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sk1939
Premium Member
join:2010-10-23
Frederick, MD
ARRIS SB8200
Ubiquiti UDM-Pro
Juniper SRX320

sk1939

Premium Member

[Electrical] Mini Panel Install

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I know I'm asking for it, but I would like a critique. Yes I know there is a 20A outlet with a 15A breaker. However it is 12AWG wire and to my knowledge, it is permissible (it is the reverse that isn't). The unfinished box is where the Arc Fault outlet goes, but I need to buy the correct bracket for it. Will be fed by a monster 10AWG SOOW cable with a 5-15 cord cap. As to the "why", they don't make either an Arc-Fault power strip, nor a power strip with a 20A twist-lock plug for a reasonable price.

Raphion
join:2000-10-14
Samsara

Raphion

Member

Why the mini-panel at all? Why not just install an AFCI in your main panel, and run a dedicated circuit from it to this outlet?

Tursiops_G
Technoid
MVM
join:2002-02-06
Brooksville, FL

2 recommendations

Tursiops_G to sk1939

MVM

to sk1939
I'm not an Electrician by any means (My expertise is in Electronics), but I'd increase the wire wrap under that Ground screw (in the 4th pic) to about 1/2 to 3/4 dia. (~180 to 270 degrees) of contact...

sk1939
Premium Member
join:2010-10-23
Frederick, MD

sk1939 to Raphion

Premium Member

to Raphion
It's portable rack on wheels, so it has to move and be able to be unplugged versus unwired.

Edit: Also because a QO AFCI is $50 while the outlet is $26.
sk1939

sk1939 to Tursiops_G

Premium Member

to Tursiops_G
Will fix that when I finish it, I wasn't sure if doing it that way was going to be enough or not.
brodgers
join:2006-03-20
Gillett, WI

1 recommendation

brodgers to sk1939

Member

to sk1939
While the 12AWG is fine on the 15amp breaker, the 20amp receptacle on the 15amp breaker is a violation of the NEC. Check out table 210.21(B)(3).

Tex
Dave's not here
Premium Member
join:2012-10-20

Tex to sk1939

Premium Member

to sk1939
What, exactly, are you going to be powering with this setup?

As far as critique, I have no doubt the resident electricians will have a few things to say.
TheMG
Premium Member
join:2007-09-04
Canada

TheMG to sk1939

Premium Member

to sk1939
Why do you need a portable AFCI anyways?

PSWired
join:2006-03-26
Annapolis, MD

PSWired to sk1939

Member

to sk1939
For mechanical stability, you might want to bring the box with the twistlock down below your other 4" box. Then you can tie back into the breaker enclosure with a box spacer, and use your existing nipple to bridge the two 4" boxes.

John Galt6
Forward, March
Premium Member
join:2004-09-30
Happy Camp

John Galt6 to brodgers

Premium Member

to brodgers
said by brodgers:

While the 12AWG is fine on the 15amp breaker, the 20amp receptacle on the 15amp breaker is a violation of the NEC. Check out table 210.21(B)(3).

The NEC does not apply to this 'installation'.

mackey
Premium Member
join:2007-08-20

mackey to brodgers

Premium Member

to brodgers
said by brodgers:

While the 12AWG is fine on the 15amp breaker, the 20amp receptacle on the 15amp breaker is a violation of the NEC. Check out table 210.21(B)(3).

As this is cord-and-plug equipment on wheels the NEC doesn't apply.

Edit: d'oh, ninja'd by John Galt

sk1939
Premium Member
join:2010-10-23
Frederick, MD
ARRIS SB8200
Ubiquiti UDM-Pro
Juniper SRX320

sk1939 to TheMG

Premium Member

to TheMG
said by TheMG:

Why do you need a portable AFCI anyways?

For piece of mind really, it's was a "nice to have" as opposed to a "must have".
sk1939

sk1939 to Tex

Premium Member

to Tex
said by Tex:

What, exactly, are you going to be powering with this setup?

As far as critique, I have no doubt the resident electricians will have a few things to say.

A) APC 20A Network PDU
- Nothing uses a 20A plug though, it just happened to be 20A when I bought it.
-Uses a 20A twist-lock, but maximum amperage is 16A anyways.
-Could cut off the twist-lock so I could use a normal outlet, but rather pointless imo.
B) Tripp-Lite UPS

Beyond that, various server gear. Related to this topic: »[Servers] Quiet Server Cabinet
sk1939

sk1939 to PSWired

Premium Member

to PSWired
said by PSWired:

For mechanical stability, you might want to bring the box with the twistlock down below your other 4" box. Then you can tie back into the breaker enclosure with a box spacer, and use your existing nipple to bridge the two 4" boxes.

I was thinking about that actually, and I plan to mount all of this on a piece of plywood besides.

