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pwood
@70.198.130.x

pwood

Anon

[Electrical] Water Heater Wiring?!

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Where do I connect the hot and neutral wire?!

shdesigns
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Stone Mountain, GA

shdesigns

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[Electrical] Re: Water Heater Wiring?!

That would be two hot leads for 240V.

The diagram says one to the blue/black wires the other to the red/yelllow.

enon
@108.18.188.x

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You don't.

This is a 240V appliance. There is no neutral connection.

Jack in VA
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join:2014-07-07
North, VA

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Jack in VA to pwood

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Re: [Electrical] Water Heater Wiring?!

The equipment is 240 volt and does not have a neutral. Also there is a code violation where the Romex enters the box. Conduit with proper bushing to protect the conductors must be installed.

dennismurphy
Put me on hold? I'll put YOU on hold
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join:2002-11-19
Parsippany, NJ

dennismurphy

Premium Member

said by Jack in VA:

The equipment is 240 volt and does not have a neutral. Also there is a code violation where the Romex enters the box. Conduit with proper bushing to protect the conductors must be installed.

It appears to me at the very right edge of the photo that there is a bushing present just disconnected while the person is working on it.

Beyond that, you may be right, but without seeing the rest of it, we don't know.

Jack in VA
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join:2014-07-07
North, VA

Jack in VA

Premium Member

said by dennismurphy:

said by Jack in VA:

The equipment is 240 volt and does not have a neutral. Also there is a code violation where the Romex enters the box. Conduit with proper bushing to protect the conductors must be installed.

It appears to me at the very right edge of the photo that there is a bushing present just disconnected while the person is working on it.

Beyond that, you may be right, but without seeing the rest of it, we don't know.

May be but it will be very hard to install a bushing on the inside of the box on conduit with the wires already connected. The wires would have to be disconnected to install the insulating bushing.

pwood
@70.198.130.x

pwood

Anon

Okay thank you all very much. l can do a lot with a house but plumbing and electrical are not my strong suits as you can tell!

nunya
LXI 483
MVM
join:2000-12-23
O Fallon, MO

nunya to pwood

MVM

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More info and better pictures. Make, model? Wide shot? Controller unit? Did you wire in to the wrong place?
Where is the installation manual?

IowaCowboy
Lost in the Supermarket
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Springfield, MA

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So is this an NEC violation as there is just Romex and no conduit on my water heater. It does have a strain relief.





Jack in VA
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North, VA

Jack in VA

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Sure is. The Romex is exposed and unprotected from damage.

IowaCowboy
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Springfield, MA

IowaCowboy

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said by Jack in VA:

Sure is. The Romex is exposed and unprotected from damage.

The cable actually comes from the breaker panel and goes into the wall up there. It's the gray cable for the tank.


If I were to correct it (which I'll probably wait until the water heater is replaced, which I'll probably be doing myself with my luck) would be to cut into that, install a metal junction box with appropriate fittings and run a section of BX armored cable to the water heater.
IowaCowboy

IowaCowboy

Premium Member

Another code violation I guess too with the garbage disposal. Exposed romex. And no it's not my work.

Like with the OPs situation, the water heater should have BX cable running to it, not NM cable.


LazMan
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Beverly Hills, CA

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Ugly, but not necessarily a code violation...

Romex needs to be protected 'where exposed to potential damage' - there could be an argument made that because of the water heater's placement; the cable is not exposed to damage...

AC would certainly be better, no argument there... But what's there isn't necessarily a problem.
LazMan

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Disposal wiring is a mess... Looks like the sheath is cut back about 6"?

IowaCowboy
Lost in the Supermarket
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Springfield, MA

IowaCowboy

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said by LazMan:

Disposal wiring is a mess... Looks like the sheath is cut back about 6"?

And exposed to potential damage possibly. As you can tell we use it for storage.

And no that's not my hack job. Mine would be much neater.

If the disposal had to be replaced I'd install an outlet and plug the new disposal in with a cord kit.
Expand your moderator at work

Jack in VA
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join:2014-07-07
North, VA

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Re: [Electrical] Water Heater Wiring?!

said by LazMan:

Ugly, but not necessarily a code violation...

Romex needs to be protected 'where exposed to potential damage' - there could be an argument made that because of the water heater's placement; the cable is not exposed to damage...

AC would certainly be better, no argument there... But what's there isn't necessarily a problem.

It either meets code or it doesn't.

