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neill6705
join:2014-08-09

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neill6705

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Data Caps

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Well, looks like I went over CL's 250GB data cap the last couple of months. The reason for the high data usage, as I stated in my previous post, is that I get IPTV over a GRE tunnel from my employer - a local telco co-op. Now I have two options - switch to a business account or switch back to Dish for TV. I'll probably do the earlier as it will still be less expensive.

I've always found data caps amusing - we'll sell you this really fast connection, but you have to agree not to use it to its full potential.
nonymous (banned)
join:2003-09-08
Glendale, AZ

nonymous (banned)

Member

Not defending caps in general. But if you have a cap that does seem way past it? Not even just a bit over.
I have Netflix with cable internet and it goes over some with soft caps. But not multiple times over.

Atom90
join:2014-12-05

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I'm not a big fan of CenturyLink or data caps, but the fact that you managed to go 6.5 times over the 250GiB cap is amazing. And then you come here to complain about them after they call you out on it.

You must also be watching an incredible about of TV over your internet. Because HDTV can consume between 2.5 - 7GiB an hour, depending on the bitrate and codec used. Netflix and Youtube usually use around 2GiB per hour of 1080p.

I frequently go above my 150GiB limit, but not sure I have ever even doubled it. They have never contacted me about it.
said by neill6705:

I've always found data caps amusing - we'll sell you this really fast connection, but you have to agree not to use it to its full potential. Fuck you, Centurylink.

Cell phone data plans do the same, they give you 4G 50Mbit DL but a 10GiB cap. And they have a pretty hard cap usually.

neill6705
join:2014-08-09

2 edits

neill6705

Member

said by Atom90:

And then you come here to complain about them after they call you out on it.

Yeah, I just felt like ranting. I was also frustrated at the time because my browser kept redirecting to this page and I had to use my PIA VPN before I could do anything. It stopped doing it later that day.

It is a ridiculous amount of data. My family has a bad habit of leaving the set top boxes on. I'm going to try and teach them to turn them off. I have a feeling we'll still be over though.
coryw
join:2013-12-22
Flagstaff, AZ

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Yeah, the caps are pretty ridiculous, and the fact that it took them until you'd gone over a few times, not just over, but so many times over, to actually say something about it, definitely shows that it's not really about network management.

In areas where 1.5 megabits is the only service available, about the maximum you could ever transfer over the line, presuming peak efficiency (PTM transfer mode, no PPPoE overhead, 1.5/1.5, a single computer on Ethernet pulling in files using a really efficient program, no need to reboot for security updates) you could probably pull in about 400 gigabytes total during the month. The thing about those areas is that there's usually a HUGE congestion point right at the DSLAM. They feed each 48-port DSLAM with up to eight T1s, so twelve megabits is being share by 48 people. I don't think caps are the right way to do it, but there's totally some justification for some network management in there.

On the Qwest fiber-fed ADSL2+ and VDSL2 networks, congestion is usually further up stream, in the BRAS in the central office or somewhere even further down the line, such as at CenturyLink's peering with a transit ISP.

They're working on fixing that by replacing their core routers (this will also unify the core Embarq/CenturyTel and Qwest networks) but who knows how long until that project is finished, and if we'll even hear about it when it's one.

I've been notified once before, which on its own really wasn't that bad, the biggest problem with it was that I was already having sync issues, and of the three or four DNS servers my local network uses only one is on a Qwest network, so while synced at 96/64 kilobytes, I was totally unable to load the page. Once it retrained and I was back at 144/96 or so it was able to load and I was able to get past it.

Business class is potentially a solution, for 1.5 megs it's not even that much more than residential is especially with the recent $2 price hike, but as you go up the tier ladder, business class gets very expensive very quickly.
nonymous (banned)
join:2003-09-08
Glendale, AZ

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There still may be a difference between over and over? Do not have Centurylink anymore. But other here may be able to tell you when the caps really kick in? Do they go after a bit over or a lot over? Are there penalties?
But most places when you hit some magically top user thing even soft CAPS tend to kick in.

neill6705
join:2014-08-09

neill6705

Member

As far as I can tell, there aren't any penalties. It seems like they just cut you off after a certain point after some warnings.
Donat76
join:2003-01-26
Oelwein, IA

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They can only make you switch to a business plan or cut you off if you go over 3 times in a 12 month rolling period. Their language is very specific on being vague on when they enforce the policy. One ISP I could get in my area charges $10 for every 50GB over their 250GB cap. CL / Qwest has been very good to me. Although they don't heavily enforce caps if there is no congestion, your usage at that level obviously raised some red flags in their system.

