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ZZZZZZZ
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join:2001-05-27
PARADISE

ZZZZZZZ

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[Serious] Canada Post being sued

»cnews.canoe.ca/CNEWS/Can ··· 841.html

by employees............this seems like a lost cause,with the boxes already in place .

But there have been a ton of burglaries............so who knows?

Thane_Bitter
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join:2005-01-20

Thane_Bitter

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said by ZZZZZZZ:

But there have been a ton of burglaries.

And a lot of mail seems to vanish in the system, or end up in letter carrier homes as well.

Here is the real concern "Union president Denis Lemelin is upset because 8,000 of his members will be out of work." Denis Lemelin, union leader doesn't want to have his pay-cheque reduced in size.

What is killing Canada Poste is the outrageous jump in the cost of a single stamp, if the USPS increased their stamps by the same amount the public would rise and raise the post offices.

HiVolt
Premium Member
join:2000-12-28
Toronto, ON

HiVolt

Premium Member

I don't understand why they just can't do 3 day delivery. Monday, Wednesday, Friday... That will save a lot of money and a good portion of people can still have jobs.
PX Eliezer1
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join:2013-03-10
Zubrowka USA

PX Eliezer1 to Thane_Bitter

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to Thane_Bitter
said by Thane_Bitter:

What is killing Canada Poste is the outrageous jump in the cost of a single stamp, if the USPS increased their stamps by the same amount the public would rise and raise the post offices.

Wow! Is it 85 cents now for Canada Post (75 cents for postage meters).

That's a death wish. It ignores basic economics.

USPS is 49 cents and even that's a killer.

-----

Canada is a huge country, but the USPS rate gets your letter from Maine to Alaska or Hawaii which is pretty far too.
graniterock
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join:2003-03-14
London, ON

1 recommendation

graniterock

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When a restaurant I know either reduces hours to save money or raises prices so they can afford the plaza rent (due to lack of customers not popularity) it's usually a good sign they won't be around in 6 months.

Thane_Bitter
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Thane_Bitter to HiVolt

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to HiVolt
That would help CP, not the union of course.

dirtyjeffer0
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join:2002-02-21
London, ON

dirtyjeffer0 to ZZZZZZZ

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i still don't understand the uproar...if people still demand home delivery, then increase the price of stamps/mailing to cover the costs...if that makes a stamp $2, so what??...$2 to mail something across the country is cheap.

Thane_Bitter
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Thane_Bitter to PX Eliezer1

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to PX Eliezer1
No kidding, my x-mass card list has been slashed.
The jump was BS, a five or ten cent increase would have been more reasonable, with this quantum leap most people will drop mail and sign up for paperless transactions.

Its like Sony's handling of Beta, it was a better product but no one wanted to pay their insane licencing fees so VHS won despite its inferior quality.
Thane_Bitter

Thane_Bitter to dirtyjeffer0

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to dirtyjeffer0
Funny you say that, it cost be a buck twenty to mail one card to a city away, that was a week ago and hasn't arrived yet.

Service Quality and Price, you don't get any of that with "Poste Canada".

modemport
join:2013-08-26
Montreal, QC

modemport to ZZZZZZZ

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to ZZZZZZZ
it's a stupid lawsuit and they're going to lose.

does the union head want to save everyone's jobs ? probably. do i give a shit that overpaid postal workers with massive benefits and the union people who are even better off will lose their jobs ? no.

the avg working joe schmo earns nothing near what these people earn, and damn few of them have any sort of significant benefits. so cry me a river i'm underwhelmed.

i read an article yesterday about an entrepreneur in a major middle canada city who's starting a business - an individual, for 30$ a month, can pay him to pick up their mail at the community box twice a week. he's planning on doing the same for businesses at a higher cost. he wants to expand into a few other cities in eastern canada.

when the postal union heard about it they went nuts. "how fucking dare he".
you know what ? if i had a community box, i'd do it. i'm perfectly able to get out and get there for myself, but for a crappy 30$ i'd be happy to have him do it.

as to me doing any mailing - in the past 12 months i've mailed out exactly 2 letters. the cost is effing disgusting and disturbing.

