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why60loss
Premium Member
join:2012-09-20

why60loss to takeahike

Premium Member

to takeahike

Re: Windows 10 will be free for Win 7 & 8 users

I hope Microsoft returns to printing the key on the laptops preinstalled with Windows 10 as I have gone though support blazing fire trying to understand why after a good system restore that windows 8 would not be deemed valid.

I did the restore 5 times to ensure that wasn't it, as it turns out Microsoft set up a system of hiding the key in the BIOS and if the BIOS "forgets" the key then you are in for a long day to say the lest. Because the OEM doesn't keep records of Windows 8 product keys, I will be sending a letter to Microsoft corp about telling me what the key is that was assigned for the system or giving me a new key.

Has anyone else with a laptop had an issue were after a system restore it wouldn't activate because the BIOS forgot/lost the Windows 8 product key.

I agree though that this latest build of Windows 10 is disappointing to say the lest.

Wily_One
Premium Member
join:2002-11-24
San Jose, CA

Wily_One

Premium Member

I'm certain those green key stickers you're talking about are applied by the desktop/laptop manufacturers, not MS.

why60loss
Premium Member
join:2012-09-20

why60loss

Premium Member

said by Wily_One:

I'm certain those green key stickers you're talking about are applied by the desktop/laptop manufacturers, not MS.

Microsoft told OEM's that they must embed product keys into the BIOS. Microsoft has full control on how the OEM's deal with the issue.

The wise idea behind this was that it would prevent the key from being stolen before the PC shipped.

It's not like an OEM really wants to tell Microsoft no when they tell them how they want things done. So though they had a "choice" it clearly wasn't worth getting Microsoft on there bad side over.

On Windows 7 preinstalled laptops the key was printed on a green key sticker. On Windows 8 they are hidden from the User embedded in the systems BIOS.

Microsoft made this system and now they should pay for it.

»www.slashgear.com/window ··· 6258229/

The above link also says the same, I don't feel like digging up all the web pages I looked at to explain this, but BIOS alone had the key, it lost the key and now MS should find it or give me a new one.

The system is %100 working other than the BIOS forgot the dang Windows 8 product key.
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Snakeoil
Ignore Button. The coward's feature.
Premium Member
join:2000-08-05
united state

2 recommendations

Snakeoil to trparky

Premium Member

to trparky

Re: Windows 10 will be free for Win 7 & 8 users

said by trparky:

I can understand why Microsoft wants to have more control over the updates to Windows, truly I can. Why? All you have to do is look over at the Android side of things and see how fragmented the platform is.

Some people are still on (For God's sake... WHY!?!?) Android 2.3 Gingerbread. Some still have 4.0 Ice Cream Sandwich, some still have 4.1, 4.2, and 4.3 Jellybean. When the most recent version is 5.0 Lollipop. Most flagship devices still only have 4.4 KitKat.

The platform is a fragmented mess with app developers have to put God knows what kinds of hacks and checks to make sure that their apps work on even the most ancient version Android out there.

What Microsoft is trying to avoid is exactly that, Android's fragmented mess. One Windows API, one platform, one version of Windows, apps and programs guaranteed to work 100%!

I refuse to allow any software company to install any update it wants to. Currently my update settings are "look for updates, but let me choose whether to download and install them".

I hate surprises, hence why I refuse to allow automatic updates. Though I wish there was a way to have a notice/alert for when new updates where found. Because the only time I see any such notice is when I reboot or restart the computer. And that is a seldom thing that I have to do.
Nanaki (banned)
aka novaflare. pull punches? Na
join:2002-01-24
Akron, OH

Nanaki (banned) to why60loss

Member

to why60loss
In all versions of windows with no key printed on tje machine some where windows uses no key. It is tied to the bios. A key can be used to activate on any other comp . but there is no key for the bios to forget

carpetshark3
Premium Member
join:2004-02-12
Idledale, CO

carpetshark3 to Snakeoil

Premium Member

to Snakeoil
Acer tablet won't be updated by Acer. Runs 4.1. Tablet plays At Bat and my reference apps just fine. I don't socialize or shop on it. Wifi only.

