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daks

join:2014-07-18

Rogers Hamilton Mtn

Click for full size
Whats up with Rogers changeover "to serve us better"

My d/l speed is stuck at 1Mps and U/l at 3Mbps, does not matter what time of day so it's not Roger's usual trick of not enough bandwidth for the area being served. Though could be them playing with the provisioning files to hide a network problem (like they did about 4 years ago in Toronto).

I saw in the newspaper a week or so ago they had screwed up most of the home phone customers with their "upgrades".

SO before I end up wasting 1-4hrs on the phone with someone that is reading from a script trying to say it's something wrong with 3 different computers and 3 different operating systems... has anyone heard what's up?

They have packet loss all through their network...

cepnot4me

join:2013-10-29
L0C 1K0
kudos:3
Reviews:
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Mountain is in a transitionary phase.
All you can do is wait.
Rogers has a laundry list of things that have gone wrong.. They will fix it.

And just to nit pick. It's not "their" network. It's Shaws network they are trying to bring up to speed.

In fact I don't think Shaw upgraded anything from Mountain cable when they acquired it.

So they are trying to update an ancient Mountain Cable system, to what we run Atlantic.

It'll take time. Cancel or wait.



dillyhammer
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Scarborough, ON
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reply to daks

You see all that "Transitionary Phase" Rogers doublespeak? Notice how they don't have any problems with their billing system charging you full price for that shit connection?

Do yourself a favour, call Start Communications, Teksavvy, or some other independent, and inquire about vDSL.

And if you have Rogers cable TV, have a look at Shaw Direct. Better, more, cheaper. Then tell all of your friends and neighbours and have them switch too.

Fuck Rogers.

Mike
--
I've picked on Cogeco long enough. Who's next? Any volunteers?


Warez_Zealot

join:2006-04-19
Vancouver
reply to daks

What a bunch of incompetent fools. This just goes to show they didn't plan this out.



SCEvan

@173.32.38.x

I'm in the same boat, my transition happened on the 17th and internet was fine until I woke up today. If you call local tech support 905-389-1347 there is an automated message that they have technicians working on the slow internet. »www.speedtest.net/result/3634883542.png


cepnot4me

join:2013-10-29
L0C 1K0
kudos:3
Reviews:
·TekSavvy DSL
reply to dillyhammer

Please, Shaw Direct? There's a good reason they changed the name from Star choice over to Shaw direct, It was crap. Rarely worked. Poorly installed and the bills were screwed up as often as Bells or Rogers.

And honest to truly, We all know Rogers is going to credit everyone for this disruption. The primary focus is on fixing it, the credits will come when they do.

Thirdly. They are transitioning an old , very old platform.

A platform that has no tools. They have nothing that monitors modems, no way to identify packet loss, utilization, congestion on the nodes, outages or anything.

It was VERY Antiquated. This NEEDED to happen.

I worked the field during the Aurora cable switch. Engineering, field techs, etc. They all worked together to get it going as soon as possible. It wasn't smooth.

Look at the size of this undertaking.

Anyone transitioned two corporate systems together seamless before?

It doesn't help that ALL of Ontario runs scientific Atlanta and Hamikton and Compton cable will run Motorola.

It's a massive job. But these areas will be the envy of Rogers Customers cause once it's done, the Motorola platform will be far superior to the Cisco / SA platform the rest of us deal with.

And then there are the backbone upgrades going in.. The stuff coming to all these Motorola platform customers.. It'll be worth it, this is a speed bump for customers. You're going to get credited for all your headaches and then you'll have superior service over everyone, INCLUDING Current Rogers Customers.

I get that people are impatient, upset, but coming from a guy who's had a small part in these kinds of jobs...

Don't complain or throw out "incompetent" unless you can go in there and do better. Which you can't.

All things considered, the boys and girls are doing alright considering the circumstances.


yyzlhr

join:2012-09-03
Scarborough, ON
kudos:4

I'm not sure about the backend tools that they had under Shaw, but I would hardly call the Shaw Hamilton system antiquated. From the get go they already had multiple TV products such as the Gateway system and the HD on screen guide, that were already far superior to anything Rogers has in either the Ontario or Atlantic markets. Also their internet speeds if I remember correctly were on par with what Shaw was offering in their markets out west. I don't think Shaw would be able to offer any of this if their systems were truly "antiquated".


cepnot4me

join:2013-10-29
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That's the equipment, that's the Motorola platform. The issues they are having isn't with that platform or that equipment so much, it's integrating it into ours. It's the account management system, Tier tools, head end monitoring tools. It's all the behind the scenes integration.