3 yrs ago a friend in florida mailed me a portable hard drive; 5$USD. i mailed it back with my info on it and it was 10$CDN.
so don't hand me this shit about a massive price increase and justify it with garbage rhetoric.
christ knows what that same hard drive mailed to him would cost now.

it's sink or swim. /no one/ has job guarantees. if people joined a public corporation with a union thinking they had cushy jobs for life, then take this as a goddamn wakeup call. grossly overpaid jobs held by people with little to no education doesn't merit 50k/yr.

if it means they end up at mcdo's for minimum wage, i won't lose a second of sleep.

i did everything i had to so i could end up with enough skills to guarantee i'll never worry about a job again. if you can stand behind a cash and say 'that'll be 1.68$ please sir' for 25$/hr, more power to you. but when you lose that job and can't get another for half the price cos your job skills are marginal, don't whine to me cos i'm not interested.

Ian1
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join:2002-06-18
ON

Ian1 to Thane_Bitter

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to Thane_Bitter
said by Thane_Bitter:

What is killing Canada Poste is the outrageous jump in the cost of a single stamp,

No, what is killing Canada Post is the demise of letter mail. It's simply obsolete, regardless of how expensive it is. If stamps were free, I'd still prefer to receive, and pay my bills electronically.

They'll still have parcels to deliver, but that's about it....

If I were the judge I'd refuse to hear their case. They have none. Violates charter of rights and freedoms? Please. If that were true, where were they for the 2/3rds of Canadians not getting home delivery now? And where is the right to receive mail at your door enshrined? It's unfair to the elderly and disabled? Well, lots of things are. Should they get home delivery of groceries, drugs, and whatever else too?

Thane_Bitter
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Thane_Bitter

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But without home delivery how would I know about pre-arranged funerals, what my useless MP is taking credit for in Ottawa, coupons to stores I don't shop at or which real estate agent is trying to break into the area.

You do have a point but paperless doesn't necessary work for all things, but the rise of paperless transactions has certainly has taken away CP's paper monopoly and as such they need to adjust.
PX Eliezer1
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Zubrowka USA

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said by dirtyjeffer0:

i still don't understand the uproar...if people still demand home delivery, then increase the price of stamps/mailing to cover the costs...if that makes a stamp $2, so what??...$2 to mail something across the country is cheap.

Again you have to compare to peer group.

USPS (which gets no govt subsidy) can do it for 49 cents. Why does Canada Post need 85 cents?

They are both big countries ocean to ocean....

And USPS still delivers 6 days a week, Canada Post 5 days a week (often less than that from what I hear ).
PX Eliezer1

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to Ian1
said by Ian1:

said by Thane_Bitter:

What is killing Canada Poste is the outrageous jump in the cost of a single stamp,

No, what is killing Canada Post is the demise of letter mail. It's simply obsolete, regardless of how expensive it is.

That's true but they seem to want to help it along.

Such sharp jumps in the price of a stamp are the equivalent of postal euthanasia.

Ian1
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join:2002-06-18
ON

Ian1

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said by PX Eliezer1:

That's true but they seem to want to help it along.

Such sharp jumps in the price of a stamp are the equivalent of postal euthanasia.

As well they should. They should have charged the last few hold-outs communicating by telegraph an arm and a leg for each as well.
mr weather
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join:2002-02-27
Mississauga, ON

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I still get a decent amount of lettermail because all of my bills come on paper. We've had a disasterous experience with electronic invoices and decided never again until the problems get straightened out.

For example, Mrs. Weather decided to go electronic for her PC Financial Master Card. Well, for two months she never received an email - or any other notification - that her MC invoice was due. It wasn't until she called that they said "Oh, we don't send you an alert you have to remember to go to the PC Financial website and download your bill". Fuck that.