Android phone on 4.3. I like the permission control which Google has eliminated. If I can find another current ROM that includes it, I'll root the phone. Also runs as reference library/pda only. Disabled most of Google's apps. Don't need them.

Questions on Windows 10:
Will there be a full list of requirements and caveats listed as the download gets closer? I have one family member who might be interested, but he wants no part of cloud.

What happens if you don't use Windows services? I use none of the built-in convenience software, I've bought my own. I also run Linux and I can delete stuff via repository if I don't like it. I hated Unity. I don't do desktops. The screen is only used to get to my programs and that's it. I run similar to Davesnothere. I also prefer to BUY the security I want.

What happens when 11 comes out? Seeing the past update fiascos, how fast will Windows patch a flub-up right?

I have offline XP boxes for legacy, and if 10 won't run the purchased non-cloud Adobe software I own, I'll stay with 7 till EOL and then switch 7Pro offline. I'll simply use a form of Ubuntu for everyday.

DarkLogix
Texan and Proud
Premium Member
join:2008-10-23
Baytown, TX

1 recommendation

DarkLogix to BlitzenZeus

Premium Member

to BlitzenZeus
said by BlitzenZeus:

You could still make a local account, but if you wanted to install or update metro apps you needed to at least link a microsoft account with the store, you can also sign into certain metro apps individually. I too do not want my ability to login to my machine controlled by the cloud.

Merto apps, who cares about metro?
DarkLogix

DarkLogix to Nanaki

Premium Member

to Nanaki
said by Nanaki:

few eople might have installed xp on new machines made in the last 5 or so years for what ever reason. But over all that number is going to be quite small.

Till you count businesses.
Nanaki (banned)
aka novaflare. pull punches? Na
join:2002-01-24
Akron, OH

Nanaki (banned)

Member

I'm sorry bit any companies that installed xp on new machines when 7 was released are badly ran. Not jumping to vista yeh I get that same for not moving to 8. Xp is less stable led secure worse performance really less of every thing that 7. There is no real reason to choose xp or 7. 7 runs any thing xp will. Now xp wouldn't run everything 98 would as per old programs how ever 7 runs more of those progras will run in 7 so 1 more reason to upgrade to 7.
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why60loss
Premium Member
join:2012-09-20

why60loss to Nanaki

Premium Member

to Nanaki

Re: Windows 10 will be free for Win 7 & 8 users

said by Nanaki:

In all versions of windows with no key printed on tje machine some where windows uses no key. It is tied to the bios. A key can be used to activate on any other comp . but there is no key for the bios to forget

»www.cnet.com/news/window ··· ct-keys/

»www.zdnet.com/article/wi ··· roubles/

The above links show there is a Key, the Windows 8 product key gets embedded in the BIOS and if the BIOS forgets it then you can't activate windows.

My issue is "rare" but it does happen. Please read more about the subject before claiming there isn't a key for the BIOS to forget.

DarkLogix
Texan and Proud
Premium Member
join:2008-10-23
Baytown, TX

DarkLogix to trparky

Premium Member

to trparky
said by trparky:

2. The Start Screen was the "replacement" for the Start Menu in Windows 8.x. Well, we saw how they turned out to be liked, as in not well liked at all. The Start Menu is back in Windows 10. Problem solved!

Well last I looked it was ALMOST BACK
its still not what is wanted.

Davesnothere
Change is NOT Necessarily Progress
Premium Member
join:2009-06-15
Canada

Davesnothere to Snakeoil

Premium Member

to Snakeoil
said by Snakeoil:

I refuse to allow ANY software company to install any update it wants to !!!

Currently my update settings are "look for updates, but let me choose whether to download and install them".

I hate surprises, hence why I refuse to allow automatic updates....

 
Yes, doing that keeps me OUT of more trouble than I am put INTO by the consequences of whatever other alleged security risks that I may take.

DarkLogix
Texan and Proud
Premium Member
join:2008-10-23
Baytown, TX

DarkLogix to Nanaki

Premium Member

to Nanaki
said by Nanaki:

I'm sorry bit any companies that installed xp on new machines when 7 was released are badly ran. Not jumping to vista yeh I get that same for not moving to 8. Xp is less stable led secure worse performance really less of every thing that 7. There is no real reason to choose xp or 7. 7 runs any thing xp will. Now xp wouldn't run everything 98 would as per old programs how ever 7 runs more of those progras will run in 7 so 1 more reason to upgrade to 7.

