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ThreePhaze
join:2015-01-27
Barbourville, KY

ThreePhaze

Member

[Internet] Installation denial?

My address shows up in TW's system as a serviceable location. Back in the summer I ordered service and the tech shows up at my house then tells me he cant run service because I'm more than 400' from the hub. He said he would refer it to engineering but I never heard from them. I do live up on a hill like most people do in this part of the country. I know that it would be more than the typical installation but it's all above ground. Why can't I get decent internet when they run service well past my home and my neighbor across the road has a 50 mbps service and I'm stuck with Windstream @ 1.0 mbps (on a good day)?????

OpTiC
Premium Member
join:2014-03-08
West Covina, CA

OpTiC

Premium Member

You can do a BBB or a FCC complaint for the data base saying serviceable while it's not. I am just curious if you see a tap in front of the house it means you house in serviceable.

ThreePhaze
join:2015-01-27
Barbourville, KY

ThreePhaze

Member

It's easily visible from my driveway. It could be ~400' though.
spdickey
join:2002-11-17
Pacific Palisades, CA
Technicolor E31T2V1
eero Wi-Fi System
Obihai OBi202

spdickey to ThreePhaze

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to ThreePhaze
Because you are apparently more than 400' away from the nearest tap (not hub) and the tech can't run a drop that far.

Is there a telephone pole on the street outside your house? Can you see cable television wired on it (usually above the telephone and below the power). Can you locate a tap on the pole nearest your house?

Without a tap there, you won't get an install from an installer. Engineering would have to cut a tap into the line (if indeed its there) by your home. Then you can get installed.

The database is obviously wrong. That is why someone has to come out and see what exactly is there, since as-built plans are seldom 100% accurate.

How do you get electric or phone service to your house? Are there wires hanging from your house to the pole? That's the pole you should be looking at for a cable tap.

OpTiC
Premium Member
join:2014-03-08
West Covina, CA

OpTiC to ThreePhaze

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to ThreePhaze
They only other option is pay the ass to get service. It's more than 1,000 for service extension.

ThreePhaze
join:2015-01-27
Barbourville, KY

ThreePhaze

Member

If they would give me a price on it, I could pay it. They never came out to look at it. I know it's a little late to be complaining about it but I'm getting desperate for decent internet service. Windstream isn't going to spend any money upgrading service up here. TW has service with every household up my road (that's easily accessable).
ThreePhaze

ThreePhaze to spdickey

Member

to spdickey
No cable tap up on my hill.

OpTiC
Premium Member
join:2014-03-08
West Covina, CA

OpTiC

Premium Member

okay call up and ask for a quote to extend services.

Hall
MVM
join:2000-04-28
Germantown, OH

Hall to OpTiC

MVM

to OpTiC
said by OpTiC :

You can do a BBB or a FCC complaint for the data base saying serviceable while it's not. I am just curious if you see a tap in front of the house it means you house in serviceable.

It sounds like his home is over 400' from the street. Can't blame their database if that's the case.

OpTiC
Premium Member
join:2014-03-08
West Covina, CA

OpTiC

Premium Member

True the problem is the data base is misleading.

maxbrando
Premium Member
join:2014-06-01
Netgear WNDR3700v4
SMC D3CM1604
ARRIS TM602G

maxbrando to OpTiC

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to OpTiC
said by OpTiC :

I am just curious if you see a tap in front of the house it means you house in serviceable

Unless it is in the franchise agreement, not necessarily.

hawk82
join:2001-04-26
centralmaine

hawk82 to ThreePhaze

Member

to ThreePhaze
Drop a 4"x4" (or a 8"x8") post/pole next to the street on your property. Have TWC run a new drop to it. Get power (solar or run your own from your home) to your 4"x4" post/pole. Mount a weather resistant NEMA enclosure. Put modem inside enclosure. Install fiber optic cable from post to your home... or install a wireless point-to-point link if you have decent line of sight.

DocDrew
How can I help?
Premium Member
join:2009-01-28
SoCal
Ubee E31U2V1
Technicolor TC4400
Linksys EA6900

DocDrew

Premium Member

said by hawk82:

Drop a 4"x4" (or a 8"x8") post/pole next to the street on your property. Have TWC run a new drop to it. Get power (solar or run your own from your home) to your 4"x4" post/pole. Mount a weather resistant NEMA enclosure. Put modem inside enclosure. Install fiber optic cable from post to your home... or install a wireless point-to-point link if you have decent line of sight.

