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russb
join:2011-01-24
Port Orchard, WA

russb to nitzan

Member

to nitzan

Re: [Future9] First year free ($15 setup applies).

Nitzan, I have two questions about future 5

1.There is no mention about the "rollover minutes" (Unused minutes from the last 2 months will roll-over and be available to offset overage minutes for the current month) did you decide to drop that feature?

2. where are your servers located ? Do You have any west coast servers ? I live on the west coast (Seattle area) and ping times to the east coast can sometimes be over 120 ms but to California they average 15 to 25 ms.

I think this deal is Awesome and I have someone in mind who might be interested ( my stepdaughter) she is currently using Nettalk and we all know where that is headed. her usage is usually less than 1000 minutes a month.
Ole Juul
join:2013-04-27
Princeton, BC

Ole Juul

Member

said by russb:

Do You have any west coast servers ?

There is one in California now. Use freemont.future-nine.com
nitzan
Premium Member
join:2008-02-27

nitzan to russb

Premium Member

to russb
said by russb:

1.There is no mention about the "rollover minutes" (Unused minutes from the last 2 months will roll-over and be available to offset overage minutes for the current month) did you decide to drop that feature?

Not really. Just slipped my mind. Will honor it in the rare occasion it does happen (so far nobody ever reached their limit).

2. where are your servers located ? Do You have any west coast servers ? I live on the west coast (Seattle area) and ping times to the east coast can sometimes be over 120 ms but to California they average 15 to 25 ms.

Sure - fremont.future-nine.com

We will need to adjust your DID to point to that server though so when you order it mention the fremont server in the Special Requests field of the order form.

I think this deal is Awesome and I have someone in mind who might be interested ( my stepdaughter) she is currently using Nettalk and we all know where that is headed. her usage is usually less than 1000 minutes a month.

"Officially" the deal expired, but I'm willing to extend it another day for anyone who missed it. Just make sure to sign up today (12/10) as the free year offer won't be around beyond that. The regular Future 5 plan ($5/mo) will still be available though.
Burned Once
join:2014-12-03

Burned Once to nitzan

Member

to nitzan
For the record, I did receive a refund of $74.01 of the $135.

I received no service whatsoever and no responses EVER (outside of this forum exchange). Nitzan made $60.99 profit off of me. While that will not cause me to go bankrupt, I doubt that very few people desire to do business with companies that will not deliver the service they paid for and only refund 55% of their money months later but only because the customer found the CEO advertising on a forum. If the CEO considers that "making it right" he has a very one-sided perspective. I am sure that there are many happy customers. Even after all I have gone through, I could have been a neutral customer, but at this point, I still consider myself burned by Nitzan.

Caveat emptor
Ole Juul
join:2013-04-27
Princeton, BC

1 recommendation

Ole Juul

Member

I'm sorry to hear that you lost some money on this. However, although 74.01 plus 60.99 does indeed equal 135, something else doesn't seem to add up.
PX Eliezer1
Premium Member
join:2013-03-10
Zubrowka USA

4 recommendations

PX Eliezer1 to Burned Once

Premium Member

to Burned Once
IIRC, you said at one point that Nitzan did respond to a certain point but not afterwards.

I am curious if you changed your e-mail addresses, and if you checked all spam folders....

Especially GMail which has multiple spam folders these days....

Nitzan said that he had searched his system by your (current) e-mail address and found no incoming messages. Something to that effect.

So while I would not want to accuse [either] of you of being untruthful, something is askew.

Nitzan had no reason to not answer your inquiries. I know that you perceive $135 as being reason enough, but Nitzan has lots and lots of customers. He would not set out to specifically abscond with [your] funds while providing good service to pretty much [everyone else].

Nor would he risk his reputation over $135.

I think that there may well have been some technical issue here. In other words, the problem with communication was due to a problem with communication.

-----

I'm just curious. FutureNine really does not do much marketing AFAIK.

If you just found this forum recently---hence did not know until now that Nitzan participated here---where did you originally hear about F9?

Was it the Obihai forum?

