth a sub. Initial cost? no problem. This would be a great filler game for people that raid on WoW or people that like to game hop. With a sub, for most people, that makes it more difficult to justify. Paying 2 monthly subs with limited time spent on various games doesnt make it sensible. Thats my standpoint now. For me to fully swap to ESO they need to offer more than just pvp at "end game", which i think is lacking (from what ive read)

The 3 faction PvP is what is attractive to me. I didn't get a character up to PvP level, but watching my brother play the PvP over the weekend was a big selling point to me. In fact, just about everything I have read on the PvP in this game has been overwhelmingly positive.

The other thing I love about this game is that you aren't stuck in the same common characters types like in other games. Make a rogue in WoW? Then you are stuck DPSing. Make a Dragon Knight in ESO? You can do anything your hearts desire. The Dragon Knight sorcerer is viable. A archer is viable. A tank is viable. Its great to have that flexibility.

I will say this much, I don't know what PvE is going to be going from 20-50. I can only assume that there will be 3 dungeons per zone, but thats just an assumption.

The long term viability of this game will rest on content updates. The developers are promising updates every month. If they are releasing updates often, then the game will survive easily.
--
My domain - Nightfall.net


cat666

join:2013-04-26
reply to Nightfall
said by Nightfall:

Still helps to play the game in order to have an informed opinion.

I agree, but the price of the full game means it isn't worth the risk if my gut is saying to steer clear.

The fact that there isn't a "free trial" like most MMO's means I can't try before I buy so have to rely on other gamer reviews and gameplay videos. Sadly the vast majority of people are saying it's nothing new and the videos lead me to draw the same conclusions. So until I get to play it, I only have what I can gather from others.


bionicRod
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reply to Nightfall
said by Nightfall:

The other thing I love about this game is that you aren't stuck in the same common characters types like in other games. Make a rogue in WoW? Then you are stuck DPSing. Make a Dragon Knight in ESO? You can do anything your hearts desire. The Dragon Knight sorcerer is viable. A archer is viable. A tank is viable. Its great to have that flexibility.

This is what I really like as well, along with the questing creating a more compelling experience and the combat being more dynamic than other MMOs. Here's a video of a Dragon Knight turned straight up fire mage that does big damage.The sheer number of builds is pretty great.

»www.youtube.com/watch?v=OKlr0Enw-yM

--
The world was movin' she was right there with it and she was


Nightfall
My Goal Is To Deny Yours
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join:2001-08-03
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reply to cat666
said by cat666:

said by Nightfall:

Still helps to play the game in order to have an informed opinion.

I agree, but the price of the full game means it isn't worth the risk if my gut is saying to steer clear.

The fact that there isn't a "free trial" like most MMO's means I can't try before I buy so have to rely on other gamer reviews and gameplay videos. Sadly the vast majority of people are saying it's nothing new and the videos lead me to draw the same conclusions. So until I get to play it, I only have what I can gather from others.

There have been 3 betas so far with at least one more planned before release. I have no idea about a free trial after release, but I would assume one is coming. So to say that there isn't a "free trial" when there have been 3 so far with at least 1 more before release isn't accurate.

While I do agree with most gut instincts, it only appears you are reading negative reviews of the game and taking negative impressions as truth. Part of evaluating a game fairly is looking at both the positive and negative impressions of the game and coming to a conclusion if you are unable to play it.

I have numerous friends who are in the same boat as you are, and they are all up in the air about getting the game. The various reviews and videos they have seen have left both good and bad impressions on them. It really is a shame that they can't play the betas for one reason or another. I think that would swing their impressions towards playing or not for sure.

You can call it a pet peeve of mine, but I just find people who do reviews on games they haven't played to be a bit disingenuous. Especially those that trash the game based on "reviews they have read" as if they are being impartial.
--
My domain - Nightfall.net


Nightfall
My Goal Is To Deny Yours
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reply to bionicRod
said by bionicRod:

This is what I really like as well, along with the questing creating a more compelling experience and the combat being more dynamic than other MMOs. Here's a video of a Dragon Knight turned straight up fire mage that does big damage.The sheer number of builds is pretty great.

I think I am going to go with a sword and shield templar build of some kind with doing healing. I like the idea of being heavily armored, but it doesn't look like that is too viable unless I just want to toss a healing spell every so often. I would love to be a dedicated healer in some situations or a off tank pally like character.

