Canadian Broadband → VMedia Installation failures.

okay, just to be fair, VMedia is not in control of much of the installation process, so while I'm going to provide full details keep in mind that some of this is not directly attributable to VMedia.

Summary: fair communications pre-sales, pre-install. Very poor communications post-install (after post-install failure.) Currently problem has been escalated to Rogers so probably a few days before I can possibly get any resolution. VMedia support is basically just a couple of mostly untrained people telling you to wait two hours and try again .. until you get frustrated enough to demand they escalate the problem to someone who can fix the problem (ie: upstreams providers.)

I'm finding that unless you keep on top of these support people they tend to do little to nothing, and only when you force the issue will they start to actually provide real support rather than try to push you off by asking you to 'wait for a few more hours' (I'm used to techsavvy support, where every time I called in with a problem they would immediately start the troubleshooting process ... TSI would look at the line status and be able to tell me the status of my connection and take real steps to address the problem, whereas VMedia seems to have no access to line information at all, so their first response is 'wait X hours and try again', hoping that the problem will fix itself.

Pre-Sales: have a friend who uses their Internet services who said he was satisfied. Checked out an IPTV demo at Canada computers, and everything seemed good enough for my needs, so decided to pull the trigger and ordered from CC.

Pre-Install: Took a while before they got back to me on the install date, which was the latest option I selected from the '3 preferred dates'. I actually went to the online chat several days after ordering to see if they had received my order ... they said it still in process, but that very day I received an email with the installation date, so I suspect that my chat session spurred them on to get an update with Rogers.

I also had a few pre-install questions (to make sure the install went through with the least chance of being messed up) that were answered fairly quickly. The biggest question was 'could my TSI cable and VMedia cable services co-exist so that in the case of a VMedia installation failure I would not have to wait days for Internet services, and I could just plug my old TSI modem back in and continue on while I waited ... the answer from VMedia was that this was OK, just let the Rogers tech know when he was doing the install (which I did, and who seemed totally unconcerned about.)

So, installation day comes, the Rogers tech does his thing and I plug in the VMedia cable modem(SB6141) .. the Rogers tech shows me his status page on his laptop is all green, the modem shows that I have Bonded upstream and downstream connections, and the Internet icon is glowing green, all which I assumed was a good sign ... so the Rogers tech left, saying that if there were any connection problems it had to be on the VMedia side and contact them if I was unable to connect.

So, sure enough, I plug in my router and no Internet access .. same thing going directly to the laptop, no Internet.

So put opened a chat to VMedia asking to confirm my service was activated ... the response was wait two hours and try again.

Two hours later, still no service, so this time I called in. Was told to wait 3 more hours and try again, and that he would call me back between 5 and 7pm to confirm my status and look into the issue further if there was still no service

Three hours later, still no Internet, waited till after 7pm and no return call either .... so I try to call in again to the support line. The message system told me wait times were averaging two minutes ... twenty five minutes later I gave up on the support line and called back to the customer service line ... was told basically that all the techs were busy and that I'd have to call back tomorrow ... I explained that I was promised a call back between 5 & 7, so in theory I should already be talking to a tech, and that this was unacceptable ... the costumer service guy tried to help me, but he was just reading from a script for Windows/Mac, and when I mentioned I was running Linux (I don't allow virus' and bots on my network, so no Windows, and Mac is not my style, I own my computers, not Apple) he sort of froze and ran off to talk to a technician (not that that would have mattered much, as the tech I had been dealing with seemed to be no more computer literate than the customer service guy.)

Anyway I gave up on the customer service guy as all he could really do is open a ticket anyway, so I left assuming that was the end of it for the day, but letting them know I was not at all pleased with their support service ... a few minutes later I received a call from the VMedia tech I had originally spoke to .. he apologized for not calling back saying he was busy ... okay, so we start the troubleshooting process with the 'tech' ... turns out he's also just reading from a script (pinging/tracert local host, google, screenshots of modem support pages, etc) and he too is not 'trained' to deal with Linux. I try to explain that Linux is not dissimilar to Mac, and just tell me what info he wants and I'll do the 'translation' and provide it ... still he's not comfortable with doing this so we agree that he can just email me the check list and I'll email him back the screenshots, and first thing in the morning he will check his mail and get back to me.

So, I gather the info and email it to him --- 11am next morning, no word from the VMedia tech, so I call in, and get the message system saying an expected 10 minute wait ... oh oh, but this time in about 15 minutes I was connected, and it was the same tech I had been talking to last night ... anyway, he had not even seen my email as yet, so I have him open the email to make sure he was satisfied that I had provided the necessary information ... so let's start troubleshooting? No, he's opening a ticket to Rogers, expected response of 48 to 72 hours.