It's like.. Making a nintendo talk to a Playstation.
Nothing is wrong with the Nintendo, but you're trying to make it talk to a whole other technology.


yyzlhr

join:2012-09-03
Scarborough, ON
kudos:4

I get there are challenges with integrating systems but your argument that Shaw Hamilton's network is "antiquated" and that Rogers is doing extensive upgrades to bring these customers to the modern age is simply not true.



dillyhammer
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reply to cepnot4me

Click for full size
The Mass Delusion
said by cepnot4me:

That's the equipment, that's the Motorola platform. The issues they are having isn't with that platform or that equipment so much, it's integrating it into ours. It's the account management system, Tier tools, head end monitoring tools. It's all the behind the scenes integration.

It's like.. Making a nintendo talk to a Playstation.
Nothing is wrong with the Nintendo, but you're trying to make it talk to a whole other technology.

Well, it certainly isn't typical to see a Rogers employee/contractor talk out of both sides of their mouth at the same time.



said by cepnot4me:

Mountain is in a transitionary phase.
All you can do is wait.

Rogers has gobbled up yet another cable operation and instead of operating it as a separate unit decided to migrate it over to their own in-house platform. Which is as we all know problem-free, bug-free, and operates perfectly all the time. All the problems Rogers customers have are just a mass delusion (see illustration of random hallucination above).



said by cepnot4me:

Rogers has a laundry list of things that have gone wrong...

Things have gone wrong alright. I can't imagine that migration happening easily or seamlessly. There is bound to be a whole laundry list of things that can go wrong and really screw things up for people.... wait.... never mind...



said by cepnot4me:

It'll take time. Cancel or wait.

Now that's more like it. The typical Rogers we know and love.

said by cepnot4me:

Please, Shaw Direct? There's a good reason they changed the name from Star choice over to Shaw direct, It was crap. Rarely worked. Poorly installed and the bills were screwed up as often as Bells or Rogers.

Again, typical Rogers to bad mouth the competition. Every time I discussed cancelling with a Rogers employee I got that same FUD. And that's all it is. A technique to scare customers from flocking to the competition.

Shaw changed the name to align and consolidate their branding, something companies do every day. Not to hide anything. I suppose they could have just left it if it was half as bad as you say it is, and make people think it's a completely different company. Something that Rogers does. Like with Fido.

My years of being a Shaw Direct customer saw exemplary customer service to capture my business away from Cogeco, and exceptional television service at a reasonable price. It was the first time I've been satisfied with my TV service. Ever. And not one billing issue. Bills came in, were reviewed, were prefect, and were paid. Not one issue. Same for the others in my neighborhood that I converted to Shaw. The only reason I don't have it now is I'm an apartment dweller and I discovered OTA. You want to ask me how good it was to migrate that crap Rogers platform right the f**k out of my apartment? There's a reason why people use a Rogers' cancellation as a badge of honour.

Your post said to "Cancel or wait".

I intend to ensure that your customer understands that their "Cancel" options aren't as dark and dreary as you Rogers people would like to have them think. We have customers in Rogers territory, both native and TPIA, suffering all kinds of packetloss and other issues 24/7. This is on your beloved new platform.

I can guarantee this.

Just about any experience the OP decides to migrate to is going to be better, more reliable, easier to fix, cheaper, more reasonable, than Rogers. This is based on my 40 years as a consumer, not based on my tenure in the company I work for.

Mike
--
I've picked on Cogeco long enough. Who's next? Any volunteers?

daks

join:2014-07-18
reply to cepnot4me

Rogers replaced most of the Moto equipment (that was working great btw) a couple months ago. Even the modems, I laughed when I got one of the exploitable DPC 3825's. (So many features disabled on it by rogers custom settings it's sad) made darn sure I ran a router behind it.

I've always had more billing problems with Rogers Vs. Mountain Cable, Shaw or Cogeco.
I've always receive more incorrect/dishonest answers from Rogers call reps Vs. Mountain Cable, Shaw or Cogeco.
And as is being proven again... my internet service has degraded with Rogers Vs. Mountain Cable, Shaw or Cogeco.

Rogers forgets that the hassle of dealing with their constant problems is not worth the $5.00 movie credits.


cepnot4me

join:2013-10-29
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kudos:3
Reviews:
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reply to yyzlhr

Everyone is missing what I mean.

There is very little upgrades to the actual platform controlling the equipment.
When I say platform I guess I should be saying backbone?

What's happening is more integration.

Getting each customers account into Rogers SGI, Tying their existing Shaw accounts to their cellular accounts. Tying things into their My Rogers, my account.

I think the only change to the equipment is the preparation for what's coming (Next Gen Motorola set tops and modems) Getting Rogers on demand library interface etc.