In that case I have some sympathy for Nitzan. The Obi forum banned him, yet reportedly still lets people there send him messages that he has no access to! If true, that screws him and screws the people who send him messages on that Obi forum.


garys_2k
Premium Member
join:2004-05-07
Farmington, MI

garys_2k

Premium Member

Excellent points, PX. I, too, am curious about how "Burned Once" originally heard of F9 and whether their banning Nitzan led to the lack of communication between them.

For the record, I'd used F9 for quite a while and never, ever, had an issue anything like this. My interactions with Nitzan were entirely professional and I found him responsive to service requests and inquiries.
nitzan
Premium Member
join:2008-02-27

2 recommendations

nitzan to Burned Once

Premium Member

to Burned Once
said by Burned Once:

I received no service whatsoever and no responses EVER (outside of this forum exchange).

1. You ordered TWO phone numbers and E911 service - all of which was delivered and serviced for your account for 7 months. Whether you use it or not - we still have to pay our carriers.
2. We have NEVER received ANY official support requests from you until now.
3. Changing your mind is fine - I treated you exactly according to our TOS and even waived your cancellation fee - but I'm not going to give you a full refund 7 months after the fact when we've been paying our carriers the whole time.

I understand and apologize if there was a communication issue here, but it seems to me you share some responsibility here.
PX Eliezer1
Premium Member
join:2013-03-10
Zubrowka USA

PX Eliezer1

Premium Member

Cogent points.

-----

One suggestion, Nitzan, in hindsight:

If it is true that the Obi forum seemingly allows people to send you messages, but then the Obi forum managers prevent you from actually seeing those messages....

In other words, if Obi is actually kidnapping those messages....

Then on YOUR FutureNine website you should post a warning about that.

Again, that's assuming that I am understanding this correctly.
Burned Once
join:2014-12-03

Burned Once to nitzan

Member

to nitzan
Nitzan, I understand what you did. I explained it point by point so that everyone could see it too. There was nothing untruthful or misleading. Here are the facts:

1. I ordered a service that required customization on your end and instructions that you promised to provide.

2. You never provided the instructions. It does not matter if you were banned from the ObiTalk forum. You had my account and contact information, because I was your customer, but you never responded to me even though I made several attempts to contact you through both ObiTalk forums and you website submission form.

3. I have no idea if you set anything up at all after my login was created. I am not sure why you would have done anything else if you were not going to follow through and provide the instructions that were promised and required for the service to be functional.

You continued to bill me, and I had no recourse. Like others that I have read about on the internet (easy to find with internet searches), you set up my account, but never responded to my attempts to contact you afterwards. You had my money through Paypal, and the only recourse I have ever found was to explain my situation on this forum in which you posted an advertisement.

4. After potential customers read how you have handled my situation, you refunded the amount that you had not yet charged my account. You know that you never provided one second of phone time or any other useable service, but you chose to keep as much of my money as you could.

Those are the facts. Yes, there was likely a communication problem, but you are the cause of it. If you provided a phone number, email address, fax number, mailing address, skype name, etc. I (and others) could have had more success contacting you. However, you choose to only allow people to reach out to you through a website submission form that does not appear to yield results for the vast majority of those that have reviewed your service (based on my internet searches).

I can certainly understand your desire to refund as little as possible, but that is not how you "make things right" with a disgruntled customer. You had the opportunity for me to report that you made things right. I do not feel that you did. I feel as though you took 45% of my money for no service rendered.

I am not sure why you would spend money on your side without providing the instructions that were promised to make the service work. That seems like an unnecessary cost on your end and not one that I should have to bear. If this is how you do business, you should not be ashamed for potential customers to have this knowledge before making a decision.

It appears that if absolutely no interaction with you is required, your service seems to work, but I have not read of many success stories from those that have required your assistance. It appears that you run a one-man company that wants to compete with larger companies without paying for support. If that is your business model, fine, but you should make it clear that is what you are providing.

I am not trying to be disparaging. I am simply trying to provide accurate information about how you run your business. For those that it fits - great, but for those that this level of service does not fit, they would be well advised to find a service provider that will not abscond with 45% of their money with no service rendered.

toro
join:2006-01-27
Scarborough, ON

toro

Member

said by Burned Once:

Yes, there was likely a communication problem, but you are the cause of it. If you provided a phone number, email address, fax number, mailing address, skype name, etc.