John Galt6
Forward, March
Premium Member
join:2004-09-30
Happy Camp

John Galt6

Premium Member

Stranded wire for ground screws requires the use of a captive method of attachment. Wrapping the wire around the screw is not acceptable. A properly-sized crimp ring (not a fork) would be acceptable, however.

You need plastic bushings on all of the nipples.

Are the nipples installed into clean KOs, or are some of them concentric?

Good luck getting the 10/3 SOOW into the 5-15 cord cap. What amperage of circuit/receptacle is this cord getting plugged into? Yes, I know it should be self-evident, but it is prudent to ask these things.

sk1939
Premium Member
join:2010-10-23
Frederick, MD
ARRIS SB8200
Ubiquiti UDM-Pro
Juniper SRX320

sk1939

Premium Member

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I will put it in a ring when I get the chance to go buy one.

I was wondering about that, I will get one of those next time I'm out (again).

With the exception of the breaker box, the rest of the nipples are in clean knockouts. Am I going to have to worry about a grounding bushing?

The cord-cap actually fits relatively well, although it is tight.

20A circuit, 5-15 or 5-20 depending on the outlet.

nunya
LXI 483
MVM
join:2000-12-23
O Fallon, MO

1 recommendation

nunya to sk1939

MVM

to sk1939
I'm confused by the whole thing. Is this panel mounted in a permanent location or not?
The grounding is just weird.
The receptacle needs to be a 15A or you need to just put in a 20A breaker.
Why do you need AFCI protection for a server PDU?

sk1939
Premium Member
join:2010-10-23
Frederick, MD
ARRIS SB8200
Ubiquiti UDM-Pro
Juniper SRX320

1 edit

sk1939

Premium Member

said by nunya:

I'm confused by the whole thing. Is this panel mounted in a permanent location or not?
The grounding is just weird.
The receptacle needs to be a 15A or you need to just put in a 20A breaker.
Why do you need AFCI protection for a server PDU?

It's permanently mounted on a rolling rack.

What's wrong with my grounding? I know the boxes CAN be grounded by way of conduit nipple, but I figured an actual ground wouldn't hurt.

I have a 20A breaker just in case, but what happens if the location only has a 15A circuit? The breaker would trip first methinks (although a powers strip would work just the same methinks.

It's a just in case measure, combined with the fact that the office it's going in is technically a bedroom. Edit: Upon review, AFCI's notorious problems with switching power supplies prevent me from using it without worrying. I have an HBL8300I sitting on my desk that will work instead.

whizkid3
MVM
join:2002-02-21
Queens, NY

3 recommendations

whizkid3 to sk1939

MVM

to sk1939
You asked for the critique; here is mine. You appear to be constructing a hunk of junk.

And lets be correct - the NEC certainly DOES apply. Even if you get this pile of crap UL listed. My observations, some of which have already been duly noted:

1. Not code compliant to have a 15A circuit breaker powering a 20A receptacle.
2. The grounding screw is done completely wrong, and needs a lug; or solid wire wrapped appropriately around the screw (at least 180 deg).
3. Why the intermediate box and splices?
4. Why the AFCI breaker???
5. Why the 2" nipple between boxes? You do know (you probably don't), that you could have bolted the boxes directly together using the two small holes above the knock-out; and then used a 1" or 1/2" chase nipple to make a lot more secure install. Your configuration of connecting the boxes together will only fail. And for that matter...
6. How are you planning to properly secure & support this?
7. Why do you even need a circuit breaker? Is it not being plugged into a circuit with a breaker? (May be 30A; not sure.)
8. You don't need plastic bushings on any of the nipples (sorry, John). They are not large enough to require such (as per the NEC). Would be nice to have, though.

sk1939
Premium Member
join:2010-10-23
Frederick, MD
ARRIS SB8200
Ubiquiti UDM-Pro
Juniper SRX320

sk1939

Premium Member

1. Will change it to a 20A
2. I know that, will get a lug for that.
3. The intermediate box is for a 2nd outlet, not for a splice per se (5-20)
4. AFCI outlet, not breaker, which I have decided not to use besides
5. It's what I had on hand, but I plan on changing it.
6. Plywood backing
7. It is, but I need it to be able to be plugged into circuits of various ratings without issues (incl 30A).
8. Good to know.
Expand your moderator at work

whizkid3
MVM
join:2002-02-21
Queens, NY

1 recommendation

whizkid3 to sk1939

MVM

to sk1939

Re: [Electrical] Mini Panel Install

A different idea worth considering, instead of plywood, is to relocate the box on the right below the intermediate box. Bolt all three directly together with #10 machine screws. Use chase nipples between all three, with locknuts. This will make the entire assembly rigid & strong; no plywood or carpenters needed.