dslreports logo
site
 
    All Forums Hot Topics Gallery
spc

spacer




how-to block ads


Search Topic:
uniqs
9659
share rss forum feed

resa1983
Premium
join:2008-03-10
North York, ON
kudos:10

Voltage decision is in

Posted in Broadband because it'll affect all ISPs down the road.

»Voltage vs Teksavvy decision
--
Battle.net Tech Support MVP


Optional

join:2012-02-26
Mississauga, ON
LOL.

Thanks judge, for opening the doors to a feeding frenzy for copyright trolls.


HiVolt
Premium
join:2000-12-28
Toronto, ON
kudos:21
Reviews:
·TekSavvy DSL
·TekSavvy Cable

1 recommendation

said by Optional:

LOL.

Thanks judge, for opening the doors to a feeding frenzy for copyright trolls.

Its exactly what is not going to happen, if you read Ressy's summary.
--



Optional

join:2012-02-26
Mississauga, ON
So what, the people who got targeted by Voltage will just get angry letters?


Guspaz
Guspaz
Premium,MVM
join:2001-11-05
Montreal, QC
kudos:23
reply to resa1983
That and they can sue defendants, although it doesn't sound like they'd be allowed to sue all of them in a single proceeding.
--
Latest version of CapSavvy systray usage checker: »CapSavvy v4.2 released!


mike0z

@teksavvy.com
reply to Optional
whatever happened to "cease and desist" Also, with the cap on copyright infringement at $5000 (and i think i read in an earlier article that in all reality one time infringes who are brought to court would only end up paying a few hundred if that) combined with voltage having to pay all TSI's legal costs, doesn't it end up being kind of a waste of time for them? Especially if they cant blatantly Lie and threaten in their letters..

resa1983
Premium
join:2008-03-10
North York, ON
kudos:10
said by mike0z :

whatever happened to "cease and desist" Also, with the cap on copyright infringement at $5000 (and i think i read in an earlier article that in all reality one time infringes who are brought to court would only end up paying a few hundred if that) combined with voltage having to pay all TSI's legal costs, doesn't it end up being kind of a waste of time for them? Especially if they cant blatantly Lie and threaten in their letters..

Ding ding ding.
--
Battle.net Tech Support MVP

abcjak

join:2012-12-18
so i guess the next step for Voltage *should* be to pay up and get the names of those 1000 (or whatever) TSI customers they originally asked for who were accused of downloading a crappy steven seagal (?) movie. Let's see if they go ahead with it. What was the cost of each name search? was it around $100?


TOPDAWG
Premium
join:2005-04-27
Calgary, AB
kudos:3
reply to resa1983
I look at it this way I pirate I'm not going to lie and I pirate a lot but if you're dumb enough to get busted don't ask me to pity you if you have to pay a fine.

Ree

join:2007-04-29
h0h0h0
kudos:1
Reviews:
·Start Communicat..
reply to abcjak
said by abcjak:

so i guess the next step for Voltage *should* be to pay up and get the names of those 1000 (or whatever) TSI customers they originally asked for who were accused of downloading a crappy steven seagal (?) movie. Let's see if they go ahead with it. What was the cost of each name search? was it around $100?

Their next step *should* be to walk away and pretend it never happened. Just to get the names from Teksavvy will require an up front payment of hundreds of thousands of dollars. I don't see how they can recover that, let alone make a profit, with the conditions that were placed on them.

voxframe

join:2010-08-02
reply to resa1983
I wonder what kind of "Administration Fees" TSI can slap onto their bill for their "trouble" to hunt it down. May as well assemble a team of 100 people with a 5 year contract to head up these ruthless lawbreakers. Send the bill to Voltage if they wish to proceed. Something tells me it won't move.

jdoe71

join:2008-02-07
L0L0L0
Reviews:
·voip.ms
reply to TOPDAWG
said by TOPDAWG:

I look at it this way I pirate I'm not going to lie and I pirate a lot but if you're dumb enough to get busted don't ask me to pity you if you have to pay a fine.

That sword cuts two ways. I guess if you get busted and have to pay a fine we won't pity you either. I suppose you're saying you're too smart or whatever to get busted. I wonder how many people have thought that and found out otherwise. The road to ruin is paved with the ashes of fools.

Willectro

join:2013-02-09
reply to resa1983
I'm just worried about any precedents from this. I still find it very gutless that Voltage decided to pursue TS customers as they knew Rogers/Bell legal teams would nuke this shit from orbit.

resa1983
Premium
join:2008-03-10
North York, ON
kudos:10
said by Willectro:

I'm just worried about any precedents from this. I still find it very gutless that Voltage decided to pursue TS customers as they knew Rogers/Bell legal teams would nuke this shit from orbit.

Um, Rogers and Bell wouldn't nuke a suit like this at all. In fact, they wrote a letter to the Judge in an earlier NGN case, saying they had no intentions of intervening or objecting on their customers' behalves.
--
Battle.net Tech Support MVP

Willectro

join:2013-02-09
So why just TS then?

resa1983
Premium
join:2008-03-10
North York, ON
kudos:10
said by Willectro:

So why just TS then?

Test case for going after TPIA?
--
Battle.net Tech Support MVP


TSI Marc
Premium,VIP
join:2006-06-23
Chatham, ON
kudos:28
Press release: »Voltage vs. Doe decision - TekSavvy press release
--
Marc - CEO/TekSavvy

Smart86

join:2013-08-11
North York, ON
reply to resa1983
Stupid question but how can they tell what you're downloading ?

buttaknife

join:2007-06-01
said by Smart86:

Stupid question but how can they tell what you're downloading ?