Problem with that is the installers are usually required to bond the drop to the electrical panel ground and the distance to ground can't be longer then the drop or cable to the first outlet, otherwise they fail QC checks. The installer would need special permission by his supervisor, at least, to install in such a case.

hobgoblin
Sortof Agoblin
Premium Member
join:2001-11-25
Orchard Park, NY

hobgoblin to hawk82

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to hawk82
said by hawk82:

Drop a 4"x4" (or a 8"x8") post/pole next to the street on your property. Have TWC run a new drop to it. Get power (solar or run your own from your home) to your 4"x4" post/pole. Mount a weather resistant NEMA enclosure. Put modem inside enclosure. Install fiber optic cable from post to your home... or install a wireless point-to-point link if you have decent line of sight.

Working a Tech Support Call center i am not sure I would want to support that.

Hob

RootWyrm
join:2011-05-09

RootWyrm to DocDrew

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to DocDrew
said by DocDrew:

Problem with that is the installers are usually required to bond the drop to the electrical panel ground and the distance to ground can't be longer then the drop or cable to the first outlet, otherwise they fail QC checks. The installer would need special permission by his supervisor, at least, to install in such a case.

Installer can't get a waiver on that, period. That's not a TWC policy - that's an electrical code compliance issue. Demarc point must bond to ground, no exceptions under any circumstances. Obviously there's latitude on WHICH ground and how, but still must be bonded.

400' would exceed RG11 even with wire guide - safe limit for RG11 is about 300' with wire guide. (I'm on a 254' run.) And you can't amp it to bring it in spec, because the passive's going to be out too. I would suggest consulting the local franchise agreement to see if you're in a "must service" area or a "may service" area. If it is a must service area, I suggest reminding the local manager of that and contacting your local franchising authority. Note that must service does not mean they are required to install the way you want or at all, but that they are required to come up with a plan for how service could be provided to you.
ke4pym
Premium Member
join:2004-07-24
Charlotte, NC

ke4pym to hawk82

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to hawk82
said by hawk82:

Drop a 4"x4" (or a 8"x8") post/pole next to the street on your property. Have TWC run a new drop to it. Get power (solar or run your own from your home) to your 4"x4" post/pole. Mount a weather resistant NEMA enclosure. Put modem inside enclosure. Install fiber optic cable from post to your home... or install a wireless point-to-point link if you have decent line of sight.

Or if the neighbor isn't too far away, a second account at his house. Pick up a pair of Gig fiber transceivers (that will shoot the laser .34 of a mile) from Newegg for $78 bucks each and a swath of fiber (130 feet of indoor/outdoor SC-SC is ~100 bucks), pick up some CPVC at Lowes for basic protection and commence to digging a small trench.

Call it a day, write the neighbor a check each month.

*Standard disclaimers apply. This is a tech only solution.

RootWyrm
join:2011-05-09

RootWyrm

Member

said by ke4pym:

Or if the neighbor isn't too far away, a second account at his house. Pick up a pair of Gig fiber transceivers (that will shoot the laser .34 of a mile) from Newegg for $78 bucks each and a swath of fiber (130 feet of indoor/outdoor SC-SC is ~100 bucks), pick up some CPVC at Lowes for basic protection and commence to digging a small trench.

Call it a day, write the neighbor a check each month.

*Standard disclaimers apply. This is a tech only solution.

That's... actually not a terrible idea. Though you'd want pre-terminated OM2 minimum. Going with LC terminated OM2, you can get a 50m VERY cheaply - $55. Problem is, I'm guessing it's way more than 50m.

So actually the easier answer going that route is more likely a POE injector and POE Repeaters (e.g. Veracity Outreach Max). That'll get you out to 800 feet with Cat5E/Cat6.
ke4pym
Premium Member
join:2004-07-24
Charlotte, NC

ke4pym

Premium Member

In order to make that work, you'd need to find different transceivers that support LC or buy SC to LC converters/whips. Not a big deal either way. But the $78 price is right at Newegg to go nearly a half a mile.
brad152
join:2006-07-27
Chicago, IL

brad152 to ThreePhaze

Member

to ThreePhaze
Just call your local office, and get ahold of a lead tech.

They'll get you a quote on getting a tap ran up to your electrical pole by your house. I'll be about $1,000 but in the grand scheme of things it's totally worth it.
ke4pym
Premium Member
join:2004-07-24
Charlotte, NC

ke4pym to RootWyrm

Premium Member

to RootWyrm
said by RootWyrm:

So actually the easier answer going that route is more likely a POE injector and POE Repeaters (e.g. Veracity Outreach Max). That'll get you out to 800 feet with Cat5E/Cat6.

The problem with Cat* cable, is you'll have to deal with grounding issues and potential lightning strikes that could really ruin your day. Lightning hits the fiber? Oh well, just hurts that bit of fiber and the electronics on either end are isolated by an air gap. And plastic.

