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uniqs
2007
HeadSpinning
MNSi Internet
join:2005-05-29
Windsor, ON

1 recommendation

HeadSpinning

Member

Denied entry: Bell Canada files complaints over lack of condo access

»www.theglobeandmail.com/ ··· 1804467/

Really, developers should smarten up provide non discriminatory access. Exclusive deals just end up disadvantaging the consumer in the long run.
iamhere
join:2013-01-26
canada

1 recommendation

iamhere

Member

Why should developers care about the consumer in the long run? They care about their bottom lines today.

jmck
formerly 'shaded'
join:2010-10-02
Ottawa, ON

jmck

Member

said by iamhere:

Why should developers care about the consumer in the long run? They care about their bottom lines today.

developers have to follow buildings code and a ton of other things that are there to protect the consumer. nobody gives a shit about what the developers bottom line is, they've shown they will cut every corner where there isn't a code.
iamhere
join:2013-01-26
canada

iamhere

Member

I agree but right now there is no "code" that says they need to allow provider X into their building. They sign exclusivity deals with whomever provider Y and pad their pockets.

I'm not saying it's right. It's the way it is.
HeadSpinning
MNSi Internet
join:2005-05-29
Windsor, ON

HeadSpinning

Member

said by iamhere:

I agree but right now there is no "code" that says they need to allow provider X into their building.

There rules with respect to MDU access.

»www.crtc.gc.ca/eng/archi ··· 3-45.htm
iamhere
join:2013-01-26
canada

iamhere

Member

This is funny. We looked at two separate condos in downtown Ottawa last year. One was serviced exclusively by Bell and one exclusively by Rogers.

Maybe each didn't ask for access to the other? If we wanted TV and / or internet access we would have had to commit to whomever was servicing the building.
prairiesky
join:2008-12-08
canada

prairiesky to HeadSpinning

Member

to HeadSpinning
This is going to be very interesting to watch. I've just starting wiring condos and apartments to provide service into buildings.

right now the developers end up footing the bill to install the cable and conduit for the major telecoms. It can run in the ~$300 per unit range. I think the developers need to wise up and start making these guys pay for their own costs.
HeadSpinning
MNSi Internet
join:2005-05-29
Windsor, ON

HeadSpinning to iamhere

Member

to iamhere
said by iamhere:

Maybe each didn't ask for access to the other?

They likely did, but the developer was playing games...

The CRTC recently ruled on one dispute:

»www.crtc.gc.ca/eng/archi ··· 4-42.htm

twizlar
I dont think so.
Premium Member
join:2003-12-24
Brantford, ON

twizlar to HeadSpinning

Premium Member

to HeadSpinning
We deny all providers access to our buildings as we provide our own internet, phone and TV connections. Mind you these aren't condos, they are subsidized rental units.
HeadSpinning
MNSi Internet
join:2005-05-29
Windsor, ON

HeadSpinning

Member

said by twizlar:

We deny all providers access to our buildings as we provide our own internet, phone and TV connections. Mind you these aren't condos, they are subsidized rental units.

If you ever got challenged on that you'd be screwed.
Walter Dnes
join:2008-01-27
Thornhill, ON

Walter Dnes

Member

said by HeadSpinning:

said by twizlar:

We deny all providers access to our buildings as we provide our own internet, phone and TV connections. Mind you these aren't condos, they are subsidized rental units.

If you ever got challenged on that you'd be screwed.

Somehow, I don't think that Bell and Rogers would be interested in potential customers who live in subsidized housing. They'll probably have...

•low takeup on pay-TV service
•take the basic phone service
•take the basic internet service
mr weather
Premium Member
join:2002-02-27
Mississauga, ON

mr weather

Premium Member

Don't forgot a higher than average rate of delinquent accounts.
HeadSpinning
MNSi Internet
join:2005-05-29
Windsor, ON

HeadSpinning to Walter Dnes

Member

to Walter Dnes
said by Walter Dnes:

Somehow, I don't think that Bell and Rogers would be interested in potential customers who live in subsidized housing. They'll probably have...

That's the only thing that's saving them from being brought before the commission.