--- so, that's where I am now .. pretty sure that 72 hours will come and go and I'll have to call back (probably due to Rogers dragging their feet, and VMedia support not following up, if experience means anything.)

Bottom line: I'm damn glad I decided to keep my old services around until I could confirm a working VMedia installation.

I'm sure most of their installations go off without a hitch, but in all my switching back and forth between ISPs (been with probably 5 different ones, a couple of them more than once, in the last 15 years or so) this has been by far the worst installation experience ... I understand that the business model here means that support is an extra step or two away from the people who actually do the real troubleshooting and fixing of problems, so it's not completely VMedia's fault, but prospective customers need to understand that if things don't go well, or they have an issue with service latter on, they can expect very poor support from VMedia ... just a bunch of people trying to delay you as long as possible and then finally reading off of script to gather enough information to send it off to the upstream provider and hope for the best.

We shall see how this goes ... I signed up for this because a friend who uses this service is satisfied (but he's had no problems yet so he's not had the pleasure of dealing with VMedia's support department in times of trouble) and I am a big fan of George's and all he's done in general to protect the customer against the 'big few' monopolies, so I'm not going to go with my gut feeling and cut my losses and cancel my as yet not working VMedia account, and hope that this is all just a matter of growing pains, but really, VMdeia needs to figure out a way to have their support team be more than a bunch of script readers, otherwise just post the troubleshooting steps on a web page (and send a hard copy to all your customers) so VMedia can save money and the customer can skip the frustration of being told "just wait for a couple of hours and try again' over and over again until you get frustrated enough to tell them "stop giving me the run around and start doing some real support".

You might being a little too unfair with calling VMedia's technical support "untrained script readers". Some of steps you said they asked you gather are actually valid when it comes to troubleshooting a third party cable connection.

Also you compare that TSI before could check your line stats, I am going to assume you went from DSL to Cable (you mentioned Rogers). There is no line tool available to third party ISPs offering cable internet service from the respective cable network providers. There's nothing for a support rep to read on their end, at best they can see if you have an IP address assigned or not.

Also, Rogers' ticket process for a TPIA is notorious for simply just being a form that has to be filled out entirely & accurately or the ticket is rejected.

You mention your SB6141 has solid downstream & upstream lights that indicated a bonded channel configuration, is the Online (world globe-ish symbol) also solidly lit as well?

If this is the case, the installer did complete his job, you have full synchronization.

Your issue may be 1 of 2 scenarios:

* DHCP issue
* Modem is not provisioned

There is very easy to way to tell what the case is.

Although what you'll first want to do (if not already) is factory reset the modem.

Plug your computer direct to the modem and make sure the NIC is set to DHCP.

Check what IP address is assigned.

If it's 169.254.*.*, you've got a DHCP issue, a DHCP ticket needs to be created.

If it's 10.*.*.* , you're modem hasn't been provisioned. The first thing you want to check with VMedia is to make sure the MAC and Customer S/N on your modem matches what they have.

If it does, a provisioning ticket is required, if not, VMedia will have to correct the information (it won't be instant though).

I agree with what TypeS says. I had similar problems with my VMedia installation. Using a laptop directly connected to the modem while the installer was present worked great. I was even able to load web pages from google.com. When I replaced the laptop with a router, it would not give it an IP address - even though I had done an >ipconfig /release on the laptop before disconnecting it. After several fruitless modem power cycles and router resets, I did a factory reset of the modem and it immediately gave the router an IP address. I didn't need to call VMedia.

Maybe just a coincidence? But still worth giving it a try.

You're correct about switching from DSL to cable (with DSL I was down about once a month, with Bell coming in to the building to do an install or deinstall and breaking other connections in the process .. then finally, the one time I couldn't stay home to supervise what they were doing, charged me $100 for a 'customer side' problem.) I've had no issues with Cable in the two years or so years I've had it, so I just assumed they had the same information as they had with DSL.

But I don't think I'm unfair in calling VMedia support "script readers" (or maybe I just got the one tech who happened to be under-trained?) ... I'm not saying that the scripts are not valuable, but their first response (and second and third response as well) was to put me off, telling me twice to wait and see if it fixes itself .. till finally, only after I got pissed off and demanded that I not be given the run around, did they start the 'script reading'.

Even then though, when I called in the second time I tried to impress on them the information I had found with my own troubleshooting .. which was as you suggested above, to reset the modem to factory defaults (had to do this with Techsavvy with their original Cable install, but that was a simple call to tech support where the first thing they did was have me reset the modem and it worked like a charm thereafter,) set the laptop to DHCP and see what happens .. and what happened was that I go an address of 192.168.100.50/24 gateway 192.168.100.1.

