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HID/Xenon QuestionI just bought a 2013 Navigator and first thing I'd like to do is upgrade the headlamps to xenon's. I'd like to either go with 7500k hyper white or go blue at 12000k. The Navigator is equipped with HID headlights from the factory. Is upgrading to xenons just as simple as popping in new bulbs or do I have to have parts of the headlight assembly and the wiring replaced? I cannot find a clear answer online, but from he research I've done, it sounds like I need the whole kit, is that true? Thanks |
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hidtohid
Anon
2014-Aug-4 7:26 pm
xenon is the gas in a HID so, your saying I want to upgrade my HIDs to HIDs...
Going from hid to hid no, you don't need to change anything unless you go with illegal wattage... (note I did not check to make sure the car really comes with HID's taking your word for it)
Also, my I ask why you want to go 7500k-12000k... Me, I like to see at night, and I can tell you... 6500k LED is already turning blue... more blue than I'd really like... |
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to Happydude32
What is the purpose? |
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 EliteDataEliteData
Premium Member
join:2003-07-06
Philippines |
its the "cool" thing to do these days. remember when everyone has those under the car lights ? |
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 Anonymous_Anonymous
Premium Member
join:2004-06-21
127.0.0.1
2 edits |
said by EliteData:its the "cool" thing to do these days. remember when everyone has those under the car lights ? there is a few loop holes that can be exploited. if you want to do that |
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nonymous (banned)
join:2003-09-08
Glendale, AZ |
to EliteData
said by EliteData:its the "cool" thing to do these days. remember when everyone has those under the car lights ? My wife hates the bright headlights in oncoming city traffic. They can be just too much for her. Plus really not needed in city traffic but like you said they think it is cool to blind uncoming drivers blocks away. Even in the west I find few roads ultra bright head lights are needed let alone can use high beams due to uncoming traffic. Did find a few dirt roads in Utah with little traffic but didnt even have even a coyote as remote hot barren desert. |
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to hidtohid
I am no expert on this stuff and like I said the information I've found online isn't cut and dry to me since I don't really know enough about vehicle lightning systems. I would have thought the factory HIDs would have used halogen bulbs not xenon. The spec sheet the dealer showed me on Saturday showed HID headlamps has being included and I'm pretty sure they come standard now anyway.
Basically the purpose is because I think they look really cool. I'm not sure if I want to go as far as 12000k, but I either was the lights to be that shade blue or extremely white. |
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 Time
Premium Member
join:2003-07-05
Irvine, CA |
to Happydude32
said by Happydude32:I just bought a 2013 Navigator and first thing I'd like to do is upgrade the headlamps to xenon's. I'd like to either go with 7500k hyper white or go blue at 12000k. The Navigator is equipped with HID headlights from the factory. Is upgrading to xenons just as simple as popping in new bulbs or do I have to have parts of the headlight assembly and the wiring replaced? I cannot find a clear answer online, but from he research I've done, it sounds like I need the whole kit, is that true? Thanks You'll need to find whether it is a D2S/D1S/etc socket. Most German vehicles use D1S from OSRAM or Philips, but I'm not sure about American cars. OSRAM has a white 6200k indigenous bulb that you can purchase. You can buy bulbs to fit the sockets on eBay, but beware that you lose luminescence the higher the kelvin rating. Most of the bulbs are also manufactured in China which severely degrades the quality making them extremely unreliable, and can also place the ballasts at risk (not cheap to replace). Most OEM bulbs are manufactured in Germany. |
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to Happydude32
7500k is already blue-ish, 12000k is in the violet range.
I've had 6500k they already had a blue tint, wished I used 5500k instead. |
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 MooJohn
join:2005-12-18
Milledgeville, GA
5 recommendations |
to Happydude32
Put those "cool" 12000k bulbs in and you won't see ANYTHING. People will be staring at you thinking "Nice poverty beams" but you won't be able to see them because the lights are so damn dim. If it's raining at night you may actually have to park because the lights are so useless.