Thane_Bitter
Inquire within
Premium Member
join:2005-01-20

3 recommendations

Thane_Bitter to HeadSpinning

Premium Member

to HeadSpinning
said by HeadSpinning:

Really, developers should smarten up provide non discriminatory access.

Yes but they are condos, a mini kingdom run by busybodies that expect everyone to conform to their wacky lifestyles and rarely can plan ahead.

"Unit 593 has an oversized wreath on the door, its pure anarchy!"
"Unit 9034 has painted their unit door almond white, that approved colour is white almond"
"Your unit fees have increases as we have finally got around to finishing the painting we started a decade ago"
"A special $4,000 fee has been applied to your unit to cover the cost of replacing the 40 year old roof that was only designed to last 20 years, and no we didn't set a dime aside over the years for eventual replacement"

With people like this a cardboard box in the alley seems ideal (provided you can get an internet connection).

elwoodblues
Elwood Blues
Premium Member
join:2006-08-30
Somewhere in

elwoodblues

Premium Member

said by Thane_Bitter:

[
"A special $4,000 fee has been applied to your unit to cover the cost of replacing the 40 year old roof that was only designed to last 20 years, and no we didn't set a dime aside over the years for eventual replacement"

There was a story in the globe about the amount of floor to ceiling glass that's been used in Condos, how in about 10yrs there is going to be massive repair bills.

pstewart
Premium Member
join:2005-10-12
Peterborough, ON

pstewart

Premium Member

yup - I looked at a condo in Toronto recently for a family member, and as fancy as the building entrance was, the quality of the unit (brand new) seemed to really lack.... little things like the surround in the bath tub was already cracking, one of the windows already had a leak in it, along with a long list of other things that caught my attention. For the cost of these condos (especially this one in downtown), I would expect stellar levels of quality and workmanship.

elwoodblues
Elwood Blues
Premium Member
join:2006-08-30
Somewhere in

elwoodblues

Premium Member

A buddy of mine spent over 600K on a "loft".

You want to talk about shitty workmanship. The stairs to the 2nd floor terminate at the concrete but the concrete wasn't finished, and it looks like it was just chopped in.

Over by his fridge the floor isn't finished there either.
The wall to the washroom you could push over if you sneezed to hard.

The cost is primarly do the outrageous price of land to build these things, they do the BARE minimum.

For example Code says that you must have one GFI plug near a sink, in his case he has a set of plugs on either side of the sink, yep you guessed it, only one set of plugs have GFI! We're talking a couple of bucks for a GFI plug? Just incredible.
HeadSpinning
MNSi Internet
join:2005-05-29
Windsor, ON

HeadSpinning

Member

said by elwoodblues:

For example Code says that you must have one GFI plug near a sink, in his case he has a set of plugs on either side of the sink, yep you guessed it, only one set of plugs have GFI! We're talking a couple of bucks for a GFI plug? Just incredible.

The non GFI plug may be connected to the GFI plug, and be protected that way.
btech805
join:2013-08-01
Canada

btech805 to Walter Dnes

Member

to Walter Dnes
said by Walter Dnes:

said by HeadSpinning:

said by twizlar:

We deny all providers access to our buildings as we provide our own internet, phone and TV connections. Mind you these aren't condos, they are subsidized rental units.

If you ever got challenged on that you'd be screwed.

Somehow, I don't think that Bell and Rogers would be interested in potential customers who live in subsidized housing. They'll probably have...

•low takeup on pay-TV service
•take the basic phone service
•take the basic internet service

Actually when i was first hired with Bell i was put on a low income beat and I'll tell you, the folks in Ottawa Community Housing had some of the most expensive internet and tv packages. So don't say there's no money to be had there.

As for the OP, Ive seen this fight coming for quite some time. However, developers have to pay all costs up front and then turn over the services to municipalities and utility companies, which isn't totally fair either.
Vomio
join:2008-04-01

Vomio

Member

Developers are in business to maximize profit, get out and move on to another project. Whatever they payout is recuperated in the purchase price of a unit.

