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dandelion
MVM
join:2003-04-29
Germantown, TN

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dandelion to JoelC707

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Re: New home design ideas

I would think a lift would be nice.. but am old fashioned i.e. how long do things like that last, what is the upkeep etc. I had a recliner for my Mom that helped lift her from the chair lasted quite a long while however. Standard doorways should be fine unless you have to get an extra wide wheelchair due to body weight. I had to widen the door for a narrow wheelchair to move through however. It was just my house had typical small doorways inside not as wide as the front door. The bathroom was big enough to allow a wheelchair however I had help to lift her to the toilet.. a lift wouldn't have fit in it. I kept a VERY large kitchen table long past it's expiration date due to the fact it was so heavy when she pulled on it to stand she couldn't move it. I have also read horror stories of the elderly being confined to the first floor of their home unable to get upstairs anymore yet also unable to move to a different home.. I would highly advise one story lift or not. *shrugs* Even appliances are best wheelchair height. Those links should help with some minor things to think about.

PS I would be VERY concerned of someone wobbly on a staircase unless you have help to assist her walking? Of course I would never have thought of assisted living or nursing home for my Mom so that is also an option later on if you wish.
18189353 (banned)
join:2014-10-28

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said by JoelC707:

Hmm, so are "in-law suites" going to force it to be considered a multi-unit/multi-family dwelling? If I want to keep it as a single-family status, does the room itself need main-house access or can it be done through a shared bathroom? I'm still undecided on how I want to do that change but if one way is going to kick it into another classification that would likely make the decision for me.

It just has to be connected via conditioned space so a bathroom would qualify.

LazMan
Premium Member
join:2003-03-26
Beverly Hills, CA

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From a design point of view - there's zero privacy in your single-story design... Pretty much every bedroom door opens straight into the living room area.

Also, while passing through the bathroom to connect your mom's room to the main house may be allowable; it's awkward, IMO; and will hurt you in resale.

That said - designing a new home from scratch is a journey, we went through probably 5-6 major design revisions, and who knows how many small ones - and even after you build it, you'll discover a half dozen things you'd have done differently, if you got a do-over...

I can rhyme off 3-4 things right now that I wish I'd done differently in the house I had built 3 years ago...
JoelC707
Premium Member
join:2002-07-09
Lanett, AL

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JoelC707 to dandelion

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said by dandelion:

I would think a lift would be nice.. but am old fashioned i.e. how long do things like that last, what is the upkeep etc.

I wondered that too. I can certainly see the advantage of actually designing it in but if I install it now, whose to say it'll be worthy of use when the time comes to use it? She may never need it and the rest of us may never as well but if we do, it could be many years if not decades down the road (she is only 54) for all we know. I'd hate to install something now (especially something that expensive and complex) on a "what if" and A) never need it or B) it need major repairs/replacement before we do need it.
said by dandelion:

Standard doorways should be fine unless you have to get an extra wide wheelchair due to body weight.

My grandmother was diabetic and probably 300-400 pounds or so. I don't think her wheel chair was extra wide (it was wider than normal sure but not too wide) as it did fit through doors alright. She didn't push herself but one thing I did notice is that while it fit though the doors, there was no room for your hands to be on the wheels so she would have had to pull herself through the door by the frame (possible but not ideal). That's what you're referring to with an extra wide chair, right?
said by dandelion:

PS I would be VERY concerned of someone wobbly on a staircase unless you have help to assist her walking? Of course I would never have thought of assisted living or nursing home for my Mom so that is also an option later on if you wish.

Agreed. She handles the few short steps around the house now alright (we re-purposed the front door ramp we built last year onto the front of her camper so she didn't have stairs there). The most she has to traverse are I think 5-6 on the back deck or 5-6 on the front landing. Sure, no stairs would be ideal but we deal with what we have at the moment. It's the longer full flight stairs I (and she too) really worries about which is why in all of thee design, she does not traverse them if they are present.
JoelC707

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said by LazMan:

From a design point of view - there's zero privacy in your single-story design... Pretty much every bedroom door opens straight into the living room area.

Also, while passing through the bathroom to connect your mom's room to the main house may be allowable; it's awkward, IMO; and will hurt you in resale.

That said - designing a new home from scratch is a journey, we went through probably 5-6 major design revisions, and who knows how many small ones - and even after you build it, you'll discover a half dozen things you'd have done differently, if you got a do-over...