HID = high intensity discharge, so yours already has the real deal. Lincoln was the first domestic car to use them back in 1995. Once you go any higher than the 4500-5000 of the stock bulbs the light output decreases.
And FWIW, I've broken all the lighting "rules" over the years. I had neon under my car 20 years ago. I have HID drop-ins now which really pisses off the purists but they are 4500k and are aimed to not bother oncoming traffic. But even I draw the line at "look at me" bulbs.
I never understood how something could have "big baller" status when anybody can buy a kit for $50 and give their hoopty Smurf headlights. Why do the same to a real luxury car? |
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 Doctor OldsI Need A Remedy For What's Ailing Me.
Premium Member
join:2001-04-19
1970 442 W30
1 recommendation |
to Happydude32
said by Happydude32:I just bought a 2013 Navigator and first thing I'd like to do is upgrade the headlamps to xenon's. I'd like to either go with 7500k hyper white or go blue at 12000k. I suggest white (under 5,000K IOW) and say no to blue or purples. 
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to Happydude32
A halogen bulb is just that, a halogen bulb, and HID (high intensity discharge) is just that... a HID.
They sell "xenon" halogen bulbs... but it's all marketing...
HID's use xenon gas as a filler gas, halogen lights use, halogen gas as a filler...
If you have HID lights already... and you are putting in a same wattage, same bulb, different color into a HID housing...
So if you have HID's (you say you do and you should) and you replace them with the *same* wattage / socket bulb... then you need to do nothing (just iirc do not touch the glass of the bulb it is that way for halogen lights... I want to say it is that way for HID too).
As far as putting HID in a halogen housing, unless the lights are aimed 90 down, you ARE bothering oncoming traffic...
You start off talking about not being able to see with "poverty beams" then talk about how you have HIDs in the wrong housing BUT they are aimed so low they don't bother oncoming traffic (I am sure they do) thus, hurting how well you can see...
I had "xenon" halogen aka coated bulbs... so they were blueish, HOWEVER, in the rain, I was able to see better than with the stock yellow halogens, for whatever reason the road lines and signs lit up WAY better in the rain than with the stock yellow bulbs... For best light, I'd go no higher than 6500k, and that is with an LED...
Putting in HID's into a halogen housing just makes me want to run you off the road, then claim I was blinded by your non legal lights...
The poverty part, is sticking HIDs into stock housings that do not call for them. It aint poverty to have a '13 with stock hids with a different color. Cough up the cash to at least buy the non dot legal HID housings for your vehicle. |
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nonymous (banned)
join:2003-09-08
Glendale, AZ |
nonymous (banned)
Member
2014-Aug-5 1:41 pm
Maybe hids in a halogen housing are what my wife hates. Just blind oncoming traffic. |
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to MooJohn
said by MooJohn:And FWIW, I've broken all the lighting "rules" over the years. I had neon under my car 20 years ago. I have HID drop-ins now which really pisses off the purists but they are 4500k and are aimed to not bother oncoming traffic. But even I draw the line at "look at me" bulbs.
I never understood how something could have "big baller" status when anybody can buy a kit for $50 and give their hoopty Smurf headlights. Why do the same to a real luxury car? Best damn response to a "I wanna be blue" post-----ever. +1 |
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fixrmanFrom a broken heart to a hole in the sky
Premium Member
join:2003-02-10
Hatboro, PA  ·Verizon FiOS
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fixrman
Premium Member
2014-Aug-5 9:51 pm
Actually, if a person can't see with stock bulbs while driving at night, either they need glasses or are over-driving their headlights, i.e., going too fast.
One of these days I am going to be blinded by one of these jackasses with laser-beam aircraft searchlights - aiming be damned it is the wrong damn lens - and... well, I don't want to say what I will do when I run them down.