In a condo situation IIRC they only are required to stick around for two years and then everything is in the lap of the condo corp, who may have inherited some nasty but binding agreements.


Good2Know
@184.162.4.x

Good2Know to btech805

Anon

to btech805
said by btech805:

Actually when i was first hired with Bell i was put on a low income beat

Does Bell put new employee's on low income beats? Is this pretty much standard for new employee's?

Does Bell segregate certain installs and employee's based on the customers income (or neighbourhood income level)?

Just curious since you seem to state that is what it is.
yyzlhr
join:2012-09-03
Scarborough, ON

yyzlhr to btech805

Member

to btech805
said by btech805:

Actually when i was first hired with Bell i was put on a low income beat and I'll tell you, the folks in Ottawa Community Housing had some of the most expensive internet and tv packages. So don't say there's no money to be had there.

As for the OP, Ive seen this fight coming for quite some time. However, developers have to pay all costs up front and then turn over the services to municipalities and utility companies, which isn't totally fair either.

When I worked in front line for Rogers and Bell I noticed the same thing too. Those who shouldn't always sign up for the most expensive package because they simply don't know any better. However delinquency and fraud is high on these accounts so regardless of the ARPU they are undesirable. Also Bell collects deposits on residential services so they'd have difficulty attracting that segment of customers anyways.

battleop
join:2005-09-28
00000

battleop to iamhere

Member

to iamhere
"The care about their bottom line today".

It must not matter to their customers because they are filling their complexes. If their customers went elsewhere that would effect their bottom line and they would adjust accordingly.
battleop

battleop to iamhere

Member

to iamhere
That's how the business world works.
JMJimmy
join:2008-07-23

JMJimmy to HeadSpinning

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Mr. Bibic said he believes the CRTC will side with “condo dweller consumers” who want choice. “Unless there’s a technical limitation, landlords have to give access to buildings,” he said.

But not when CNOC wants access to FTTP at those condos
HeadSpinning
MNSi Internet
join:2005-05-29
Windsor, ON

HeadSpinning to battleop

Member

to battleop
said by battleop:

"The care about their bottom line today".

It must not matter to their customers because they are filling their complexes. If their customers went elsewhere that would effect their bottom line and they would adjust accordingly.

And that is why the CRTC access to buildings regulations exist. Most condo buyers have no idea that they might be in a 'Rogers Only' or 'Bell Only' building at the time they are buying.

I guess things are different in the US.

battleop
join:2005-09-28
00000

battleop

Member

That's the consumers fault. Is it really that hard to ask what providers are available?
HeadSpinning
MNSi Internet
join:2005-05-29
Windsor, ON

HeadSpinning

Member

said by battleop:

That's the consumers fault. Is it really that hard to ask what providers are available?

Like I said. That's why there are regulators to make sure this BS doesn't happen. In your world, the consumer has to be an expert in everything, lest they make a mistake I guess.

For decades and decades, consumers have had the availability of both Bell and Rogers - it isn't unreasonable to expect both to be available in a building. This whole "exclusive" crap is a new phenomenon.
MaynardKrebs
We did it. We heaved Steve. Yipee.
Premium Member
join:2009-06-17

MaynardKrebs to HeadSpinning

Premium Member

to HeadSpinning
If I were on a condo board I'd open the building for bidding annually.

In an owners meeting with Bell, Rogers, and any other interested company in attendance I'd ask them all what we get for our money.

Then I'd open it up for Dutch auction to see how low the price could be driven.
MaynardKrebs

MaynardKrebs to HeadSpinning

Premium Member

to HeadSpinning
said by HeadSpinning:

»www.theglobeandmail.com/ ··· 1804467/

Really, developers should smarten up provide non discriminatory access. Exclusive deals just end up disadvantaging the consumer in the long run.

Mr. Bibic said he believes the CRTC will side with “condo dweller consumers” who want choice. “Unless there’s a technical limitation, landlords have to give access to buildings,” he said.

Dear CRTC:

I want access to Teksavvy internet via Bell's FTTN / FTTP.
Thanks for giving me the same thing Bell wants.

Yours truly,
etc...