The antiquated systems are the network management systems. Node monitoring, modem diagnostics. Stuff that isn't so much end user related.

The actual platform they have as far as equipment The Motorola platform in my opinion is the best you can get.


yyzlhr

join:2012-09-03
Scarborough, ON
kudos:4

They are not allowing Shaw Hamilton customers bundle their services with Rogers wireless at this time.

Also if the problem stems with migrating billing systems that would certainly indicate incompetence on Rogers part.


cepnot4me

join:2013-10-29
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kudos:3
Reviews:
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They aren't allowing bundling, yet. Because they haven't finished what they are doing. They need to finish the migration before they can begin bundling.
It's not just the billing system.

Yyzlhr. How many individual systems do you access?

Maestro? SGI? Oasys? Management portal? Tier 2? Click? Oracle? There are a dozen or more systems in play beyond those.

End result for mountain, these system will integrate, manage, diagnose and support the mountain cable customers.

They already tied in our FSMS and field support systems . Everything else is on its way.

The end result will be Mountain and Compton customers while on a different hardware platform, will integrate into the existing support and billing and accounting systems.


yyzlhr

join:2012-09-03
Scarborough, ON
kudos:4

A migration should not be causing such widespread problems. I've lived in other cities where my carrier had been acquired by another company and I was never without service for such an extended period of time.


cepnot4me

join:2013-10-29
L0C 1K0
kudos:3

I don't know the culprit. (If we did, it would likely be fixed sooner, wouldn't it?)
But your right, a migration SHOULD'NT cause problems...

That's pretty much the problem.
It shouldn't have.. but it did. No its a question of why.


thebig

join:2002-11-18
Hamilton, ON
reply to daks

Just opened a ticket with Rogers for the same issue, 1mb down in speed tests and 5-30% packet loss.

Rep stated they are having issues with the cisco DPC3825 modems, and are preparing to push a new firmware in the next few days. They also do not have any stock of alternate modems as they are having supply chain issues with getting more.



SCEvan

@173.32.38.x

After reading the previous post I decided to call Rogers and can confirm the info posted by "thebig". Tech support had me disconnect my router and connect directly to my modem then power cycle so the info could be sent back to Rogers. From what I was told a fix is in the works but there is no ETA. Cisco DPC3825.

For speed reference she had me use speedtest.net which had this result:
»www.speedtest.net/my-result/3638844312

and speedcheck.rogers.com which is just a blank page.

Expand your moderator at work

cepnot4me

join:2013-10-29
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reply to SCEvan

Re: Rogers Hamilton Mtn

Lol. If it IS the Cisco, I wouldn't be surprised. Motorola platform, running Motorola and Arris (Emta) Artist I believe is owned by motorola.

I was under the impression that no equipment was getting swapped out. But I understand everyone got pushed onto a cisco.

I sympathize for the guys and gals dealing with this mess, but... I can also look at this as a bone head move.

Shouldve left well enough alone like I thought was the original plan.

Can anyone post the modem logs?

I'm curious what modem is doing..


yyzlhr

join:2012-09-03
Scarborough, ON
kudos:4

I don't see why that should be a problem, everything runs on the DOCSIS standard which is manufacturer agnostic. In addition, Rogers runs Motorola and Arris modems and EMTAs in Cisco/SA markets as well.


cepnot4me

join:2013-10-29
L0C 1K0
kudos:3
Reviews:
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I wouldn't think it's an issue, But most of Ontario is Scientific Atlanta nodes, equipment.
The platform is designed and routed by Cisco.
I only barely comprehend some of what happens to data as it travels (Sbrook or other users could probably break it down further) .

Emta's in Rogers run on Docsis 2. So that's simple enough, Was mountains modems Docsis 3?. Did Rogers implement D3 in this plant and that's where the mess happened?

I argued before it was all backbone and support systems (My friends in tech ops and engineering said the transition was like for like). But if they migrated up to D3... well. I don't know networking, but 1/1 for speeds sounds like modems running in a kind of limp mode.


yyzlhr

join:2012-09-03
Scarborough, ON
kudos:4

1 edit

Shaw offered speeds in excess of 100mbps so they must have already been on DOCSIS 3.

Also it shouldn't matter who manufactures the node equipment. The point of a standard is to ensure that everything operates the same way regardless of the manufacturer.



SCEvan

@173.32.38.x

I think they must be working on fixing it, fired up my laptop and there was no internet access waited a few minutes and ran multiple speed tests.

»www.speedtest.net/result/3639579747.png


daks

join:2014-07-18
reply to cepnot4me

said by cepnot4me:

I wouldn't think it's an issue, But most of Ontario is Scientific Atlanta nodes, equipment.
The platform is designed and routed by Cisco.
I only barely comprehend some of what happens to data as it travels (Sbrook or other users could probably break it down further) .

