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Xtreme2damax

join:2007-03-21
Port Byron, NY

Just curious about Verizon dsl "availability" or lack of.

On the Verizon website their records indicate dsl is available at my address. However I tried to set up service through Earthlink, DSLExtreme and Verizon themselves and all orders were cancelled. Finally a tech was sent out (this was earlier this year or last year) to verify dsl service was not available at my address and I'm too far out to receive an internet signal.

In my chats with Verizon and their resellers here or over the phone they should be aware dsl is not available at my address and even requested my address be removed from their records showing dsl service is available here. To this day the Verizon website and their records still show dsl being available at this address so I'm perplexed why they think service is available here and haven't changed it?

The pisser is TDS dsl internet stops just two houses away but won't come into the park because it's Verizon territory apparently but Verizon nor anyone else wants to service the park.

These caps are killing me and have higher data needs than the non-savvy folks that just FB or check email. I'm currently with Verizon Wireless with a 20GB cap practically paying out the nose, even more so if I require more data in a given month.

I've already looked all around and no fixed wisp, no broadband over power lines which would be feasible given the area if no one wants to run lines, no cable, no dsl, no fiber. The only options for an area that isn't really rural and semi-rural at best with the town just up the road around a mile is dial up, satellite or lowly capped mobile data. There appears to be enough homes especially with the town being so close I don't see it taking long to make back the cost and then some. I contacted TDS asking why they couldn't run a bit of line in nearly ten years from two house up the road, apparently they have their own infrastructure so I don't know why Verizon would stop them since Verizon can't provide dsl internet to me. Can't they get Verizon to allow them to splice into their lines and/or resell service or run their own lines down here?

I've been trying to figure out where the cutoff point is for Time Warner cable and FiOs and if their lines run through here but their service bypasses us to see how much work would need to be done to service the area with cable or FiOs.

These providers need to grow a brain and realize you have to spend some to make some and more. Once they finish the work then they make back the cost of expansion and anything after is pretty much profits for them aside when maintenance or repairs are required. Customers already get milked so I don't mind getting milked some more whether through some rural access tax or charge on my bill so long as it means I'd be able to get dsl, fiber or cable.

It's not like I can just pick up and move, don't have the money or resources to. I like the area, the land lady is nice and like the home I'm in. I have a deck to sit on, a large yard to sit in and cook out, plenty of space between homes and relatively quiet. I'm right by my parents who are getting older so I can help them out when they need help seeing as my father has a bad knee, other issues and my mother is frail presumably in poor health given their situation.

Sorry for the long post.
--


davidhoffman
Premium
join:2009-11-19
Warner Robins, GA
kudos:3

Re: Just curious about Verizon dsl "availability" or lack of.

Millenicom at »millenicom.com/plans/#hotspot-pl ··· pot-plan

WirelessNWiFi at »www.wirelessnwifi.com/High-Limit ··· it-4G3G-
Service. I think this is Sprint based service so check the Sprint Coverage Map ( »coverage.sprint.com/IMPACT.jsp?) for your exact address. But I am not 100% sure about that. Best is to contact them as directed on the WirelessNWiFi Website. You can call at 1-877-642-9168.

Possibly in the future from Exede »New Exede Satellite Broadband Tier Provides 150 GB for $70

Verizon and others may keep you on the map of serviced areas just to claim coverage. For example AT&T claims in some databases at the state and federal level to have DSL service to Peebles Drive in Forsyth, GA 31029. Call them up and they will say no service possible. The fake inputs to the databases are based on old plans to expand Bell South DSL, but the plans were cancelled after Bell South was merged with another regional Bell company. The FCC and the state public utility commission have no authority to make them fix bad broadband deployment data.

YellowHammer

join:2004-12-09
United State
ATT and Mediacom show me in the coverage area. Both are liars. The mediacom cable stops 2 miles short of my house.

Xtreme2damax

join:2007-03-21
Port Byron, NY

3 edits
reply to Xtreme2damax
Yeah but the issue is wanting to get off of mobile or satellite data and on landline service. TDS stops two houses away but won't come further and into the park because supposedly it's Verizon territory despite Verizon not providing dsl or fiber here. The only services Verizon provides are cellular, mobile data and landline phone service.

Seeing how TDS has their own infrastructure Verizon should not be a factor for their reluctance to run a bit more line to expand into the park. TDS can run their own lines or come to an agreement with Verizon to lease and possibly splice into their lines so they don't have to run new lines. Either way it's not like it's much line to run. They would have to just run line down the main road for the park then branch off to the driveways the homes are on for each residence that wants service. As it is they currently bypass the main road for the park and provide service on the roads parallel to the main road for the park and cut off service two houses past the road for the park.