I can rhyme off 3-4 things right now that I wish I'd done differently in the house I had built 3 years ago...

Awesome! This is the kind of feedback I was hoping for on my designs. What would you suggest I do to redesign the 1-story house so that the rooms have more privacy? Does the second floor of the other house suffer from the same issues given they all open up to the loft or whatever you want to call that (I figured that'd be a great place to put the 360 and the Wii with their space needing sensors lol).

You do bring up a valid point about it being awkward as the only path through to the room. Maybe do both and have the room and the bathroom open to the main house so there's access and can share the bathroom for the main floor? It'll mean redesigning the room there more than before but I have an idea how to do that already.

Corehhi
join:2002-01-28
Bluffton, SC

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There are many house design sites on the web, I just looked up 6 bedroom homes and got many dual family layouts. You might be able to modify one of those or find another plan out there. Since you have lots of time you might want to look up plans until you have a big library in your head.

You could modify this one. Multistory duplex.
»www.familyhomeplans.com/ ··· er=90891

Just to give you an idea what's out there.

This one is nice looking but cost wise that would be getting up there.
»www.familyhomeplans.com/ ··· er=99278

Msradell
Premium Member
join:2008-12-25
Louisville, KY

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said by StephenRC:

Any disabled persons? The bathrooms need handicap access and accessories. If there isn't, make sure the bathrooms are able to become ADA compliant.

You are on the right track here in reality ADA compliance isn't a consideration in a private home, the law doesn't apply here. Obviously, accessibility for disabled person needs to be taken into account but there are ways to do it that are much more aesthetic and functional that don't meet the true letter of the law for ADA standards. We remodeled our home when I became disabled, there are many things that don't really meet the true ADA standards but are actually better for someone for me that they would be if they met the standards. Think about what would help somebody instead of what the standards require.
JoelC707
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join:2002-07-09
Lanett, AL

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said by Corehhi:

There are many house design sites on the web, I just looked up 6 bedroom homes and got many dual family layouts. You might be able to modify one of those or find another plan out there. Since you have lots of time you might want to look up plans until you have a big library in your head.

Yeah, this has been a brainstorm off and on for a couple of years now. We've been looking at home plans and such for a while and decided to start developing our own. Time is plentiful right now (for designing anyway lol) so that's why I'm starting this now, get it right at the get go.
said by Msradell:

We remodeled our home when I became disabled, there are many things that don't really meet the true ADA standards but are actually better for someone for me that they would be if they met the standards. Think about what would help somebody instead of what the standards require.

That's an excellent point. I knew ADA didn't exactly pertain to a private residence but it does give guidance in terms of what to do if you need to meet ADA compliance. I would prefer to do it your way too, just because it doesn't meet the letter of the law, it may fit better in your specific situation.
MaynardKrebs
We did it. We heaved Steve. Yipee.
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join:2009-06-17

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Two storey house will be more energy efficient (ratio of wall:ceiling) vs. one storey house.

With a basement, your water heaters and furnace-a/c are located in the basement - it's more energy efficient that way. You could put laundry down there too - many 2 storey homes in my area have chutes from the 2nd floor down to the laundry area - just shove your dirty clothes in the chute and their gone. Your basement becomes additional living space/storage as well. That way the attic is properly sealed/vented from the living space below and you save money on structuring the attic floor to carry extra weight of all your junk.

Suggest you do a basement with a shelter room - Alabama gets tornados once in a while.

Why not install an elevator if you go 2 storey (w/wo a basement)? Under $20k all in for a 3 stop system. Makes the whole house accessible. And you bring the clean laundry upstairs in the elevator - no breaking your back or slipping on stairs carrying it (stair falls are also a consideration for the elderly - bad news).

Just a suggestion - don't put beds in corners - they're a pain to make (unless your maid does them each day). Soundproof the bedroom areas from the rest of the house.

Door swing from garage to kitchen area in both floor plans is backwards . You want the hinge on the right.

You need to get a civil engineer/architect to stamp all your construction drawings for load bearing. Maybe your location lets people build with matchsticks and Visio plans, but not where I'm from.
JoelC707
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join:2002-07-09
Lanett, AL

JoelC707

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said by MaynardKrebs:

(stair falls are also a consideration for the elderly - bad news).