Emta's in Rogers run on Docsis 2. So that's simple enough, Was mountains modems Docsis 3?. Did Rogers implement D3 in this plant and that's where the mess happened?

I argued before it was all backbone and support systems (My friends in tech ops and engineering said the transition was like for like). But if they migrated up to D3... well. I don't know networking, but 1/1 for speeds sounds like modems running in a kind of limp mode.

Shaw was running D3 before Rogers was, I don't know when the mountain was changed over but I know it's been available here for quite the while. The 3825 modem was given to us by Rogers after we handed our old ones in. It ran fine for a month until our node was "Robberized/upgraded" .

Unfortunately for end users with Rogers in this area with these modems, Rogers uses the OID's to turn off the log files on the consumer side and the signal strength screens are now also gone. I guess they got tired of the occasional person being able to read the logs or signal screens and being able to call BS to what the reps tell them.

Case in point, telling thebig that the issue was with the modems and a new firmware is in the works, It is true that a new firmware was released for the 3825, but it has nothing to do with Rogers! It was do deal with a security issue on the modems firmware. If it had to do with the modems being the problem why did they work fine before on this network, and work fine for many other ISP's.
My guts tell me it has to do with the CMTS settings (probably with Roger's custome frontend/management software) and it looks like some routing issues are jumping in for fun.

My beef is some middle manager decided to keep the changeover happening even after it was noticed a path of destruction was happening. "Duuuhhhh the project timeline says we must be done by the end of July so keep going as planned"

instead of.

First node of EMTA's goes kablooie "Stop, what happened, what's the cause, how do we fix it, how do we prevent it from happening again. Hold the modem changeover until we test one node first"

There is no excuse for taking out more than one node in a system changeover. And they repeated the same cause all over and inconvenienced a lot of people and had no backup plan for anyone that telecommuted or was in school etc.

cepnot4me

join:2013-10-29
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You're right about their "scheduling" of the switches. When they did the first QAM realignment in Etobicoke, 11,000 customers lost channels.

Because of the existing Analog filters still on lines AND in that area a handful of frequencies were just no good.

But they carried on anyways.

You can't pull logs or signals? That's weird.. it's in the first firmware from Cisco.. I wouldn't of thought they could remove the internal page..

I'm asking a few buddies in engineering for more details about the actual cause, everything I said before seems to be true still, but there is more going on. (I didn't think they were forcing you into equipment, in fact I was told they were not.)

If there is node cutovers, then that says the platform is changing (Adding SA/Cisco DTV compatibility? ) It seems like it wouldn't be required to replace Shaw on demand with Rogers on Demand..

I'm asking around, I'll see if anyone I know has any more info.

Maybe even an ETA.


daks

join:2014-07-18

We appreciate your feedback on this issue cepnot4me!

Correct about logs and signals on the modems, it's a feature in most D2 and D3 modems where you can disable the logs and signal pages.

It's really frustrating for someone like myself when you get the BS from the CSR i.e. (modem firmware issue) and you have a very good understanding of Docsis modems and networks. I'm also curious what is happening on the 69.63.249.26 Hub/router, that one is not even in our area and it seems to be having issues. (I have suspicions of what is going on but I do not have the time to Geek out on Rogers as I have too much of my own work to do)

You're right about the control software having to be tweaked to work on the Shaw equipment and a few things having to be changed on the CMTS' (I have found that Shaw's Eng's tune and configure their CMTS' alot more than Rogers does, sorry, but on the Geek scale of Docsis systems the Shaw guys have had Rogers beat hands down for a few years now).
Rogers should stop learning stuff from Comcast on management style.


sleedham

join:2014-07-23
Hamilton, ON
reply to daks

Exactly. There is an article in the Hamilton Spectator about how bad the transition has gone. I had a service call today, and the tech told me everyone who has switched in the last 2 weeks is having issues... yet... they continued to switch people. They switched me over Monday morning, and it's been disconnecting every few minutes since then.

WHY would Rogers continue moving people over to a system they know is broken?? Purely because they want to finish the project by the end of July?? Think of how many customers they could potentially lose from this problem. I've already looked into alternatives, and if this firmware update (which is supposed to be pushed out tonight) doesn't fix the problem, I'll be changing providers.


sleedham

join:2014-07-23
Hamilton, ON

Well, looks like I'm looking for a new ISP.



dillyhammer
START me up
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join:2010-01-09
Scarborough, ON
kudos:10

Have you checked into what's available on VDSL in your area?

Mike
--
I've picked on Cogeco long enough. Who's next? Any volunteers?