The mobile data and satellite caps are just too low and overpriced; overpriced for mobile data at least, I understand satellite being vastly more limited, expensive to launch and maintain. I wouldn't have a problem with Verizon Lte if they bumped their lowly caps by 2x or 2.5x per plan without a price increase. As far as anything else, forget it.. Millenicom's max plan is 20GB plus lower priority on the Verizon network and hefty up front costs to set up service. I paid $50 for the device, got set up immediately through Verizon with no contract and receive great speeds with three bars of Lte and no antenna. Wireless N Wifi requires hefty up front set up costs as well and Sprint doesn't offer Lte here yet anyway so it's a lost cause atm.

Satellite and 3G are a no go because of higher latency, satellite is completely out of the question as I require a low latency connection. My internet activities also require a higher cap or no cap since I have games on Steam that receive updates so often, stream via Netflix, Youtube, Hulu, stream music, Windows updates, online multiplayer etc.. which none of the current options are able to satisfy without being subject to crippling speeds or paying out the nose. I could get by with a 50GB or 60GB cap per month providing it was offered at a decent affordable price but I'm not given that option.

Putting the below in quotes to try saving space and because it's an off topic semi-rant..

quote:
Someone needs to get on these providers cases and sign a law where internet is declared a utility and providers are required to invest in continually expanding and improving their infrastructure. What kind of bs is this that in when they cut copper landlines there is no plans to expand fiber to affected areas that were previously able to get landline service, I know there will be a hell of an uproar and a lot of unhappy people. The USA supposedly being so technological is stuck in the dark ages with broadband internet thanks to greedy companies too big for their own britches that need strict government regulation, laws in place to benefit consumers so they don't get screwed over. Go overseas in some countries and get faster speeds at a fraction of the cost we overpay in the USA. -_-

Think I could get anywhere with TDS? What if myself and several others in the area continually hound Verizon or Time Warner with daily multiple calls attempting to set up non-existent service? Think they would get tired or get the hint then relay anything to corporate to consider expanding service or just brush it off? Doubt that would work unless there was a singular number and location to call as we'd just be bounced between different essentially limitless call centers or eventually outsourced foreign support/billing.

It's just amazing and frustrating how much this country is regressing due to greed, wealth and financial/fame segregation so rural and lower income middle class or poverty level citizens are perceived as dirt not worthy of consideration.

Sorry for the long'ish post.

Xtreme2damax

join:2007-03-21
Port Byron, NY
reply to davidhoffman
If the FCC has no authority for that and expanding land based broadband then who does btw? The sooner land based broadband is declared a mandatory utility by law forcing providers to expand without metered usage bs (make that shiznit illegal) the better for everyone.
--


davidhoffman
Premium
join:2009-11-19
Warner Robins, GA
kudos:3

1 recommendation

A 67% majority in both chambers of the US Congress has to be made to see the lack of wired broadband as a significant national problem to be solved by the passage of legislation reclassifying it as a telecommunication service that the FCC and the states have regulatory authority over. The new laws must state that geographic coverage mandates are part of that new regulatory power.

Edit:

In addition the new law should allow the mandating of local loop unbundling to facilitate real competition.

davidhoffman
Premium
join:2009-11-19
Warner Robins, GA
kudos:3
reply to Xtreme2damax
TDS going into Verizon wired territory is unlikely to happen. It is not the DSL part, it is the wired voice part. Verizon would push back at the Public Utility Commission that TDS is somehow not a legitimate Competitive Local Exchange Carrier or something else that it sees as a violation of the laws and rules for voice service.

Organizing the park to support petitioning for help in possibly getting wired broadband is something to do. You have the New York State Universal Broadband agency. »nysbroadband.ny.gov/

»nysbroadband.ny.gov/Your-Interne ··· t-Access
»nysbroadband.ny.gov/nys-broadban ··· skforces
»nysbroadband.ny.gov/ConnectNY201 ··· ctNY2012

Organize your community to sign petitions addressed to this agency about the lack of wired broadband. Also have them go and fill out the information individually. Send copies of the filled out petitions to the representatives and senators in your state legislature. Send copies to your federal representatives and senators. Send copies to the local newspapers, radio news stations, and TV news stations.

Attach descriptions of how a lack of affordable wired broadband creates difficulties in employment searches, education, and healthcare. Talk about how affordable wired broadband would help people expand their knowledge about current events, increase civic participation, and create a high information community. Talk about the increased possibilities of viewing educational videos from around the globe concerning new discoveries in science. Have each family in the park come up with these items in their own words.