Now, I did not know what exactly that meant, but I suspected that since I was connected and all the lights were as expected (and yes the Online, "world glob-ish symbol' is solid green) that it was likely something to do with my modem not being registered properly with Rogers or VMedia ... but as hard as I tried to impress upon them this information as to the status of my modem lights, and DHCP results, they seemed to be almost actively rejecting this information as not important ... so rather than being unfair in calling them 'script readers', I think this just enforces my opinion of them, since not a single bit of information they gathered went beyond what was from the script that they emailed me to gather for them (as they had no understanding of what Linux was.)

Now, granted, the information I provided does have the modem's MAC address (not sure about customer S/N) so maybe the Rogers techs will be able to fix the problem with no input from VMedia 'techs', but I'm not confident that I won't get a call in 3 days asking me to look up my 'customer S/N' and being told that they will reopen a ticket to Rogers and get back to me in another 48 to 72 hours.

But thanks for the information TypeS, at least now I have a better understanding of what might be happening .. which is what I would have expected from VMedia in the first place,

All that said, I'm really pulling for VMedia ... as I said, I respect George, and really want a lot more competition in the Internet/TV market .... so I'm sticking with them for as long as I can stand their support department ... but I really think they are playing a game of Russian Roulette with their current support setup.

I imagine that these two scenarios are very common when signing up!

The tech support should be able to determine either of these during a 15 minute call.

It should not take a post on some forum for people to figure out what's going on.

It seems every other thread is about bad support a butchered install related with VMEDIA..

maybe it is time they take a look at their support staff and see what is going on.

It takes George to come read these posts and do follow ups etc.

I don't think it is fair for the user and Or George to be chasing things down.

The reason the support agent told you to wait for 2 hours is that the install order needs to be marked as completed by the Rogers contracted technician, sometimes they don't do this until after they complete their days work.

Well, I will give you that, being told to wait three times isn't a good response when you're looking for help.

The first time you were told to wait may have been valid, as chall2k56 said, sometimes Rogers tech wait til the end of an install slot or shift to sign off on a bunch of orders.

Best of luck getting it resolved and online.

As an update, around 1 this afternoon I gave the new connection a try again ... plugged the laptop into the Modem, connected the Cable to the modem and powered up ... low and behold, the laptop DHCP showed I received a real IP address (24.something instead of the old 192.168.100.10 nonsense.)

So, great, I'll just unplug my laptop and plug in the router and all should be good .... NOPE, the router would be given only a 192.168.100.10 address.

Okay, so maybe I need to reset the modem to defaults, wait 5 minutes, and restart the modem with the router connected ... nope, still the same problem, modem gets 192.168.100.10, and switching over to the laptop gives me a valid address that allows my laptop to connect to the Internet.

Alright, so I'll call VMedia support and see if they can suggest what to do next (and to find out why they didn't call me like they promised when Rogers fixed the problem?)

Anyway, before I called, I unplugged everything from the modem and shut it off ... total off time (my phone showed 29 minutes since the start of the call) was at least 30 minutes.

On the phone with the tech I followed their steps ... powered up the router, plugged it into the modem, attached the cable to the modem and powered on the modem .... still got a 192.168.100.10 address ... switched over to the laptop and easily got a valid 24.x.x.x address and access to the Internet.

She asks if I have another laptop to try; which I do, but plugging this laptop into the modem results in no IP address at all (I suspect the Modem, which says there is a limit of two IP addresses, really means what it says, so I don't worry too much about this result.)

Okay, so the tech says that Rogers probably has not completely fixed the problem (which she explains is probably why their ticket was not updated and why VMedia didn't call ... ok, reasonable enough I guess.)

Anyway, she suggests I wait till tomorrow and try again ... so what else can I do at the moment? Nothing, so I say ok, thank her for her efforts and leave the call.

Anyway, after I got off the phone I decided that maybe if I clone the IP address of my laptop Ethernet to the Router WAN Ethernet interface, I could trick the modem into handing out the real IP address to the router rather than my laptop ( I usually use my wireless connection anyway on the laptop so no big deal for now.)

So, I clone the WAN IP to my Laptop MAC address and try again ... shut everything down and restart, but no, the modem still only gets a 192.168.100.10 address ... strange ... so I reset everything on the modem, restart everything again, but this time all I can get from any Ethernet connection is 192.168.100.10, even my laptop.

--- one would think that something like this would be one of the easiest and most well known processes to complete in the communications industry ... why why why is this so F|_|(ked up?