Like many others, I disagree with you on this one. It seems to me that you didn't put a lot of effort trying to find any means of contact other than the Obitalk forum.
It took me all of about 2 min to:
- find this page »www.future-nine.com/about.html which says you need to login to your account in order to contact support
- open an account quickly (without depositing any money) and find the contact form referenced above
PX Eliezer1
Premium Member
join:2013-03-10
Zubrowka USA

PX Eliezer1

Premium Member

I agree with you but the OP said that he did do that.

Short of a forensic investigation we may never know the full sequence of events....

toro
join:2006-01-27
Scarborough, ON

toro

Member

Sorry, I missed that part. My bad
thunder15
join:2008-01-18
Chicago, IL

1 edit

thunder15 to toro

Member

to toro
Not exactly related to the OP, but a quick question:

Anyone else experiencing a blank redirect (»www.future-nine.com/A2BC ··· info.php) after signing in from Future 9's log-gin page?

At home, I use a Comcast Business provided modem/router. As far as I know, no firewall is turned on.

Tried at school now and the same thing happened. All of these has been tested with Chrome, Firefox, and Internet Explorer, on two different computer.

toro
join:2006-01-27
Scarborough, ON

toro

Member

I was able to login today before posting my previous message

Arne Bolen
User of Anveo Direct, 3CX and Qubes OS.
Premium Member
join:2009-06-21
Utopia

Arne Bolen to thunder15

Premium Member

to thunder15
said by thunder15:

Anyone else experiencing a blank redirect (»www.future-nine.com/A2BC ··· info.php) after signing in from Future 9's log-gin page?

I just tested and was able to log into my account. No blank redirect.
thunder15
join:2008-01-18
Chicago, IL

thunder15 to nitzan

Member

to nitzan
Thanks for the reply. I will check with Nitzan about this problem.
nitzan
Premium Member
join:2008-02-27

2 recommendations

nitzan to Burned Once

Premium Member

to Burned Once
said by Burned Once:

You had my account and contact information, because I was your customer, but you never responded to me even though I made several attempts to contact you through both ObiTalk forums and you website submission form.

1. You have NEVER contacted us through our Contact form. You say you did, but you didn't. I don't want to accuse you of lying, but it's a bit dishonest to come here and say these things when you've never made any real effort to contact us for 7 months.
2. It's YOUR responsibility to setup your account - not mine.
3. It's YOUR responsibility to contact support if you are having trouble setting up - not mine.

I'm trying to watch my words here, but what exactly did you expect for $5/mo? we're not Vonage. It's YOUR responsibility to set it up, and it's YOUR responsibility to contact us if you have problems. I would've loved to help you 7 months ago had you bothered to contact us at the time. That you didn't is unfortunate - but not my fault.

XCOM
digitalnUll
Premium Member
join:2002-06-10
Spring, TX

XCOM to nitzan

Premium Member

to nitzan
nitzan,

Crap I missed out!
Is the special still avail?

cb14
join:2013-02-04
Miami Beach, FL

1 recommendation

cb14 to Burned Once

Member

to Burned Once
said by Burned Once:

If you provided a phone number, email address, fax number, mailing address, skype name, etc. I (and others) could have had more success contacting you. However, you choose to only allow people to reach out to you through a website submission form that does not appear to yield results for the vast majority of those that have reviewed your service (based on my internet searches).

There are a few BYOD VOIP providers which provide a phone access to customer service ( e.g. Localphone and Voxbeam, but even Localphone does not provide tech support by phone) but most do not. Some of them who do not are excellent providers I would recommend in a heartbeat. For someone with a small operation like F9 or CWU having a phone support is simply not sustainable.
If, like you state, most F9 customers had problems reaching the company, F9 would be out of business very fast. The fact that Nitzan is still hanging in there in a highly competitive environment might have something to do with the fact that most of his customers are actually happy with F9.
Not without reasonable doubt, but based on preponderance of evidence I would judge your story as a BS.
Burned Once
join:2014-12-03

Burned Once to nitzan

Member

to nitzan
I really don't care to wrestle in the mud with you, and hopefully this is my last post on here about your service, but you accused me of lying, and I have not changed my story, but you have -- twice.

