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Anon333
@129.97.108.x

Anon333

Anon

Canucks' ISPs routing data through snoop heaven USA

Saw this article, I wanted to ask how TekSavvy can improve the routing issues discussed here?

»www.theregister.co.uk/20 ··· _opaque/

petermdodge
join:2014-03-31
Canada

petermdodge

Member

Well, to be honest, I don't think avoiding routing through the states is entirely feasible, but I do think it'd be a good idea to have options available for alternate routes. I don't know how feasible it would be though.

TSI Gabe
Router of Packets
Premium Member
join:2007-01-03
Gatineau, QC

TSI Gabe to Anon333

Premium Member

to Anon333
The article is a bit out of touch as there are a few more exchange points now...and OttIX is one of the very small ones.

As you can see we in fact scored highest in the paper and I believe that they erred on a few points that we do disclose.

Fairly recently (started about 2 years ago) CIRA has been pushing and helping to open up new IXPs. As an example QIX was opened recently with the help of CIRA, RISQ and Google (and a few more). We have been very actively helping with the creation of this IX (and we also peer there).

We also peer in Vancouver and Toronto and actively try to peer with whoever will peer with us.

martyb1
join:2013-05-18
Wemindji, QC

martyb1 to Anon333

Member

to Anon333
how can TSI "improve" the hyperbole in that article? Bottom line is they can't.

Only "improvement" possible would be to have Bell, TELUS, Videotron and other "major" Canadian ISPs peer at exchanges. But they don't because they would rather try and sell transit than have a shorter network path.

So other than not routing traffic to American carriers when they don't have an IX route (maybe they could let you opt-out of any network paths you don't appreciate?) which would be stupid, there isn't really alot they can do.

Personally I have tried to find more in depth data about that "study", I am not really in agreement with the metrics they seem to have defined.

3.5 out of 10 stars. Sounds terrible, but the people who did this "study" are the ones that decided what is good and what is not, based on what seems to be academic and not real-world criteria.

This notion of boomerang makes it sound like its deliberate, which it isn't. When you are a network operator and you have to forward traffic to a destination that your customer asked you to, if you don't have a direct peering relationship with that destination network, who do you hand off the traffic to? And should you drop that request based on the fact that it has to go to an American-owned network operator? As a TSI customer, that probably wouldn't fly. And even if you were to hand it off to a Canadian-based operator, he will eventually have to hand it to an American operator, or European/Asian one. This idea that an ISP has to be transparent about how traffic is handled when it is not local and off his network is particularily stupid.

Anon333
@129.97.108.x

Anon333

Anon

said by TSI Gabe:

The article is a bit out of touch as there are a few more exchange points now...and OttIX is one of the very small ones.

So given the extra exchange points is it more likely data destined for Canadians is staying within Canada?
said by TSI Gabe:

We also peer in Vancouver and Toronto and actively try to peer with whoever will peer with us.

What sort of diligence performed before peering with another IXP?
said by martyb1:

So other than not routing traffic to American carriers when they don't have an IX route (maybe they could let you opt-out of any network paths you don't appreciate?) which would be stupid, there isn't really alot they can do.

Given what's been disclosed by the NSA and other organizations I don't think it's stupid to at least give us the option when both the origin and destination of the traffic is within Canada.

I think this could be a good opportunity for TekSavvy to really separate themselves from other ISP's by becoming a real leader in the transparency of data for Canadians.

martyb1
join:2013-05-18
Wemindji, QC

martyb1

Member

said by Anon333 :

said by martyb1:

So other than not routing traffic to American carriers when they don't have an IX route (maybe they could let you opt-out of any network paths you don't appreciate?) which would be stupid, there isn't really alot they can do.

Given what's been disclosed by the NSA and other organizations I don't think it's stupid to at least give us the option when both the origin and destination of the traffic is within Canada.

I think this could be a good opportunity for TekSavvy to really separate themselves from other ISP's by becoming a real leader in the transparency of data for Canadians.

so you would opt-out of being able to talk to AS577 simply because TSI has to go through the US to get to it? That would get old fast.

And how do you suggest an ISP would react in the case that their connection to an IX goes down? Would they have to advise their entire customerbase that to go to order pay-per-view movies on their Bell FibeTV service, the traffic needs to transit via the US in order to do so? And before the customers agree, they should be blocked from accessing Canadian sites that, for technical reasons, have to be reached via a US carrier? Good luck with that plan.

And FYI, according to this "study", TSI already is the beacon of transparency in Canada. However, it is not _enough_ transparency according to the thinly-veiled politicized reason to be of this "study".