Does your wife love you? Has she complained about the size of your _____? Then leave the damn headlamps alone, please. If you are not married, please get married as soon as possible and have several kids who demand more of your time. |
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Jesus freaking Christ! I ask a technical question about light bulbs and I get this shit. For those that answered, thank you, I have a better idea of what I'm going to do.
You know, I really don't care what other people think, never have, never will. I think blue/violet headlights look cool, and I couldn't give a rats ass if people say 'Nice poverty beams', their opinion means absolutely nothing to me. As long as I am happy, that's all that matters. |
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dave
Premium Member
join:2000-05-04
not in ohio
3 recommendations |
dave
Premium Member
2014-Aug-6 9:50 am
We don't care what you think about the responses in here. |
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That's fine. |
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 Grumpy4
Premium Member
join:2001-07-28
NW CT
1 edit
4 recommendations |
to Happydude32
Kmart used to have "blue light" specials in-store. The specials area would have a blue lamp to light the way to the area. Whenever I see the very annoying to my eyes* blue headlights, I can't help but think of the Kmart PA voice saying:
"Attention Kmart shoppers"
The pink headlights make me think the owner is in search of a lobotomy, or perhaps - on the way home from a recent one?
*I wore a pair of blue sunglasses for maybe an hour. The resultant headache from absorbing the better to be avoided blue light waves sent them flying into the murky waters below the Whitestone Bridge. |
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 Subaru1-3-2-4
Premium Member
join:2001-05-31
Greenwich, CT |
to Happydude32
I don't understand why people want blue lights.. I've got 5000K hids I did a retro fit on and because of my clear lenses it will flicker blue depending on how high or low you are. |
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fixrmanFrom a broken heart to a hole in the sky
Premium Member
join:2003-02-10
Hatboro, PA ·Verizon FiOS
1 edit
1 recommendation |
fixrman
Premium Member
2014-Aug-6 6:35 pm
Something tells me that somebody who wants blue or purple lights on his newer vehicle actually does care what people think, else there wouldn't have been a comment complaining. If the modification is legal, doesn't affect anyone else's driving or safety and is permissible by **DOT standards, I see nothing wrong. A pretty good explanation: » www.danielsternlighting. ··· ulbs.pdfBasically for optimum visibility, the Kelvin rating should be 5K which results in a brightness rating of 10 on a scale of one to ten. All blue does is scatter light, result in less light output and increased glare for everyone. **Edit: Sorry, I should have said FMVSS standards. DOT approval is self-certification, it does not mean street legal, nor does it mean it has been tested by the DOT. |
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Subaru1-3-2-4
Premium Member
join:2001-05-31
Greenwich, CT |
Subaru
Premium Member
2014-Aug-6 6:38 pm
don't forget when it rains.. most of the time when you see people with blue and pink headlights are are most often driving the slowest. |
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fixrmanFrom a broken heart to a hole in the sky
Premium Member
join:2003-02-10
Hatboro, PA
1 recommendation |
fixrman
Premium Member
2014-Aug-6 9:15 pm
They also might be on the side of the road receiving a citation.  |
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aholes
Anon
2014-Aug-6 10:06 pm
I just want to point out you guys are being real assholes. Op asked a technical question, and at least is not being a jerk putting HIDs in a halogen housing... and most of this thread is not just suggestions like Doctor Olds  properly added in... or answers to the OPs question... but flat out downing... I want (LED), a 55inch curved light bar on top of my trucks cab, 2 flush mount 6 led lights in my rear bumper, rest on the cab, rear bed light, 45 degree off the rear, 90, and 45 off the front, each side, with 6 led lights... and if I find a way to keep my brush guard on and mount my plow frame I'll have likely another 4 6led lights... that aint even taking into account strobe lights that I do not have my mind made up on yet... oh, omg, I almost forgot, gona get a light in the cab, and a light under the hood... every light, except maybe the under hood light I also plan to tie into my black out light switch. So all I am doing is adding a point of failure for *all* the lighting but, again, I want to, I just want to. Do I care wtf anyone else thinks? Nope, I just want to have those lights... because I want em, I will use I think most while plowing, so who the fuck cares what the OP wants, wow, guys putting a different tint hid in a hid housing... Oh and I plan to paint the thing camo as well, not OD, camo... again why, cause I wanta, AND with CARC (that has a purpose at least, salt washes right off) , that will fade likely in a year. But ya, lets all down the OP for putting a HID in a HID housing... just because the OP likes the blue look. Might as well shit on me as well for all that useless $$$$$$ lighting and camo... |