This may result in an eventual grant and/or loan that would create enough of an incentive for Verizon to expand DSL or FiOS to your area.

Another possible way forward is to find out who owns the closest houses or unused business locations that do have wired broadband. How far away are they? Any chance of the park purchasing or renting the location? If it is close enough, the park owner could then install WiFi gear at both the wired service location and the park to create a combination point to point and mesh WiFi internet access service. Of course he cannot legally charge for such a service as a separate line item, it would have to be included in any normal rental payments made to the park, if that is how the park works.

Xtreme2damax

join:2007-03-21
Port Byron, NY
I'll figure something out. I know my parents are sick of satellite and Hughesnet's bs so they are also looking for something else. They own their own home and to move it elsewhere would be too costly. Costs of moving are high plus moving all possessions, finding a place to rent that allows pets (nearly impossible nowadays) plus the fact my father works in Rochester all day everyday during the week.

I can't afford the security deposit to move nor have a way to move my stuff and have a cat I would likely have to find another home for. I like living close to my parents to help them out with stuff since I'm still quite young (30yrs), I have an entire mobile home to myself which beats a small apartment running the risk of pest infestations, a deck and yard to sit on/in. The area is quiet and at least fifteen to twenty feet of space between homes.

Houses aren't exactly sandwiched together but I think there might be enough to support expanding broadband. Surely there's areas further out with less houses and sufficient landline broadband service in other areas? The town is around a mile up the road, homes in the park and on the roads surrounding the park. We are six to ten miles out from the city and village. I wish I knew where the cutoff point for cable and fios were, if they have any lines running close by but decided to bypass the area and not offer service. Then I and other could start pushing to expand service this way. If TDS can offer DSL service then I don't see how there isn't enough homes for other providers to do the same. Most places at least have a reasonably priced fixed wisp offering unlimited or higher caps that mobile networks or broadband over power lines which no one does here. Enough with the cities; they have enough options already and don't need more, time to start focusing on semi-rural and rural areas. Better eat the cost to get it done and over with, make back what was spent then profit from there with the additional pools of new customers looking to dump dial up, satellite, mobile data.

As someone put it that I met on DSLReports and used to live in the park said, A lot of cheap old people around this area in general. Stuck in there ways." so it's no wonder why the area is in such sad shape broadband-wise with no one pushing for broadband expansion and access this way. Before he moved and looking at houses the real estate lady thought he was messing with her when he said he wouldn't buy a house if broadband (other than satellite, mobile) are not available there.
--


Xtreme2damax

join:2007-03-21
Port Byron, NY
reply to Xtreme2damax
It's too bad the data caps and prices are utter crap with mobile data because otherwise this would be more than sufficient for my needs:



Faster than dsl around the area and latency isn't too bad. I've seen downstream speeds up to 21 Mbps. Btw as I said Verizon is the only provider offering lte in my area atm else I would go with an mvno that offers a higher cap or unlimited. There aren't many Verizon mvno's yet and none are comparable to the options on the Sprint network such as Wireless N' Wifi. Preferably I'd also like to be able to re-use (BYOD) my current device that should work with mvno resellers.

Xtreme2damax

join:2007-03-21
Port Byron, NY
reply to Xtreme2damax
So if TDS has their own lines and infrastructure how come Verizon is stopping them from running lines into the park? Isn't this supposed to be a free market where there is supposed to be competition and we as consumers are supposed to have a choice?

TDS stops two friggin houses away but can't offer me dsl service because it would be "illegal" for them to do so because of Verizon. Verizon surely doesn't and won't offer FiOS or Dsl out here. I hate you so much Verizon and other providers who won't expand service out here. I will be waiting a life time while there has been areas further out than me that got hooked up with cable, fiber or ftth and dsl.

I wonder how the park is Verizon territory but two houses away is not. I mean there isn't even AT&T lines or service anywhere near here so everything and all lines are Verizon's. I wonder if there's any action I can take to get the ball rolling and release this area (the park) from the death grip of Verizon and have TDS take over the lines or at least Verizon buys TDS so we finally have a nearby terminal.

Xtreme2damax

join:2007-03-21
Port Byron, NY
reply to Xtreme2damax
Ahem *cough*


Hayward
K A R - 1 2 0 C
Premium
join:2000-07-13
Key West, FL
kudos:1
reply to Xtreme2damax
How far is two houses away and do you know them???

You could set up your own WiFi link to them. Maybe even contribut to them getting a higher speed package so you don't bog them down.