And what of all those ATM's
And POS registers.

There are lots of businesses (large ones) that still run XP.
Nanaki (banned)
aka novaflare. pull punches? Na
join:2002-01-24
Akron, OH

Nanaki (banned)

Member

POS is still supported btw it is called windows xp embedded which is ATM's and pos. If I recall there is no other windows is for that purpose yet. Also to update a ATM is a huge under taking. It requires taking the unit in for service. They can pull the cputer and swap it out and in fact do.
Not saying there are no businesses that don't use it. Instead there is no reason for them to. Hell half the recent data breaches are likely because of xp and other in updated programs.

trparky
Premium Member
join:2000-05-24
Cleveland, OH
·AT&T U-Verse

trparky

Premium Member

I don't see Microsoft removing the ability to ignore an update in any of the GUI elements in Windows 10. As far as I can see, you can still ignore updates or turn off Windows Update's automatic updates mechanism if you wish to do so.

What I think a lot of people are confused about is that Microsoft wants the ability to push new features to the OS as they are ready to be deployed as versus having to wait for a service pack or a new OS.

For instance, OneDrive. Microsoft has overhauled OneDrive in Windows 10 but later, after the general release, Microsoft will be deploying even more features for OneDrive when they are ready. It will come as a Windows Update and that is good. There may even be a new version of DirectX in the future, say... DirectX 12.5 or version 13. Will we have to wait for Windows 11 to get it? According to Microsoft's new feature release plan, it will simply come down as a new version of DirectX that's installable via a Windows Update. Again, that's a good idea.
Nanaki (banned)
aka novaflare. pull punches? Na
join:2002-01-24
Akron, OH

Nanaki (banned)

Member

If ms updates enough features etc per year I my self would with out blinking pay $5 per month for that. I think tjat at be their idea of windows as a service. No pay no new features. I have expected this spill over from mmorpgs with the micro transactions sense 03 or 04. In this case you pay x per month to get new features vs pay x to get extras 1 at a time.
Glen T
join:2003-11-03
BC

Glen T to CtrlFlsh

Member

to CtrlFlsh
said by CtrlFlsh :

"This is more than a one-time upgrade: once a Windows device is upgraded to Windows 10, we will continue to keep it current for the supported lifetime of the device – at no cost. With Windows 10, the experience will evolve and get even better over time. We’ll deliver new features when they’re ready, not waiting for the next major release. We think of Windows as a Service – in fact, one could reasonably think of Windows in the next couple of years as one of the largest Internet services on the planet."

Translation: early Win10 adopters = beta testers -- in perpetuity.

Wily_One
Premium Member
join:2002-11-24
San Jose, CA

Wily_One

Premium Member

said by Glen T:

Translation: early Win10 adopters = beta testers -- in perpetuity.

In the end, aren't we all Microsoft beta testers?
Glen T
join:2003-11-03
BC

Glen T

Member

said by Wily_One:

In the end, aren't we all Microsoft beta testers?

I really want to preserve my illusion of self-determination.

trparky
Premium Member
join:2000-05-24
Cleveland, OH
·AT&T U-Verse

trparky to Wily_One

Premium Member

to Wily_One
said by Wily_One:

In the end, aren't we all Microsoft beta testers?

Pretty much. And that doesn't just apply to Microsoft.

That and beta testers for game developers. How many times have we needed to do multi-GB downloads on launch day for some big name game? More times than I can count.

Face it, until we demand better software quality we, the consumer, are going to be the beta testers.
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Nanaki (banned)
aka novaflare. pull punches? Na
join:2002-01-24
Akron, OH

Nanaki (banned) to trparky

Member

to trparky

Re: Windows 10 will be free for Win 7 & 8 users

90% of beta testers are little more than free loaders. A tester pool of say 2k will give you at best if you are very luck 50 testers and 1950 whiners. That is why so many bugs make it to launch.
System

to takeahike

Anon

to takeahike
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