If you are connect in a bittorrent swarm, for example, they will be able to see the peer's IP. I don't know all the technicals of it but that's pretty much that.

This decision definitely sucks but I imagine they likely won't get too far aside from this because there are other precedents (at least in the US) that the IP doesn't necessarily mean a person did it.

But they will probably try to scare some people into paying a fee.


Buster Brown

@videotron.ca
reply to Willectro
said by Willectro:

So why just TS then?

It wasn't just TSI in the last year or so.

It was Bell, Rogers, Videotron and Distributel as far as I can recall.

In these cases those 4 entities just said yeah we won't challenge anything, just give us a court order and we will let you know who these people are.

Distributel back-tracked and then put up a fight and the troll ran away and dropped the case.

The Montreal cases were also dropped.

This left the Ontario cases, and I heard nothing about it since. I think these people got extortion letters. But not sure what happened after that.

Then they went after TSI.

While the above involved Voltage and another company in BC, as can be seen, it wasn't just TSI. I think you can find the info in the Canadian broadband forum for these cases if you use the search term "recoil" and "Montreal Canadians" (I did some DNS's on the IP's and found out they were going to sue the Montreal Canadians).

Nope... Not only TSI.

resa1983
Premium
join:2008-03-10
North York, ON
kudos:10
Searching for "NGN" should bring it up.
--
Battle.net Tech Support MVP

Sanek

join:2006-08-10
Kanata, ON
reply to resa1983
CBC article on the subject is a good summary (I think):
»www.cbc.ca/news/technology/teksa···.2546477

They will get the addresses, but anything they send to you has to go through a case management judge first to ensure there is no trolling. Also to quote the judge: "Any correspondence sent by Voltage to any subscriber shall clearly state in bold type that no court has yet made a determination that such subscriber has infringed or is liable in any way for payment of damages."

It is unlikely that someone will be fined on the high-end of the $5000 maximum fine, and they will have to get Teksavvy involved to prove that you did anything wrong (as I understand) - and pay them. I think after all these expenses, it is probably unlikely they will get any money out of this, unless people decide to settle.

Smart86

join:2013-08-11
North York, ON
reply to buttaknife
Ok, but even if they see you are downloading something , how can they tell its a movie? Do people actually download a movie with the exact file name of the movie ? I'm just curious to know . I never used any torrent before .


mike0z

@teksavvy.com
i think they released a copy of the movie themselves online to the torrent sites, and then waited for people to connect. I'm not sure if they monitored only downloaders or uploaders or both.

Unfortunately people will continue to download crappy steven segal movies and companies like canpire will be logging ip's constantly waiting for the day a judge gets paid enough to strike down the safeguards to prevent trolling.

vincom

join:2009-03-06
Bolton, ON
kudos:1
reply to resa1983
double post, deleted


vincom

join:2009-03-06
Bolton, ON
kudos:1
Reviews:
·Anveo
·TekSavvy Cable
reply to resa1983
excuses im going to give in court, havent decided which one yet:

my wifi router was hacked at the time of infringement, probably by the Chinese or nsa.

i have Alzheimers and i have to use "password" as my password or else i forget, hence some one logged into to my router.

didnt know i had to set a password on my router



TSI Marc
Premium,VIP
join:2006-06-23
Chatham, ON
kudos:28


mike0z

@teksavvy.com
reply to vincom
excuses are one thing, but then there are those who are legitimately victims of wifi theft. I was in my friends apartment a few weeks back and i was amazed to find at least 6 open wifi networks with a strong signal on my phone...i'm sure with better hardware you could pull in a dozen of them. I mean even if those people had their own connections, their device may default to an open wifi network with a better signal without them even knowing, and i guarantee there are plenty of cheap-skates who don't even have a connection of their own. Even if it is password protected, how good is the password? did you use your phone number? did you use WEP? hardly secure in most cases.

Smart86

join:2013-08-11
North York, ON

1 edit
reply to vincom
That's what I was thinking , " what if "... I can't see how the courts would go after someone . People will come out with all types of stories , the courts would be so jammed with all kinds of stories with legit reasons ...

Here is an example ... I take my laptop to a Tim's Horton and use their free open wifi . Now I didn't notice but someone there has hacked into my laptop and some how got my personal data information , like my passwords . Now back at my home not knowing anything my internet uses has been used and the person whom has used my internet has downloaded lots of illegal material . Would it still be my fault when I didn't know . Or how about how corrupt the world is becoming , gangs are everywhere nowadays . Lets say a organized gang wanted to screw you over and they hack your internet connections . There just to many things that could go wrong if the courts every decided to go after someone

Ree

join:2007-04-29
h0h0h0
kudos:1
Reviews:
·Start Communicat..
reply to Smart86
said by Smart86:

Ok, but even if they see you are downloading something , how can they tell its a movie? Do people actually download a movie with the exact file name of the movie ? I'm just curious to know . I never used any torrent before .

They join the same swarm you're in and keep track of who they're able to download pieces from. They claim to verify that the pieces received are legitimate pieces of the copyrighted work, so for example someone who writes a rogue bittorrent client that sends random junk to their monitoring program shouldn't be identified as an infringer since they're just distributing random junk, and not pieces of the movie.

So it's not so much that they can tell you're downloading something, it's that they can tell you're distributing something. That's the part they REALLY hate.