If you can get line of sight its not real expensive to do.
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Xtreme2damax

join:2007-03-21
Port Byron, NY
reply to Xtreme2damax
I'm just curious to know how come it's illegal for TDS to expand down into the park given they have their own lines, infrastructure, free market bs and lack of regulation or is it one of those weird things where regulation is only in effect when it benefits big business? How is the park Verizon territory but not two houses away, I think even the people on the corner of the road for the park are able to get TDS. As far as I know all lines are Verizon and there isn't even lines for AT&T around me so I can't believe there isn't Verizon lines where there are TDS lines.

The reason I want dsl is to get off wireless and on wired besides the non-existent or higher data caps. No.. I don't know the people in the houses that can get TDS dsl.

davidhoffman
Premium
join:2009-11-19
Warner Robins, GA
kudos:3
It would take a major research project to sort out all the federal and state laws, regulations, and court rulings that govern telephone service in your state. That is something I doubt people on this forum are able to devote time to. Perhaps these organizations could provide more insight:

»utilityproject.org/.

»www.nypirg.org/

»www.dps.ny.gov/

As a wild guess, the park may or may not have been part of a municipal annexation proceeding. The status of the park, in terms of being part of a city, may be a factor in why TDS does not service the area.


tschmidt
Premium,MVM
join:2000-11-12
Milford, NH
kudos:9
Reviews:
·FirstLight Fiber
·Hollis Hosting
·G4 Communications
reply to Xtreme2damax
I don't want to sound like a Verizon shill but it is hard to know exactly which addresses qualify for DSL and which do not until DSL is actually installed and cable distance, bridged taps and load coil status known. DSL is distance limited, sounds like you are right at the limit of what Verizon wants to support.

Have you checked to see if any competitive local exchange carriers (CLEC) service your area? They rent copper loop from the incumbent phone company, but other than that supply all their own equipment. They tend to be more aggressive pushing speed and distance. I'm in NH, Verizon limited me to 1.5Mbps, when FairPoint took over manged to get bumped to 3Mbps. Couple of years ago switched to a CLEC now I'm getting 6Mbps over the same copper phone line.

Check out your state's broadband mapping project to see if you have other options if you have not already done so.
»nysbroadband.ny.gov/

/tom

Xtreme2damax

join:2007-03-21
Port Byron, NY
I've looked into other options but came up empty handed, not even a fixed wisp or broadband over power lines which would be an inexpensive solution to running lines. I'm not sure where to look I just know I couldn't find any providers that service the area in the yellow pages or an online search.

I wish there was some kind of database or information for a broadband roadmap that tells which areas providers are planning to hook up with broadband. I was linked to a supposed roadmap but couldn't find anything informative with it and was unsure where to look on the roadmap to find my area.

Verizon can't/won't service the area with dsl cause their terminal is too far away and I doubt they will install a new one closer. TDS stops two houses past the road the park is on but won't come into the park because the park is Verizon territory and for some asinine reason it's illegal for them to run lines into a Verizon area and offer service. Free market and competition my behind..

I'm currently on wireless lte through Verizon wireless but the caps are not nearly high enough and it's way too expensive. I'm not even *that* far out, the park is six to ten miles at most outside the city/village and there is likely fiber even close than that; it takes around ten to fifteen minutes tops to go from here to the city/village. There is a town just up the road around a mile and plenty of homes as far as I can tell.

Sprint doesn't offer lte here, technically Verizon doesn't either but I can get three bars of lte off a Verizon tower around a mile and a half or two away. At least the Verizon coverage map shows lte being available just north of me by the thruway which is around a mile and a half away but didn't factor in my area on their coverage map as being covered by lte. For Sprint, AT&T last I checked their map didn't show lte being near me. There is a much more limited selection of Verizon mvno resellers and an even more limited selection of solely data oriented mvno resellers.


tschmidt
Premium,MVM
join:2000-11-12
Milford, NH
kudos:9
Reviews:
·FirstLight Fiber
·Hollis Hosting
·G4 Communications
The NY broadband web site is pretty ugly, have you tried to plug in your address?

Click NHS mapping project -- statewide broadband map -- and plug in your address under the section "Find Broadband Where You Live."

»www.broadbandmap.ny.gov/

That page also has an option to "Report and unserved address." don't know what happens but it can't hurt.

/tom

davidhoffman
Premium
join:2009-11-19
Warner Robins, GA
kudos:3

1 recommendation

reply to Xtreme2damax
Broadband over Power Lines(BPL) is a disaster. The biggest problem is that it generated enormous amounts of interference with some existing radio frequency uses. The next was that the signal attenuated faster than the theory it was based on said it should. These are some reasons for electric utilities to build out Smart Grid networks using fiber optics to each meter or premises. No radio frequency interference and much longer signal travel.