Kitlope
join:2004-07-29
Edmonton, Ab

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said by modemport:

does the union head want to save everyone's jobs ? probably. do i give a shit that overpaid postal workers with massive benefits and the union people who are even better off will lose their jobs ? no.

Be sure to pat yourself on the back when the middle class is all but gone. It's people like you that's killing it. Congrats!

Twenty Five an hour is not much money these days.

A Lurker
that's Ms Lurker btw
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join:2007-10-27
Wellington N

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By the employees it's likely a lost cause. The ones most affect are customers who either bought in an area before the announcement or people who have lived in the areas for decades. It will (as noted) affect some seniors and the elderly.

Where I live now we have a box, it's been here since the homes were built, so you know what you're getting. Where I moved from were 40-50 year old homes with a few people living there since they were built.

I know the community I left, and there were a couple of people I'd have asked for their keys and picked up their mail (even if we didn't share a box). I'm also sure that someone else will pick up that slack (almost certainly not the people who bought my place from what I understand). Hey, I lived on a street where 3 (then 4) different people would plow more than their own driveways with their snowblowers in the morning. In fact sometimes it was a competition to see who could do the most extra driveways.

Not all people with these challenges will have the support system. And they (may be) the ones to suffer if someone jacked up the postal rate to $2 as someone suggested.

nitzguy
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join:2002-07-11
Sudbury, ON

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to mr weather
said by mr weather:

I still get a decent amount of lettermail because all of my bills come on paper. We've had a disasterous experience with electronic invoices and decided never again until the problems get straightened out.

For example, Mrs. Weather decided to go electronic for her PC Financial Master Card. Well, for two months she never received an email - or any other notification - that her MC invoice was due. It wasn't until she called that they said "Oh, we don't send you an alert you have to remember to go to the PC Financial website and download your bill". Fuck that.

The killer for cp will be when government cheques are phased out by April 2016. With no cpp or OAS cheques to mail out their volume is going to plummet....also as an FYI to people...get on the direct deposit train now....you have a yr and half but better to do it not vs getting caught in the crunch like the whole passport fiasco because you better believe the govt isn't going to add people to process these direct deposit applications.
peterboro (banned)
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join:2006-11-03
Peterborough, ON

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to mr weather
said by mr weather:

I still get a decent amount of lettermail because all of my bills come on paper.

All my bills come by paper and I pay them at the bank. This whole house of cards electronic bullshit should be fun to watch collapse.
vintagewino
join:2003-07-22
Grimsby, ON

vintagewino to PX Eliezer1

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to PX Eliezer1
said by PX Eliezer1:

said by Ian1:

said by Thane_Bitter:

What is killing Canada Poste is the outrageous jump in the cost of a single stamp,

No, what is killing Canada Post is the demise of letter mail. It's simply obsolete, regardless of how expensive it is.

That's true but they seem to want to help it along.

Such sharp jumps in the price of a stamp are the equivalent of postal euthanasia.


Another thing that will hurt badly is the decline of stamp collectors.
The numbers have been dropping, and serious collectors would collect a single issue in sheet, matched corner blocks, set of 9, pair, single. All mint. That's a lot of cash for a single stamp for a collection! The quality of stamps had plummeted, and I was asking the question as to when to stop my collection. The answer for me became the sesquicentennial of the Canadian post office. Postal rates were 47 Canada, 60 to the States, $1.05 international. Compare with 85, $1.20, $2.50, respectively now (oh, don't forget the HST on those, either!!)

Where Canada Post may get into awful doo-doo is when collectors collapse their collections from 1980 to present, and there is a glut of mint stamps being used for common postage. After all, they are still legal stamps! I have seen dealers do that, as well as many collectors that are "giving up". Makes for a very interesting cover. Best one I have seen had 85 1c stamps on it! Barely enough room for the label and a return address!

