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PX Eliezer1
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join:2013-03-10
Zubrowka USA

PX Eliezer1

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Mom fined just $60 after cops rescue baby from hot car

MONTREAL — Police say they fined a mother $60 after officers had to break a window to reach her seven-month-old boy who was left in a car while she went shopping in a Montreal suburb....

The mother told a witness she had only been gone "two minutes" before officers arrived on scene, police said.

Security cameras allegedly show the baby was left alone for nearly 40 minutes.

Police have fined the woman $60 for leaving her child unattended in the car. The police have also filed a complaint with child protection services and have turned the case over to Crown prosecutors, who could decide to file more serious charges.

Earlier this month, a 40-year-old St. Jerome, Que., mother was fined $60, the maximum allowable fine, for leaving her two young children, aged four and nine, in the back of her minivan when temperatures soared to nearly 37 C with humidity.

»cnews.canoe.ca/CNEWS/Can ··· 776.html

Sheesh.

1) WTF does it take to get the public to pay attention?

2) $60 fine??? I bet there is a higher fine for littering....

Thane_Bitter
Inquire within
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join:2005-01-20

Thane_Bitter

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Police need a shoot-on-sight policy when dealing with "parents" that "forget/leave/dump/discard" kids in a car.

El Quintron
Cancel Culture Ambassador
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join:2008-04-28
Tronna

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said by PX Eliezer1:

2) $60 fine??? I bet there is a higher fine for littering....

I wonder why they even bothered seeing as they opted to press criminal charges. In the case I think the police acted correctly, the $60 is just a distraction IMO.

EQ
Robrr
join:2008-04-19

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I will say that I am glad that there is video footage for this incident. It removes all doubt.

I do hope that the Crown and Child Protection Services puts this idiot through the wringer for her incompetency.

Gone
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join:2011-01-24
Fort Erie, ON

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said by PX Eliezer1:

»cnews.canoe.ca/CNEWS/Can ··· 776.html

Sheesh.

1) WTF does it take to get the public to pay attention?

2) $60 fine??? I bet there is a higher fine for littering....

*cough* You missed this part:
quote:
The police have also filed a complaint with child protection services and have turned the case over to Crown prosecutors, who could decide to file more serious charges.
PX Eliezer1
Premium Member
join:2013-03-10
Zubrowka USA

PX Eliezer1

Premium Member

I saw that, I was careful to leave it in.

But in both Canada and the US, I have never seen mention of a civil fine as opposed to criminal and/or child protective investigation.

Why bother with a $60 fine.

By contrast, the city of Montreal has fines for littering up to $1,000.

And there is this:

MONTREAL — Katie Nelson says she’s been ticketed so many times, Montreal police have stopped asking for her address when handing her a citation. They know it by heart.

The 21-year-old Concordia student racked up over $6,500 in fines during the 2012 student protests. The litany of charges include jaywalking, swearing, spitting on the ground, flicking cigarette ashes and “emitting a noise” in public.

One ticket reads: “for having professed insults in a park.” That $146 fine came after Nelson apparently said “bastard” in Émilie-Gamelin Park.

»o.canada.com/news/katie- ··· facebook

So in Montreal, here is the table of fines:

Leaving kids in hot car: $60
Insults in a park: $146
Littering $1,000

Makes no sense....

Gone
Premium Member
join:2011-01-24
Fort Erie, ON

Gone

Premium Member

I don't think the fine was given instead of criminal charges. I suspect it would be in addition to them.
PX Eliezer1
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join:2013-03-10
Zubrowka USA

PX Eliezer1

Premium Member

Agreed.

Kitlope
join:2004-07-29
Edmonton, Ab

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But leave your dog in a hot car and you'll be fined $2500.00

»www.edmontonjournal.com/ ··· ory.html
PX Eliezer1
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join:2013-03-10
Zubrowka USA

PX Eliezer1

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Since June, Montreal police say they’ve received 37 reports of children left unattended in vehicles.

»www.ctvnews.ca/canada/mo ··· .1910418

This is nuts. Just in the city of Montreal (which is not even the whole island).

Maybe they need to start confiscating the cars.

That would get public's attention....
peterboro (banned)
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Peterborough, ON

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I believe we had a thread recently in which people in here posted they were more concerned over their own liability than saving a kid.

Gone
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join:2011-01-24
Fort Erie, ON

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said by PX Eliezer1:

This is nuts. Just in the city of Montreal (which is not even the whole island).

Maybe they need to start confiscating the cars.

That would get public's attention....

Hold your horses there. What do they define as "children" ? An infant or toddler locked in a car is a problem. But a 10 or 12 year old? Or hell, even an 8 year old? Get real and mind your own fucking business. If they're old enough to walk to school on their own they're old enough to wait in the car.
PX Eliezer1
Premium Member
join:2013-03-10
Zubrowka USA

2 edits

PX Eliezer1

Premium Member

said by Gone:

Hold your horses there. What do they define as "children"? An infant or toddler locked in a car is a problem. But a 10 or 12 year old? Or hell, even an 8 year old? Get real and mind your own fucking business. If they're old enough to walk to school on their own they're old enough to wait in the car.

I don't think the Montreal police were mainly talking about 10 or 12 year olds, but even a 10 or 12 year old should not be locked in a hot car, nor should a dog.

The $60 fine only applies up to age 7.

Gone
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join:2011-01-24
Fort Erie, ON

Gone

Premium Member

Infants, toddlers and dogs can't get out of a locked car, and even if they could you wouldn't want them to as they'd be vulnerable to getting hurt. 10 and 12 year olds aren't invalids who aren't capable of getting out of the car if it gets too hot or if they need assistance. They are capable of limited self-supervision. And that's the distinction between them.