Is there any possibility at all that something on the "Rogers side of the equation' could be holding onto the MAC address of Customer side of the Modem, capable of telling the difference between the real IP address and a cloned IP address, and not releasing the IP address believing that my laptop is the router and refusing to let it go?

Anyway, going to give it another try around 8ish, which gives the system a good 5 hours and more to reset itself .. this time start with the router attached to the modem.

Anyone else have any ideas on what is happening and how to fix it? Seems to me that it would take a special kind of mus-configuration for what I'm seeing to be a simple config mistake?

That's the same thing that drove me nuts with a Thompson modem when I got my VMedia installed. Having successfully connected it to a laptop to verify the modem stats while the installer was present, he phoned in the ticket completion and my modem got a 'real' IP address within a minute or so; the laptop was able to browse the web. I did ipconfig /release on the laptop. and plugged the modem's Ethernet cable into a Dlink WBR2310 router that I had spare. No external IP address was given for that. After multiple power resets on the modem, I did a factory default reset, and then the modem provided a valid IP to my router.

Each modem may have a different factory reset process. Are you sure you did it correctly for your modem?

I can't explain why the MAC clone didn't work. I don't believe that any equipment can tell the difference from a cloned MAC.

I believe that the 192.168.100.xx is given when there's no signal on the cable side. Are you sure that the connections are tight?

What exactly do you mean by cloning the "IP address"?

Did you attempt to statically assign the address your laptop's Ethernet NIC got to the routers WAN port?

Or do you mean that you cloned the MAC address?

If the former or something else entirely, undo it.

If your laptop is getting an IP address but your router is not, that's a MAC address lock. Just clone the MAC address of your laptop's NIC to the router. If its a typical SoHo router, there be option to have the router do that for you.

What make & model router do you have?

Sorry, typo, yes I cloned the MAC address of the laptop (that worked) to the router WAN interface (that didn't.)

Router is a Linksys WRT54GL running DD-WRT
Modem is a Motorola SB6141

I reset the modem using the Modem's HTML interface .. clicked the 'reset defaults' link, waited 5 minutes and restarted the modem.

Coax needs to be removed from Motorola's or the factory reset does nothing.

So after a 5 hour wait with the modem powered off and no cable attached I tried again.

Started with the router attached and it's real MAC address (192.168.100.10 address received)

Reset the modem and tried again, same result.

Cloned my Laptop MAC to the router WAN interface (192.168.100.10)

Connected my laptop directly to the modem (192.168.100.10)

So looks like whatever little bit of fixing was done to allow me to get a real IP from my laptop for a few minutes has been undone.

I'm not expecting this is going to go well given the results so far ... one would expect that this kind of process would be so well understood and documented (both from the side of the incumbent and the TPIA) that this kind of BS would never happen .. but I guess you can never underestimate the power of greed (the incumbent wanting to make the process as painful as possible to discourage moving, and the TPIA only interested n getting people to sign up and believing the customer will stick through the process to prevent even more pain and grieve and loss of initial one time investments switching back) to cause bad intentions and corner cutting.

Thanks Calero27 - I'll try that tonight when I get home. Funny how VMedia tech support doesn't inform me of these kinds of things? Malicious or not suitably trained? --- and yes, I'm suggesting the latter.

I've never heard of the needing to unplug the coaxial cable from the modem to have to reset it before, and if you ask any of the other TPIA providers on these forums, I doubt they have either. I don't think that's a training issue but just my 2 cents.

ok. I'll take your word for it (as you're the closest thing I've had to actual support though this whole thing ... I'll probably ask that VMedia send you the money they are paying what passes for a support team there now.)

Just ended a chat session with one of their support people. The review of my ticket he gave me seems to suggest that they have inaccurate information in the ticket, so I asked to be given the details so I can confirm the information is accurate and up to date ... I sat there for 15 minutes with no response at all. Pinged three times during that period asking what was happening and if he was going to respond at all ... finally closed the chat and will use other channels since support seems to be a compete joke.

I would still try what Calero27 suggested, I'm not cable tech expert, just what I've picked up.

Something else you can try is also having the Ethernet unplugged while doing the factory reset.

As for VMedia, there is GeorgeBurger, you should try sending him a PM.

I'll add as well when I was on a TPIA cable connection, 3 times I went 72hours with a 192.168.100.*/169.254.*.* address. Not to remove responsibility but the cohesion of operations between any TPIA and the incumbents is not the smoothest process out there.

You may have already done this, I'll admit I mostly skimmed. But have you actually unplugged the power to all the devices and started from the beginning Modem first, router, then computers (the computers can actually stay on and connected to the router)? I noticed you said you're resetting the modem through the online interface which is why I'm mentioning this.