Elderly hell, Steph and I have fallen on stairs and were not even 30 LOL. That's cheaper than I expected for an elevator, I figured another zero or so on that cost. Not sure I'd do one but you never know.
said by MaynardKrebs:

Two storey house will be more energy efficient (ratio of wall:ceiling) vs. one storey house.

With a basement, your water heaters and furnace-a/c are located in the basement - it's more energy efficient that way. You could put laundry down there too - many 2 storey homes in my area have chutes from the 2nd floor down to the laundry area - just shove your dirty clothes in the chute and their gone. Your basement becomes additional living space/storage as well. That way the attic is properly sealed/vented from the living space below and you save money on structuring the attic floor to carry extra weight of all your junk.

This is true, two story houses (even a one story with finish basement) tend to be cheaper to build too because of smaller footprint for roof and slab/footings. I'm strongly leaning towards the two story or designing a one story with basement (valid point on the tornadoes and somewhere to go...).
said by MaynardKrebs:

Just a suggestion - don't put beds in corners - they're a pain to make (unless your maid does them each day). Soundproof the bedroom areas from the rest of the house.

That's a good point. For just me, my bed was always in the corner (no need to get to both sides like you would with a partner in the bed too) and no it wasn't as easy to make, it was more difficult that it could have been. All rooms will be as sound proofed as possible for sure.
said by MaynardKrebs:

Door swing from garage to kitchen area in both floor plans is backwards . You want the hinge on the right.

Which side of the door are you referring to? Garage side or kitchen side? Does the same apply to the front door too and back/side doors?
said by MaynardKrebs:

You need to get a civil engineer/architect to stamp all your construction drawings for load bearing. Maybe your location lets people build with matchsticks and Visio plans, but not where I'm from.

I'd planned on it. I can tell you the code enforcement here is VERY lax (there were things done with this trailer I'm in now that I would not have done and know would have been flagged had an inspection been done) but just because it's lax and I could half-ass it doesn't mean I will. That was one of the reasons I asked about the load bearing walls needing to be upgraded to 2x6 instead of 2x4.

John97
Over The Hills And Far Away
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join:2000-11-14
Spring Hill, FL

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I own a large (over 3100 sqft) single-story home and my 82 year-old mother-in-law lives with us along with my adult stepson. So, I'll pass on some suggestions based upon the features of my home and my experience in this situation.

1) If you really want to go single-story, consider an alternate shape (something other than square or rectangular). My home is L-shaped and what this provides is basically a separate "wing" where my MIL and stepson are. Our master suite is on the opposite end of the house so, privacy isn't a problem for anyone. The MIL and stepson both have their own full bathrooms that are adjacent to their bedrooms. The fact that everyone has their own space is one of the primary reasons I bought this particular house.

2) Install two water heaters. We have one that supplies the master suite, hall half-bath, and laundry room. The other supplies the kitchen and the other two full bathrooms. Both are 40-gallon units and are located at opposite ends of the house, so we don't have to wait long for hot water as each unit feeds locations that are nearby.
JoelC707
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join:2002-07-09
Lanett, AL

JoelC707

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Interestingly, what started this was an idea Steph had for a U shaped house. This let us have a "secure" yard directly behind the house with the option of still using the rest of the yard for other things too. It was an interesting design for sure but fits perfectly with your suggestion. Thanks for the idea.

John97
Over The Hills And Far Away
Premium Member
join:2000-11-14
Spring Hill, FL

John97

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U-shaped, interesting. We have a screened pool/lanai area "inside the L" so we have a somewhat secure area. Between that, the fenced yard, and a protective yellow Lab, it works out well.
JoelC707
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join:2002-07-09
Lanett, AL

JoelC707

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Click for full size
Whatcha think?

Slab around the left side and back is driveway + carport. Kitchen seems QUITE big lol. patio in the center, chainlink fence cordoning it off some.

guppy_fish
Premium Member
join:2003-12-09
Palm Harbor, FL

guppy_fish

Premium Member

I think its time to check with reality.

Do you have 30K-40K for a down payment for this custom home?
Have you looked into the requirement for a mortgage, read up on debt to income. Your going to need 70K plus income with close to no other debts

It is fun to what if and dream
JoelC707
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join:2002-07-09
Lanett, AL

JoelC707

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Yes, I already know this. As I said, this is something that will come well into the future. I'd rather flesh out all the issues now and be called "dreaming" than to wait until the last minute and be scrambling when I actually get to where I can do this. And yes, I have already looked into mortgages, debt-to-income ratios and everything else. I already know this isn't something I can do right this minute.