Keep it up, CP! The end is near ...

This is an interesting link on the cost of postage in Canada:
»www.adminware.ca/checkli ··· rate.htm
PX Eliezer1
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join:2013-03-10
Zubrowka USA

PX Eliezer1

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said by vintagewino:

Makes for a very interesting cover. Best one I have seen had 85 1c stamps on it!

Our guy Benjamin Franklin who opened the first Canadian post office in Halifax (1753) knew the value of a penny or even 85 of them....

digitalfutur
Sees More Than Shown
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join:2000-07-15
GTA

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to ZZZZZZZ
70% of Canada's households don't currently have mail delivery to their door, so CUPW logic is faulty to say the least. But union bosses and logical arguments are almost always mutually exclusive.

As well, Canada Post has already said that they will deliver mail to the disabled if it's uncollected past one week in the superbox.

Thane_Bitter
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The mint has gone wacky that way as well, they produce far too many different coins, you would have to be a well paid executive to buy one example of each of the designs they roll out every year.

For the investor you might as well just stick with their gold or silver coins.

dirtyjeffer0
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London, ON

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said by PX Eliezer1:

said by dirtyjeffer0:

i still don't understand the uproar...if people still demand home delivery, then increase the price of stamps/mailing to cover the costs...if that makes a stamp $2, so what??...$2 to mail something across the country is cheap.

Again you have to compare to peer group.

USPS (which gets no govt subsidy) can do it for 49 cents. Why does Canada Post need 85 cents?

They are both big countries ocean to ocean....

And USPS still delivers 6 days a week, Canada Post 5 days a week (often less than that from what I hear ).

economies of scale...cost of doing business in each respective country...possibly even pay/benefits as well...i'd need to see everything in order to answer that completely, but i'll bet it is simply more expensive to deliver the same service here, likely through sheer volume alone.

look, if Joe Mailman is delivering mail in your subdivision, he gets paid the same if he delivers 200 pieces of mail, or 300 pieces...just an extra letter in each mailbox...not a big deal, but that is a 50% increase to revenue for the Postal company...sure, maybe some added cost with the increased volume, but not in a linear fashion.

AppleGuy
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join:2013-09-08
Kitchener, ON

AppleGuy to PX Eliezer1

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It's 85 cents because I do believe that Canada Post employee's make more than the US counterparts. A FT Letter Carrier will make $54,000/year -- that includes flyer bonus. More if you take overtime. Less and less letters/bills are being sent out, so revenue per Letter Carrier is dropping. The profit isn't there for that division anymore. Parcel delivery is still okay. I have a friend getting out of the letter carrier business to drive transit. Transit drivers make about $52,000 year, but at least don't have to deal with the 'elements' -- other than unruly riders. Plus benefits/pension is equal or better than Canada Post.
AppleGuy

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Also, $1.95 to mail "letter" mail to PEI from Ontario. Regular size envelope holding maybe 10 sheets of 8"11". (standard size paper, folded twice) That's a lot of dough for 35 grams of paper.
NCRGuy
join:2008-03-03
Ottawa, ON

NCRGuy

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If you're paying that much, it is not standard letter mail.

AppleGuy
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Kitchener, ON

AppleGuy to Thane_Bitter

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said by Thane_Bitter:

The mint has gone wacky that way as well, they produce far too many different coins, you would have to be a well paid executive to buy one example of each of the designs they roll out every year.

For the investor you might as well just stick with their gold or silver coins.

I was thinking that the other day when I had a handful of quarters (maybe 14) and on 3 were regular. 1 was non-standard USA $, rest was non-standard Canadian $.
AppleGuy

AppleGuy to NCRGuy

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Standard to them is now 4 or 5 sheets in a regular envelope. I had 10 sheets. So, technically you're correct, what I did wasn't 'standard' letter mail.