1. Not only have I tried to contact you through your online form submission, which you acknowledged before changing your story, but YOU have NEVER contacted me back from those form submissions.

On December 6, 2014 at 1:21 pm you posted: "I can only find ONE contact from you"

On December 13, 2014 at 5:33 am you posted, "You have NEVER contacted us through our Contact form"

You have only contacted me through this forum. That makes it seem like you spend more time on this forum than you do your own response system. If you cannot find previous attempts, that could explain why I, and many others, have had such a hard time getting a response from you. I believe that this is a communication problem. I, and others, have sent you requests for help through your only official means of support to no avail. If these messages are getting lost somehow, fixing that problem would help reviews of your service. It sure would have helped me %u2013 assuming that was why you never responded to me months ago.

2. You claimed that setting up the account was my responsibility, but On May 13, 2014 at 4:48 pm you sent a message on the ObiTalk forums stating, "Need to complete this on our side- I'll message you later today with the numbers and setup." Not only did you not do this, you are now stating that it was my responsibility to perform something that you yourself stated had to be done on your side. This is the second time you changed your story on me in this forum.

If I cannot perform the steps the steps that are required, you do not do it after you promise to do so, and I cannot reach you by any means (including your online submission form), what am I supposed to do? I was surprised to find you on this forum, but at least I have gotten a partial refund, and others can see how you operate your business. If your service works for them, great. If they want a higher level of service than you offer, at least they will know that your perspective is "what exactly did you expect for $5/mo? we're not Vonage"

At this point, people can make up their own minds about my situation. I did not alter any of your wording or misrepresent the facts. If they do not believe me, I hope they use your service and have the opportunity to form their own opinions directly. Good luck!
Dan_voip
join:2007-01-03
Saint-Hubert, QC

3 recommendations

Dan_voip

Member

said by Burned Once:

1. Not only have I tried to contact you through your online form submission, which you acknowledged before changing your story, but YOU have NEVER contacted me back from those form submissions.

On December 6, 2014 at 1:21 pm you posted: "I can only find ONE contact from you"

On December 13, 2014 at 5:33 am you posted, "You have NEVER contacted us through our Contact form"

Nitzan was saying here "I can only find ONE contact from you - 4 days ago" that means for me you have never contacted F9 in the last 7 months, just after you've posted here and you were told to go on F9 site to contact them or to create an account here and IM Nitzan. The idea to contact F9 on Obi's forum seems to me similar with going on Bank B's website to check my account I have it with Bank A.
nitzan
Premium Member
join:2008-02-27

nitzan to Burned Once

Premium Member

to Burned Once
said by Burned Once:

1. Not only have I tried to contact you through your online form submission, which you acknowledged before changing your story, but YOU have NEVER contacted me back from those form submissions.

You tried to contact us once - on December 2nd. Between May and December you have never contacted us through our website.

I don't have access to my Obi forum messages to check what I did or didn't say at the time - but it's irrelevant - even if I did forget to message you back at the time you could've easily gone on our website and contact support. You never even tried.

To add to all of that: at the time setup instructions were posted right there on the Obi forum in the thread you found the offer on. You could have set it up according to those instructions quite easily. Again I don't have access to my messages, but I recall you requesting some kind of complicated arrangement which is why I said I'll get back to you - but that wouldn't have prevented you from setting it up according to the instructions. Again- you never even tried.
PX Eliezer1
Premium Member
join:2013-03-10
Zubrowka USA

PX Eliezer1 to Dan_voip

Premium Member

to Dan_voip
said by Dan_voip:

Nitzan was saying here "I can only find ONE contact from you - 4 days ago"......

Thank you for pointing out the proper context.

AllThumbs
join:2006-02-07
Charleston, SC

AllThumbs

Member

A word to the downtrodden in the poetic words of Judge Judy.
PX Eliezer1
Premium Member
join:2013-03-10
Zubrowka USA

1 recommendation

PX Eliezer1

Premium Member

Huh?