The bummer is that I won't know how viable these builds are until I get a chance to play a lot over level 10.
--
My domain - Nightfall.net


bionicRod
Funkier than a mohair disco ball.
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I am sure there is some way of playing a heavy armor healer with a resto staff. Rely on the staff instead of spells to do your healing maybe? I think (but I am not sure) that all weapon abilities are stamina rather than magic based. I could be wrong though and am largely talking out of my ass because I've never even looked at healing abilities .

I am thinking of going for a templar tank build, also with a sword and board at first, then maybe a resto staff so I can heal myself or a two hander for additional DPS after level 15. It will be fun figuring it out either way.
--
The world was movin' she was right there with it and she was


cat666

join:2013-04-26
reply to Nightfall
said by Nightfall:

There have been 3 betas so far with at least one more planned before release. I have no idea about a free trial after release, but I would assume one is coming. So to say that there isn't a "free trial" when there have been 3 so far with at least 1 more before release isn't accurate.

You can't call betas free trials. The first two were apparantly very unpolished and wouldn't have been a fair representation of the game.

I'm reading all sorts of reviews, people here are raving about the weapon ability system in a positive manner. I take that on board, but I don't like that sort of system so it's not something I'll rate highly. On the flip side people have said how they are disappointed in the graphics (bionicRod I think) yet I think the graphics look very good in the things I have seen.

said by Nightfall:

You can call it a pet peeve of mine, but I just find people who do reviews on games they haven't played to be a bit disingenuous. Especially those that trash the game based on "reviews they have read" as if they are being impartial.

I'm not reviewing anything. I'm just saying that based on the reviews I've read and the videos I've seen that I can't justify the cost on a game which seems to be no different to the rest of the MMO's. I'd rather make sure it's a game I want to play before spending the cash, just like you'd check out reviews and people's opinions on a car before even going for a test drive. The difference is that with a car the test drive is free, with an MMO you don't get the game price back if you don't like it.


bionicRod
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said by cat666:

On the flip side people have said how they are disappointed in the graphics (bionicRod I think) yet I think the graphics look very good in the things I have seen.

Yeah the graphics were a mixed bag in the last beta build, with some areas looking great and others not so much. I didn't know that wasn't the latest game build, so it will be interesting to see if they have added some polish.
--
The world was movin' she was right there with it and she was


Nightfall
My Goal Is To Deny Yours
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join:2001-08-03
Grand Rapids, MI
Reviews:
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said by bionicRod:

said by cat666:

On the flip side people have said how they are disappointed in the graphics (bionicRod I think) yet I think the graphics look very good in the things I have seen.

Yeah the graphics were a mixed bag in the last beta build, with some areas looking great and others not so much. I didn't know that wasn't the latest game build, so it will be interesting to see if they have added some polish.

Polish and bug fixes. I hope that they do something about grouping as well. Grouping is one of the main things I will be doing when the game is released. In its current form, its frustrating.
--
My domain - Nightfall.net


Nightfall
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reply to cat666
said by cat666:

You can't call betas free trials. The first two were apparantly very unpolished and wouldn't have been a fair representation of the game.

I can call the 3rd beta a trial since everyone who wanted a key could get one, but I do agree with you just based on the lack of public keys available.

said by cat666:

I'm not reviewing anything. I'm just saying that based on the reviews I've read and the videos I've seen that I can't justify the cost on a game which seems to be no different to the rest of the MMO's.

Ok, fair enough. I stand corrected in my statement. You are correct that you aren't reviewing the game and just saying that it isn't worth the risk. Sounds reasonable, and I apologize.

At the same time though, I think this game is worth trying out. See if you can get into the next beta period. I will send you a key if that is what you are lacking. If you are lacking time, I can't make that for you.
--
My domain - Nightfall.net


cat666

join:2013-04-26
said by Nightfall:

Ok, fair enough. I stand corrected in my statement. You are correct that you aren't reviewing the game and just saying that it isn't worth the risk. Sounds reasonable, and I apologize.

At the same time though, I think this game is worth trying out. See if you can get into the next beta period. I will send you a key if that is what you are lacking. If you are lacking time, I can't make that for you.

No worries. As you can probably tell I'm really wanting there to be a new "WoW" in my life. I do still enjoy WoW but at the same time I feel I should move on.

I held off on SWTOR as I got bad vibes after the same sort of following, but did play the trial then. In the end I was proved right and SWTOR bombed. I'd love ESO to be a success but yeah, I'm going to have to see how it goes.