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fixrmanFrom a broken heart to a hole in the sky
Premium Member
join:2003-02-10
Hatboro, PA ·Verizon FiOS
3 recommendations |
fixrman
Premium Member
2014-Aug-6 11:18 pm
Several people replied with posts in explanation. Some people made comments about the color cheapening the vehicle, reducing the light output, causing glare to other drivers, or responding with their negative opinion due to their own experience with non-white light - which is the FMVSS standard to be followed. Dr Olds even recommended 5000K or under and I posted a link to why blue bulbs are a problem. Did you take time to read it? I found it interesting and informative, even if one only quick scans for the important points. As for your desires that seem to be centered around plowing and visibility during a snow storm, I will repeat: If the modification is legal, doesn't affect anyone else's driving or safety and is permissible by FMVSS standards, I see nothing wrong. You might want to consider upgrading your battery and alternator for all that extra lighting, but of course that is up to you. CARC? Good luck and wear a mask but I am sure you know all about that. Now, was this just a drive-by Anonymous - or will you be joining DLR soon? If you don't care what anyone thinks, why bother with the tell? I'll fart in your general direction if you like. |
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1 recommendation |
to Happydude32
said by Happydude32:I just bought a 2013 Navigator and first thing I'd like to do is upgrade the headlamps to xenon's. I'd like to either go with 7500k hyper white or go blue at 12000k. The Navigator is equipped with HID headlights from the factory. Is upgrading to xenons just as simple as popping in new bulbs or do I have to have parts of the headlight assembly and the wiring replaced? I cannot find a clear answer online, but from he research I've done, it sounds like I need the whole kit, is that true? Thanks You bought a vehicle with Metal-Halide Arc HID lights and you're wanting to DOWNGRADE them to Xenon filled traditional filament lights? WTF is wrong with you? You don't deserve that vehicle. |
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Subaru1-3-2-4
Premium Member
join:2001-05-31
Greenwich, CT |
Subaru
Premium Member
2014-Aug-7 8:43 am
Lol I see what you did |
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to fixrman
said by fixrman:If the modification is legal, doesn't affect anyone else's driving or safety and is permissible by **DOT standards, I see nothing wrong. The DOT standard for the lamp test is this: Hold a white piece of paper about 3 feet in front of the headlamp when on. If the light casting on the paper appears to be blue, it is not an approved lamp. ALL light cast by automotive headlamps must shine a white light. The "blue" we see in a quality HID lamp is only a by-product of the HID lamps, and is not seen on the paper test. |
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anon_canuckl
Anon
2014-Aug-9 6:33 am
You do know that replacing the bulbs with anything but what is meant to go into that capsule, is illegal? ie, halgogen bulbs go into a halogen capsule, not HID bulbs go into halogen capsule. The light will be scattered in front and to the side of you, not directed at the road where you need, down the road. Read here: » www.danielsternlighting. ··· ons.html |
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OldCableGuy3
Anon
2014-Aug-9 8:19 am
Here's a question about HID lights.
Purchased a Prius which apparently has HID lights from the factory.
I notice sometimes if I am on a hilly road, the lights don't seem to illuminate "over the hill"... what I mean is it seems there is a sharp "cut-off" line of what is lit and what isn't. There have been a few times where I couldn't see something at the top of a hill, thankfully I slowed down, but I just wonder is this normal for HIDs? If I am coming up to a stop sign or something, sometimes literally half the sign will be lit, and there is a line and above that... completely dark.
Maybe that's how HID dies? |
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