PoloDude
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join:2006-03-29
Aiken, SC

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Now, next question. Site built or Modular?
We are hoping to build in 2 - 3 years in SC. Going modular.
JoelC707
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join:2002-07-09
Lanett, AL

JoelC707

Premium Member

Probably site built. Honestly the lot next to us is vacant and we might can obtain that to build on. On the thought of doing as much as possible ourselves, site built would be best I think. What's your reason for going modular?

I know someone who used to work for Builders First Source and we got an entire house delivered to us for free many years ago because someone screwed up and didn't put in the vaulted ceilings so the entire house had to be rebuilt. I was grateful for all the lumber but after getting a close look at their "studs" (looked like a bunch of scraps fingered together) I wasn't impressed with their build quality.

guppy_fish
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join:2003-12-09
Palm Harbor, FL

guppy_fish

Premium Member

True modular homes are the same if not better lumber than site built, They have no frames like mobile homes do and have to withstand the journey to the site from the factory. Owned one once from new and when finished out, there is nothing to tell it came in sections.
JoelC707
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join:2002-07-09
Lanett, AL

JoelC707

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Yeah, I flat refuse to do a trailer but a modular home would be OK if they can do the final design I come up with and all. I'd just prefer real studs, not finger spliced scraps (and it wasn't just a few it was every stud in every wall just about).

PoloDude
Premium Member
join:2006-03-29
Aiken, SC

PoloDude

Premium Member

A modular home is NOT a trailer (manufactured) home. They are generally better built than on site homes as they are built in a controlled environment. Inspectors on site there. You can get just about any type / design made.
Being that you are in AL. you wont have the delays from bad weather at the build site.

Try here to start »modulararchitecture.com/ ··· lar-faqs
JoelC707
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join:2002-07-09
Lanett, AL

JoelC707

Premium Member

No, I know that they are different. Depending on cost a modular home could be a good idea, I didn't even think about that. Thanks for the link.

Corehhi
join:2002-01-28
Bluffton, SC

Corehhi

Member

said by JoelC707:

No, I know that they are different. Depending on cost a modular home could be a good idea, I didn't even think about that. Thanks for the link.

I was in a modular home, I couldn't notice the difference from a stick built home. This wasn't a small house either probably 3,200 sq ft if you count the garage. Front porch etc. I don't know the cost difference but worth checking into.
seederjed
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join:2005-02-28
Norcross, GA

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seederjed to JoelC707

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A few quick thoughts:

1 story plan -
- As mentioned before, the door from the garage to kitchen needs to open towards the kitchen so it doesn't block the stairs
- Go with a steep roof pitch. This gives you plenty of headroom for HVAC, WH and plenty of storage, possibly negating the need for the storage room
-Safe room in case of tornado?
-Hang a vent hood over the stove and run the piping parallel to the framing

2 Story
-2 HVAC units - main floor and second floor are separated and much easier to control the temps
-Use Silent floor I-Joists for the floor framing. This offers the possability of longer floor spans using fewer bearing walls on the first floor. Subs love them as they are easy to run plumbing, elect, ducts, etc Here is one brand
»www.woodbywy.com/trus-jo ··· -joists/

U Shaped plan:
-Consider swapping the dining area and kitchen and move the stairs. The kitchen is the natural gathering area for guests.

General Thoughts:
If possible, put a basement in. Offers living space, storage, work area, safe room, etc
If you do much entertaining, open concept is worth a look.
- The kitchen in any house can never be to large. People naturally congregate there so seating at an island or peninsula is worth a look

Edit-
I worked for a modular builder for a few years. We built all the walls, stairs, sided everything and shipped them out on a crane truck to be assembled on site. Each wall was placed individually and were indistinguishable from a site built home.
The largest advantage is the time savings. We went from foundation to roof sheathing in 4-5 days on a 2k sf 2 story.
AVonGauss
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join:2007-11-01
Boynton Beach, FL

AVonGauss

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said by seederjed:

-2 HVAC units - main floor and second floor are separated and much easier to control the temps

Even though this sounds like overbuilding, it's phenomenal advise - wish the builder of the two story split level house that I am living in now would have heard it.
JoelC707
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join:2002-07-09
Lanett, AL