Any time I have any sort of IP issues, this clears it up instantly. Especially when moving the modem around multiple devices. If you haven't, I would unplug the power to the modem and router, connect the ethernet between the 2 and wait a few minutes. Bring the modem up, wait until it's fully initialized and then plug the router in.

If you've already done this, just ignore me

ok, I'm willing to try anything at this point. Thanks.

If I have the ethernet unplugged I can't access the modem to do a reset (I don't see any manual means of resetting this modem.

As for George, I'd much rather go through this process without his interference ... I want this experience to be untainted (George not pushing from his side, and me not influencing the support team by letting them know I am documenting this experience online.)

I believe I have tried those steps (tried so many permutations now it's all becoming fuzzy.)

But I'll give it another shot later when I get home, maybe Rogers actually did some work today?

Personally, I don't ever use software resets with modems or routers. They don't always function the same as being powered off. Power cycling is the best way to force things like DHCP changes etc. A software reset may not be clearing memory properly, that's why you wait a few minutes after you've unplugged the power.

Do you actually know the difference between a factory reset and simple power cycle on a cable modem?

The Motorola SB series has no hardware reset pin like many other cable modems out there so the software switch is the only one to use.

Of course I know the difference. I just don't see the necessity to factory reset the modem repeatedly. A simple power cycle should resolve the issue (if there isn't an issue on Rogers end). Even when it's resolved, a factory reset is not required (although I'm sure there have been cases where it was required, that's not the norm).

Repeatedly no, I think it's being suggested again because perhaps there's more proper ways to do it.

Perhaps, but from what the OP has been saying, it seems that's what he's doing every time (using the factory reset) and hasn't actually done a power cycle at all. Hence why I suggested it.

Actually I've done several, including a 5 hour recycle (ie: disconnect the modem from everything, put it on the kitchen table, and then hook it up, start the Modem, start the Router .. same issues.

Ok

Barrels of laughs this time. Contacted sales though chat to see if they could address my need to review the Rogers ticket for accurate and up-to-date information (since I've been told by tech support that they see the problem as having been fixed.) No go, they just basically told me to call tech support and ended the chat abruptly (I guess they figure once they have you on the hook that's good enough for their bonuses, this is 'retention's' problem now.)

So call in to support again: Ask for status update on ticket, and am told once more "Oh, I see your problem is fixed, what can we do for you today?" Argghhh .. so I explain, no the problem is not fixed, I've never said it was and I've already explained this mistake to one tech already.

I ask to be given the details of the Rogers ticket so I can assure the information they have is correct ... well, bottom line, here's what I was told during the whole conversation:

1 - ticket was not raised until Saturday 2pm, despite staying online with the tech on Friday to confirm the ticket was sent. So, while I'm thinking I am close approaching the 72 hour max, I find out it hasn't even been 48 hours yet.

2 - Notes say the problem is fixed, but no one in support is able to view the actual Rogers ticket or even provide updates to the ticket.

3 - Updates require the manager. Ask to be forwarded to the manager but told he is not in today and that I can send him and email.

4 - Managers email is supposedly 'support@vmedia.ca' -- ask for the managers direct company email, told he doesn't have one. So I ask for the managers name so I can properly direct the email. Told his name is Harry -- "what is Harry's last name" I ask. -- "Don't know" he says.

Okay, eventually after asking him to ask around to see if anyone there knows their managers last name I am finally given a name.

5 - Asked in lieu of Harry being off today can he forward me to someone who has the authority to update the Rogers ticket so I can at least have the fact that the problem is NOT fixed in the ticket somewhere so Rogers doesn't do what VMedia is doing and read 'the problem is fixed', close the ticket and move on? Nope, he has no authority to forward me to anyone other than a manager who from reading the forums never seems to be there when someone wants to be escalated to him.

6 - So he can't forward me to 'Harry', and he can't forward me to anyone with authority to access Rogers ticket system, so can he please forward me to customer support? Nope, he doesn't have that ability.

Seems the VMedia support team seems "authorized" to pretty well do absolutely nothing to address a customers concerns.

Oh joy, and while I was typing this I was on hold waiting for customer support to answer .. and 1/2 hour on hold it goes unexpectedly to 'please leave a voice mail' and hangs up.

Hi Beedle2 very sorry about your experience, I haven't jumped in because you are quite right you are getting alot of help from TypeS and others, and it seemed like your issue was on its way to resolution, but regardless of what the cause is I agree that the service you describe is unaaceptable. Can you send me your ID and let me look into it myself?