RootWyrm
join:2011-05-09

RootWyrm

Member

said by ke4pym:

The problem with Cat* cable, is you'll have to deal with grounding issues and potential lightning strikes that could really ruin your day. Lightning hits the fiber? Oh well, just hurts that bit of fiber and the electronics on either end are isolated by an air gap. And plastic.

Er, no. Trust me. I've had to deal with direct lightning strike on armored fiber. I would much, much rather have to deal with it on Cat5E, because generally the damage is going to be limited to a single segment of under 100ft which will cost maybe $30 to replace worst case (if you did it right.) Fiber? Yeah, no, it doesn't "just hurt" that bit of fiber - if you're lucky it's a straight break, more likely it's warping. And there is absolutely nothing fun whatsoever about splicing fiber. Nothing. ;P

why60loss
Premium Member
join:2012-09-20

why60loss to ke4pym

Premium Member

to ke4pym
said by ke4pym:

said by hawk82:

Drop a 4"x4" (or a 8"x8") post/pole next to the street on your property. Have TWC run a new drop to it. Get power (solar or run your own from your home) to your 4"x4" post/pole. Mount a weather resistant NEMA enclosure. Put modem inside enclosure. Install fiber optic cable from post to your home... or install a wireless point-to-point link if you have decent line of sight.

Or if the neighbor isn't too far away, a second account at his house. Pick up a pair of Gig fiber transceivers (that will shoot the laser .34 of a mile) from Newegg for $78 bucks each and a swath of fiber (130 feet of indoor/outdoor SC-SC is ~100 bucks), pick up some CPVC at Lowes for basic protection and commence to digging a small trench.

Call it a day, write the neighbor a check each month.

*Standard disclaimers apply. This is a tech only solution.

I didn't know a person could have more than one account per house/address for internet.

If that is the case a person on maxx could get two 300mbs accounts, flood them both to the max with 24x7 downloads and cripple everyone else on the same node.

node only supports a little over 600mbs and likely covers over 100 accounts so one guy with two could screw it all up for the rest of the 98+ folks in that area.
ke4pym
Premium Member
join:2004-07-24
Charlotte, NC

ke4pym

Premium Member

said by why60loss:

I didn't know a person could have more than one account per house/address for internet.

I don't know if it is still the case, but back in the day it was somewhat common to occasionally hear about someone having 2 modems in their house.
said by why60loss:

If that is the case a person on maxx could get two 300mbs accounts, flood them both to the max with 24x7 downloads and cripple everyone else on the same node.

What difference does it make if two modems are flooding "to the max wit 24x7 downloads" being in the same house verses one in house A and the other in house B? The likelihood is still the same considering a node could support several hundred homes.
ke4pym

ke4pym to RootWyrm

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to RootWyrm
said by RootWyrm:

Er, no. Trust me. I've had to deal with direct lightning strike on armored fiber.

We're not talking about putting armored fiber in the ground here. Just plain ole indoor/outdoor/full/of/plastic/cable.

And even without a direct lightning strike, copper can still be impacted by local lightning strikes/static causing the gear on either end to fail if not grounded properly.

RootWyrm
join:2011-05-09

RootWyrm

Member

said by ke4pym:

said by RootWyrm:

Er, no. Trust me. I've had to deal with direct lightning strike on armored fiber.

We're not talking about putting armored fiber in the ground here. Just plain ole indoor/outdoor/full/of/plastic/cable.

You're going over 150 feet, it's either armored because that's the only way to get the wire or you paid through the nose for ADSS. And last thing you wanna do on a buried run is butt joins. The length is too long; you're gonna need either embedded flying wire or (per code) buried metal conduit. 50/125's treated as LV run.

And even without a direct lightning strike, copper can still be impacted by local lightning strikes/static causing the gear on either end to fail if not grounded properly.

Well, hence why I said done right. Fast, cheap, doesn't explode in flames - choose only two. Cat5e gives you cheap and doesn't explode in flames, fiber gives you fast and not exploding but definitely not cheap. Need SX LC multimode 850nm, not LX SC single. TBH I'd use a Juniper EX2200-C there with EX-SFP-1GE-SX on -1/0, isolated VLAN, and a 50/125 or OM2 run.
ke4pym
Premium Member
join:2004-07-24
Charlotte, NC

ke4pym

Premium Member

It'd be really helpful if we knew the run length of the OP's run. But, here we go:

»www.newegg.com/Product/P ··· 33114041

SC/SC 550m @$82. Need two. $164

550 meters is a loooong way.

2 Strand Custom Indoor/Outdoor - not armored - Multimode 62.5/125 OM1 Assembly - 1800 feet SC/SC is $727 at the LAN Shack. Pick up some CPVC for basic protection and all it a day.

More moderate lengths are significantly less pricy. I use those transceivers and they work wonderfully.