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said by seederjed:

1 story plan -
- As mentioned before, the door from the garage to kitchen needs to open towards the kitchen so it doesn't block the stairs
- Go with a steep roof pitch. This gives you plenty of headroom for HVAC, WH and plenty of storage, possibly negating the need for the storage room
-Safe room in case of tornado?
-Hang a vent hood over the stove and run the piping parallel to the framing

I never got an answer on him about the door swing and whether any of the others applied to that as well. If that is the sole reason for changing the door swing, I think I'll stick with what I have. I know it's hard to see in the screen shot but the direction of the stairs is the other way so the door would not be interfering with anything (if they are built in stairs, the door would basically be hitting a wall).

The one story plan doesn't have a dedicated storage room, that utility room is also the pantry. Sure, if I moved the water heater and HVAC and such to the attic like you suggest it'll free up space there and I could possibly shrink that room but I can't eliminate it as I do want a large pantry area.

No safe room yet in either floor plan, the basement option is honestly the best option IMO.

I could do the overhead vent hood like you mention or I could do whatever popup style my aunt and uncle have in their house (have not researched that yet).
said by seederjed:

2 Story
-2 HVAC units - main floor and second floor are separated and much easier to control the temps
-Use Silent floor I-Joists for the floor framing. This offers the possability of longer floor spans using fewer bearing walls on the first floor. Subs love them as they are easy to run plumbing, elect, ducts, etc Here is one brand
»www.woodbywy.com/trus-jo ··· -joists/

The dual HVAC units is not a bad idea. I know the upper floor tends to get the short end of the stick, it's either too hot or too cold so having a separate zone at the very least would help there I think.

Awesome suggestion on the I-beams, thanks!
said by seederjed:

U Shaped plan:
-Consider swapping the dining area and kitchen and move the stairs. The kitchen is the natural gathering area for guests.

The U-shaped plan was mainly to show to someone else, I don't know that I'm going to seriously consider it at this point though it does solve some of the other issues people have brought up (in particular the privacy issue with all the doors opening to the living room).

The stairs were for a basement in that design that was intended to only span the section of the living room and up to the office or so. Where would you suggest the stairs be moved?
said by seederjed:

If you do much entertaining, open concept is worth a look.

I'm curious, I thought "open concept" was basically where there were no isolating walls between the kitchen, dining room and living room; basically what I have now. Is that not already open concept?
said by seederjed:

The kitchen in any house can never be to large. People naturally congregate there so seating at an island or peninsula is worth a look

This is true, our current kitchen tends to be crowded with just two people in there, you can work but you do tend to bump into each other every so often (and it's not that small either). Three or more people tend to cause a work stoppage lol.
Mr Matt
join:2008-01-29
Eustis, FL

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said by JoelC707:

At some point, my dad is likely to move back out on his own but her brother and my mom are both unable to live on their own.

UPDATE:

The wheelchair lift I originally referred to has a maximum lift of 171", good for only two stories. Savaria offers wheelchair lifts with a maximum lift of 23 feet or 276".
Here: »savaria.com/products/whe ··· 504-lift

Edit: Check with your tax adviser, the cost of a wheel chair lift may be a total tax write off if it is for a handicapped family member.
DrD
join:2008-03-03
Harrisonville, MO

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Downward venting stoves are very pricey.....

Corehhi
join:2002-01-28
Bluffton, SC

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Two or more HVAC systems in a house can be good or bad.

Good points are it's easier to control temps by floors, more even temps and cheaper to run. Another good point is if one breaks you still have one that works.

Bad points are more money up front and more money when they need to be replaced. Neighbors house is 15 years old and he has three heat pumps. Sure enough they are all going bad at the same time and he's looking at probably $15,000 to replace all of them.
18189353 (banned)
join:2014-10-28

18189353 (banned)

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said by Corehhi:

Bad points are more money up front and more money when they need to be replaced. Neighbors house is 15 years old and he has three heat pumps. Sure enough they are all going bad at the same time and he's looking at probably $15,000 to replace all of them.

It's slightly more but if your neighbor had 1 unit it would still be like $11,000 to $12,000. The pros almost always out weight the cons. I doubt he kept track of how much he saved in the last 15-20 years because of multiple units either. I'd guess he made that difference back 2-3 times over.