LazMan
Premium Member
join:2003-03-26
Beverly Hills, CA

LazMan

Premium Member

Some inspectors interpret the code differently... In my town, that would be passed; the inspector in the neighbouring municipality wouldn't.

There is grey is some areas... Mechanical protection is often one of them, in my experience.

PSWired
join:2006-03-26
Annapolis, MD

PSWired

Member

For the OP, as shdesigns pointed out, the wiring diagram on the "energy controller" shows exactly where the white and black wires from your power feed go. One to blue/black junction, other to red/yellow junction.

Regarding romex coming out of the wall and into the water heater, this is how pretty much every residential electric water heater in the US is done...

IowaCowboy
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Springfield, MA

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That device looks like it's for control of the lower element only, not an entire water heater. If you control the whole water heater with it you may overload it.

davidg
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davidg

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both elements are not on at the same time on an electric WH. The diagram pictured is so the energy controller can kill power to the top element to keep it from kicking on unless really needed. The top element heats until most of the tank is at set temp, then the bottom element kicks on to bring the lower colder water up to temp. By controlling when the top element can come on you limit when the lower one is called.

Jack in VA
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North, VA

Jack in VA

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The top element only comes on when the hot water demand brings the hot/cold water lilne up to the upper thermostat. The upper thermostat is a dual unit and when it energizes the upper element to provide hot water as long as possible it de-energizes the bottom element. The upper element will only provide hot water even with and above it which is very little so when the demand drops it quickly heats the water in the top of the tank.

Once the upper thermostat is satisfied the thermostat cuts the upper element off and allows power to go to the bottom element thermostat. The bottom element provides the most of the water heating at all times except times of heavy hot water use.

garys_2k
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join:2004-05-07
Farmington, MI

garys_2k

Premium Member

said by Jack in VA:

The top element only comes on...

Thanks for that explanation, I've never had an electric and wondered how they worked and why the two elements. Now I know!
telco_mtl
join:2012-01-06

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to PSWired
said by PSWired:

For the OP, as shdesigns pointed out, the wiring diagram on the "energy controller" shows exactly where the white and black wires from your power feed go. One to blue/black junction, other to red/yellow junction.

Regarding romex coming out of the wall and into the water heater, this is how pretty much every residential electric water heater in the US is done...

its also the way every electric water heater here in quebec is put in.
LittleBill
join:2013-05-24

LittleBill

Member

said by telco_mtl:

said by PSWired:

For the OP, as shdesigns pointed out, the wiring diagram on the "energy controller" shows exactly where the white and black wires from your power feed go. One to blue/black junction, other to red/yellow junction.

Regarding romex coming out of the wall and into the water heater, this is how pretty much every residential electric water heater in the US is done...

its also the way every electric water heater here in quebec is put in.

i have to agree i have never seen it armored

shdesigns
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shdesigns

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Yes, that is how all I have seen are. I'd prefer armored but don't see it a big deal in a utility closet.

Boooost
@151.190.40.x

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I don't see how this controller would save any energy. (Unless this controller is for a time-of-day metering plan.) 100% of the energy goes into the tank, regardless of which element is on.

Jack in VA
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North, VA

Jack in VA

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I have a water heater to provide me and my wife hot water. Not to sit there off because of a timer not letting it operate. The small amount of money that we need to spend for hot water is not something to be concerned with.
telco_mtl
join:2012-01-06

telco_mtl

Member

said by Jack in VA:

I have a water heater to provide me and my wife hot water. Not to sit there off because of a timer not letting it operate. The small amount of money that we need to spend for hot water is not something to be concerned with.

I have to agree, And the insulation on new electric water heaters is amazing, We went on a weeks vacation 2 winters ago and shut the thing off while we were away, when we got back the water was still quite warm

Jack in VA
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North, VA

Jack in VA

Premium Member

said by telco_mtl:

said by Jack in VA:

I have a water heater to provide me and my wife hot water. Not to sit there off because of a timer not letting it operate. The small amount of money that we need to spend for hot water is not something to be concerned with.

I have to agree, And the insulation on new electric water heaters is amazing, We went on a weeks vacation 2 winters ago and shut the thing off while we were away, when we got back the water was still quite warm

I've found the same about the insulation. After Isabel in which power was out 17 days and several other events of multiple days I found I could use the generator in the mornings and heat the tank. That would allow both my wife and I with a hot shower and provide hot water during the day until we went to bed. The heat loss with the new insulation is minimal.