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zeke56
join:2009-03-22
Naperville, IL

zeke56

Member

Filter to block WOW internet signal from cable segment w/ OTA TV?

I just switched to WOW internet (30Mb/s level in Naperville) from DSL. I also need MoCA and OTA TV going to my basement over one cable segment. The MoCA and OTA coexist well, as do the MoCA and cable internet, but unfortunately the cable internet interferes with my OTA signal (not not the other way around apparently). Is there an appropriate filter I can use to block just the cable internet frequencies and pass the others?
thanks

mix
join:2002-03-19
Romeo, MI

mix

Member

What specifically is keeping the OTA signals you are introducing into the cable tv system from back feeding and screwing up your neighbors service?

atcotr
@wideopenwest.com

atcotr to zeke56

Anon

to zeke56
You're doing it very wrong. Never tie in an antenna into a line connected to a CATV system. You are introducing a lot of noise into the CATV system, and allowing lots of CATV signals to leak out. MOCA and CATV can co-exist on the same coaxial segments, but always use a separate line for OTA signals. (Plus, why not just watch the OTA channels as they are rebroadcaston CATV?)
zeke56
join:2009-03-22
Naperville, IL

zeke56

Member

Well, I don't have cable tv, I have cable internet. I assumed that tv was blocked from getting into my house (and out). But maybe that's wrong. If so it would explain what I'm seeing - interference on every channel. So I gather the cable system is one gigantic shared medium? So all my transmitted data, including my MoCA traffic, is available to anyone in a wide area who has a cable into their house? I never had cable internet before, so I never thought of it that way. That's something to think about.
lesmikesell
join:2013-06-10
Mount Prospect, IL

lesmikesell

Member

Why does cable internet need to traverse the same cable? Put the cablemodem where it enters the house and only connect the MOCA adapter to your house cable and it will co-exist with OTA.
zeke56
join:2009-03-22
Naperville, IL

zeke56

Member

Well, there is basically one cable in the house w/ the entrance into the house at an inconvenient location where it tees off to the two ends. I can also tap into it at one point with the antenna cable.

I think what I probably need is a "data only" filter that providers apparently use to filter out cable tv signals for data only customers, which I assumed was the default. I ordered one from ebay. I think I also might also want a low-pass filter at the entrance of the cable to my house to block the MoCA signal from leaving. I'm far from sure about these conclusions, as I continue to read up on this subject.
lesmikesell
join:2013-06-10
Mount Prospect, IL

lesmikesell

Member

Is there really any difference in the channel(s) that go to the cablemodem vs. the ones carrying TV? I thought that was sort of arbitrary. MOCA is intentionally designed not to conflict, though. I think figuring out how to put the cablemodem in that 'inconvenient' location or pulling a separate cable to a place where you can put it would be a better solution. You probably could have asked for a new entrance connection as part of your install.

mix
join:2002-03-19
Romeo, MI
GL.iNet GL-B1300
Netgear CM500

mix to zeke56

Member

to zeke56
Depending on what traps/filters are installed (or the lack thereof) you are not far off. If you are using MoCA on a cable line with cable or internet service, you should have a MoCA point of entry filter installed.

The correct way to do this is to just separate the cable modem from everything else. Where the cable tv drop enters your home, simply run a single coax cable to the modem. You can put the modem almost anywhere and run a new cable to it, assuming you are using wifi to access the internet.

Keep your OTA and MoCA network separate from the cable tv/internet service.
zeke56
join:2009-03-22
Naperville, IL

zeke56 to lesmikesell

Member

to lesmikesell
lesmikesell, thanks for the comments. The problem isn't MoCA, I've been using that for years w/ my DSL. The problem appears to be the unexpected (by me anyway) presence of the cable tv signals, which are in the same frequency range as the OTA signals. I ordered a filter that should block the frequency range from 52-700MHz I believe ($3.95 solution!) where I need it. They are in a different frequency range from the modem signal. I'm not sure if I need to worry about 700+MHz ota signals getting back into the cable system. I will have to sort that out I guess. I'm still learning about this stuff.

"Inconvenient" means a spot w/ no nearby power and two floors away from the office housing my router, several pcs, wireless access point, phone ata, printer, etc. Moving the modem to the basement would entail pulling ethernet cable from the basement to the second floor (or moving everything to the basement). If I'm going to the trouble of doing that, I would install ethernet cable from my office to the location in the basement where my other networked equipment is located. That way I would eliminate the MoCA and have full gigabit speed over the entire local network.
lesmikesell
join:2013-06-10
Mount Prospect, IL

lesmikesell

Member

I thought the channels for cable tv vs. cable modem were pretty arbitrary. However, if you actually have cable TV signals coming in, do you really need your OTA feed? In my area, all of the local feeds are on the cable anyway - just shifted to different channels.
zeke56
join:2009-03-22
Naperville, IL

zeke56

Member

lesmikesell:
I don't really know if some local broadcast channels might be on the cable in an unscrambled form. WOW has a product they call limited cable that contains mainly those, so I would guess not. The OTA signals are uncompressed, and I can get all the subchannels that don't seem to be there in the cable channel lineups.

mlx:
I hadn't really thought of using a wireless link from modem to router, and I don't have the equipment for that. I have not really been impressed with the real perfomance of wireless, especially consistency of performance, and would tend to not want to depend on that sort of set up.

atcotr
@wideopenwest.com

atcotr

Anon

Unfortunately you won't be able to have OTA and CATV segments interconnected, even with a barrel filter. OTA is 470-698 MHz (700-800 MHz is cellular now). CATV channels & DOCSIS channels are 50-870 MHz (sometimes only 750 MHz). Try connecting the cable into the back of your TV and scan for local channels, WOW is one of the few service providers that hasn't gone encryption crazy.
uteck
join:2009-12-30
Elgin, IL

uteck to zeke56

Member

to zeke56
I have internet only, as do my friends down the road, and we both still get basic cable SD channels plus the local Chicago stations in HD, but then we did downgrade so that might make a difference. They are unencrypted and just need a normal QAM tuner to receive.
zeke56
join:2009-03-22
Naperville, IL

zeke56

Member

Are the subchannels of the OTA stations on the cable?
uteck
join:2009-12-30
Elgin, IL

uteck

Member

Not all of them, just the ones they normally carry. Don't have the subchannels for 11, but do for 5,7,and 9. Not sure if 2 has one or not, but it is 1080 were the others are only 720.