As for Montreal's bylaw, it makes sense if 7 is the cut-off age, as that tends to be the difference between where a child is capable of some limit self-supervision like walking to school, versus a child that cannot. I suspect there are plenty of children out there who could be expected to handle this at a younger age, but I would find it hard to believe that there are many older than that who would not be completely capable of doing this.
PX Eliezer1
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PX Eliezer1

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Media accounts said that the Montreal police received "37 reports of children left unattended in vehicles" since June, without specifying ages.

So without further info we don't know whether this is primarily about little kids or older ones.

Common sense would suggest that a preponderance of calls concerned the younger kids, not older ones, but you never know.

But all of that is a bit off track.

The issue is younger kids in hot cars, and dogs in hot cars, and why people have become so blissfully ignorant....

Somehow in society we have an epidemic of [obvious] turning into [oblivious].

A Lunenburg, N.S., man has been found guilty under the Animal Protection Act after his Portuguese water dog died when he left it inside his car in Wolfville during a hot day last summer....

Court heard testimony from a number of witnesses, including John Cummings. He tried to save the dog by smashing the vehicle's window with a hammer.

Cummings testified that he and another person attempted to revive the dog after they managed to get it out of the sweltering car. Cummings told the court the animal was very hot to the touch and its hair was damp. He said it was "like it had just come out of a sauna."

After the dog died, Cummings testified he saw Remai and told him "I think your dog is dead." He said Remai walked calmly past him to the dead dog.

»www.cbc.ca/news/canada/n ··· .2672179

A similar dog episode recently in New York's Long Island.

So I say again, WTF has happened to people?

Jay Leno's Tonight Show used to have a segment called "What did they THINK would happen?!" and that certainly seems a good question.
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BrianON
join:2011-09-30
Ottawa, ON

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Re: Mom fined just $60 after cops rescue baby from hot car

With climate control drivers never experience prolonged hot or cold in a car. This can leave a psychological blind spot where they don't realize the dangers since they associate being in a car with being comfortable.
mr weather
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join:2002-02-27
Mississauga, ON

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And yet another moron parent left their one year-old in a hot car while shopping at Vaughan Mills Mall yesterday.

You need a goddamn licence to catch fish but anyone with a pulse can breed.

dirtyjeffer0
Posers don't use avatars.
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join:2002-02-21
London, ON

dirtyjeffer0

Premium Member

said by mr weather:

You need a goddamn licence to catch fish but anyone with a pulse can breed.

that's why i said, everyone born should be sterilized...you need to pass exams to have kids.

TigerLord

join:2002-06-09
Canada

TigerLord

said by dirtyjeffer0:

that's why i said, everyone born should be sterilized...you need to pass exams to have kids.

The neighbors next door to me are a young couple. The girl receives welfare and the guy works at a garage and is apparently paid in cash.

They're the most disrespectful, inconsiderate, irresponsible specimens of homo sapiens on the entire avenue. They often have fights in the middle of the night, but for some reason they prefer to air those out in the streets, so they fight outside whilst screaming on top of their lungs. We've gotten a lot of intel on them this way.

Last week I saw them move in a bassinet and a baby park. I completely freaked out. You couldn't find less desirable candidates for parenthood if you tried. I'm convinced their baby might be the dawn of a new human race, homo moronus.

I know you were kidding but seriously, it should be illegal for people like that to reproduce. How can this baby have a chance to ever become a productive citizen of society when both his or her parents are major league losers? That's if the ape mother doesn't leave the baby in the car and kills her before that happens.

A $60 fine is a joke. That's what you get for a parking ticket. The gravity of endangering a baby's life equals that of a parking violation in the eyes of the law? Logic is extinct in government.
ilianame
join:2002-06-05
Burnaby, BC

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said by Gone:

I don't think the fine was given instead of criminal charges. I suspect it would be in addition to them.

I'd suspect that its a good thing. Pay the $60. Get off on double jeopardy.

Gone
Premium Member
join:2011-01-24
Fort Erie, ON

Gone

Premium Member

Double jeapordy does not apply to non-criminal charges like this.
PX Eliezer1
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join:2013-03-10
Zubrowka USA

PX Eliezer1

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Re: Man bites dog.

Well here is the OPPOSITE story.

Toddler saves elderly man from hot car

It’s usually the adult who needs to save the child from a sweltering hot car.

Not this time, though.

Three-year-old Keith Williams is being called a hero for helping save an elderly man in Knoxville, Tenn. who was trapped in his car last Saturday.

Bob King was locked inside because of a faulty switch, he said, as temperatures outside reached the 33 C mark.

King got the child’s attention as he walked by. Williams told his pastor what was happening and King was freed shortly after.

»cnews.canoe.ca/CNEWS/Goo ··· 131.html

More details:
»abcnews.go.com/US/tennes ··· 24564932
ilianame
join:2002-06-05
Burnaby, BC

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Re: Mom fined just $60 after cops rescue baby from hot car

said by Gone:

Double jeapordy does not apply to non-criminal charges like this.

You are correct in principal, however the following authority can be stretched to mean otherwise, courtesy of Chapter 11.

Fines are included as form of punishment:

"However, other punitive forms of disciplinary measures, such as fines or imprisonment, are indistinguishable from criminal punishment and should surely fall within the protection of s. 11(h)."

»www.canlii.org/en/ca/scc ··· 149.html

Gone
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Fort Erie, ON

Gone

Premium Member

True, but it would depend on the exact framework of the charges. A provincial or bylaw offences like leaving a child unattended in a car is a far cry from full blown criminal child endangerment charges.