Xtreme2damax

join:2007-03-21
Port Byron, NY
reply to tschmidt
So my choices that shows is Verizon DSL which is actually not available at my address and Verizon needs to fix in their database. Then wireless or satellite, neither of which is suitable for my broadband needs.

lol..

In ten years it hasn't been worth the wait.

Edit: Not sure why TDS doesn't show but their service is available just not in the park.

jbrewno

join:2010-01-21
Port Byron, NY
Reviews:
·TDS Communications
I think the park is the cutoff. To the south of the park is tds. The park itself and all points north verizon. I say this just because my buddy lives on the rd near the park actually one house past it to the north and he cant get nothing either. Or my father for that matter. I emailed those people in syracuse that were doing the broadband over power lines. That was a couple years ago and they werent interested. The only thing i could see happening some day is maybe cable in the area. Possibly fios but i heard they were done expanding it. If i was in your position id probably just go the millenicom route and not use the net as much lol. Its really a shame.

Xtreme2damax

join:2007-03-21
Port Byron, NY
When you say south you mean towards turnpike or towards the town of montezuma where the thruway is?

Do they go past the road for the park or stop short? I misunderstood and thought you said they go two houses past the road for the park.

I'm gonna try to get people on board and sign off on a petition. Would be nice to know how close the cutoff for cable, dsl and fios is. I remember back in 2006 and online friend said I should be able to get fios soon because it's not distance limited like dsl and can go farther than anything else being fiber optics. He forgot to account for the greed of service providers and lack of concern or care for providing reliable broadband to anything other than urban mass populated areas.

davidhoffman
Premium
join:2009-11-19
Warner Robins, GA
kudos:3
It looks like you have about 50 residences in the area around Carner Road that need broadband. Do the petition thing, hold Broadband BBQ picnics to discuss progress, knock on those neighbors doors. See if Accutone Piano Services
7486 Fuller Rd Port Byron, NY 13140 (315) 255-1337 »www.accutonepiano.com is interested in helping.

jbrewno

join:2010-01-21
Port Byron, NY
reply to Xtreme2damax
Im pretty sure the service literally to the park than thats it. Dont quote me on it lol. By south i meant towards turnpike north towards zuma lol duh.

jbrewno

join:2010-01-21
Port Byron, NY
Lol i mixed up direction in first post. My bad.

Xtreme2damax

join:2007-03-21
Port Byron, NY
reply to jbrewno
Ah gotcha on that. I'll see what I can do, I wonder should I go down turnpike as well or no and other side roads to hit all I can?

Would help if there was a way to find the cutoff point for dsl, cable and fios to see how much work expansion would be. Is there not any information about upcoming deployments for broadband in specific areas?

Ninja edit: Just saw your next reply while I was typing this.

jbrewno

join:2010-01-21
Port Byron, NY
Yeah id do turnpike, fosterville to the south of park, laraway, baldwin, townsend, gable, beach, all them roads.

davidhoffman
Premium
join:2009-11-19
Warner Robins, GA
kudos:3
reply to Xtreme2damax
The private ISPs rarely give out expansion plans. The traditional telephone and cable companies do not. I have seen USI Fiber do it for Minneapolis MN and Google Fiber does it The public utilities that provide broadband usually do it.

Xtreme2damax

join:2007-03-21
Port Byron, NY
reply to Xtreme2damax
I see, what about the cutoff points or seeing if fiber/cable runs right by me? If no one can tell me that is there a way I can figure it out myself? Is there telltale signs of where fiber/cable runs, boxes and specific cables I can spot?

davidhoffman
Premium
join:2009-11-19
Warner Robins, GA
kudos:3
I do not know about your area, but out here AT&T has these gray pipes sticking up out of the ground. They are from 2 feet to 4 feet tall. They have stickers on them that indicate there is a buried fiber optic cable associated with the pipe's location. The usual "Please call before you dig." signs are sometimes nearby or the equivalent sticker is on the pipe. The poles can be spaced a few hundred feet apart along the roadside.

The cable guys in my neighborhood are all up on the telephone poles, but they have warning signs similar to AT&T's if they have buried cable or fiber.

You could make a spreadsheet of addresses along the roads nearby and call in a few each day to the various broadband providers and ask if they service a particular address. You can tell them you are considering moving to the location but need to know what internet services are available before deciding.

Xtreme2damax

join:2007-03-21
Port Byron, NY
reply to Xtreme2damax
Alright thanks. I guess it's up to me to get the ball rolling (wish it wasn't lol) since no one else is bothered enough or concerned to do so.