Excessive Use Policy
»internethelp.centurylink ··· /EUP.pdf

High Speed Internet Management Policy
»www.centurylink.com/Page ··· agement/

Q: Will I be notified if I am coming close to reaching the data usage limit for my High-Speed
Internet service?

A: Currently there is no advance warning provided. However, if CenturyLink contacts you to advise you
that you have reached or exceeded your usage limits, we will allow time for you to reduce your data
usage or we will assist you in migrating to an alternative product that better meets your online needs.

Q: Will you inform me of the need to change my High-Speed Internet service?

A: Yes. If CenturyLink contacts you to advise you that you have exceeded the
download usage limits, we
will explain the limits of your current service, allow you time to reduce your usage, and provide guidance
regarding available options for upgrading your service to a higher speed residential plan or a businessclass
high-speed service. If you continue to exceed your usage plan without taking advantage of one of
the many options provided, CenturyLink reserves the right to disconnect your service after the third month
of excessive usage in a rolling 12-month period. CenturyLink will weigh variables such as network health,
congestion, availability of customer usage data, and the line speed purchased by the customer as factors
when enforcing this policy.
Donat76

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Click for full size
Usage
I always try to stay just below the 250 GB limit since I don't want to push my luck. I don't use CL DNS servers so I wonder if I would get any notices if I went over?

Cl doesn't count the upload bandwidth towards the cap.

neill6705
join:2014-08-09

2 edits

neill6705

Member

said by Donat76:

I don't use CL DNS servers so I wonder if I would get any notices if I went over?

I use OpenDNS, so that answers that.
said by Donat76:

Cl doesn't count the upload bandwidth towards the cap.

Transit providers typically don't charge for upstream bandwidth, so it makes sense that it wouldn't count toward your cap.
neill6705

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said by coryw:

Business class is potentially a solution, for 1.5 megs it's not even that much more than residential

lol 1.5mbps isn't a solution. I think I'd pass on using the internet at those speeds.
Donat76
join:2003-01-26
Oelwein, IA

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said by neill6705:

I use OpenDNS, so that answers that.

Thanks neill6705. Must be a notification in a walled garden.
Jeffo
join:2009-08-25
Downing, WI

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Nothing like having a 1st world problem

I live in the states and Centurylink supplies me with an incredible 512K DSL connection for the amazing value of $49.99/month. Bundled with my single land line my monthly bill is over $100/month.

I think there are tribes living deep in the amazon rain forest that would weep for my developing nation internet service.

neill6705
join:2014-08-09

neill6705

Member

said by Jeffo:

Nothing like having a 1st world problem

lol People in Uganda don't have to deal with this crap - »www.technologyreview.com ··· -uganda/

But then I don't have to deal with a lack of food, water, medical care , or shelter, so I guess I can't complain too much.

As far as your internet, you're out in the boonies I take it?
brad152
join:2006-07-27
Chicago, IL

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I've never gotten a notice, but i'm sure i've never came close to 1TB either on my 40/5 line.

Our usage us usually around 200-400GB most months and we've not heard a word from CenturyLink about it.
coryw
join:2013-12-22
Flagstaff, AZ

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My particular location is only served by 1.5 megabits. I have in fact considered canceling and going without. There's a cable provider, but their service is down more often than it's up.

toby
Troy Mcclure
join:2001-11-13
Seattle, WA

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My use is in the 400 to 500 GB range, I have the business line, so I'm ok.
Donat76
join:2003-01-26
Oelwein, IA

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Business lines have no cap. If I could afford it, I would go with one.

neill6705
join:2014-08-09

neill6705

Member

said by Donat76:

Business lines have no cap. If I could afford it, I would go with one.

A business account would also give me access to the 40/2 bonded tier. If I go with their core connect package, which includes a phone line, Office 365, and some other crap I won't use, it's only $85 a month. If you just get internet, it's $155 for some reason.

Anyone care to explain that logic to me?

toby
Troy Mcclure
join:2001-11-13
Seattle, WA

toby

Member

20/2 business is $85 plus real and pretend taxes, is about $109.

40/2 business is not $85 per month it is more than that, over $150 I think.

neill6705
join:2014-08-09

neill6705

Member

said by toby:

40/2 business is not $85 per month it is more than that, over $150 I think.

Ah, I just glanced at the pricing briefly. When I took a closer look, CoreConnect with 40/2mbps is $115/mo. Still substantially cheaper than pure internet.

toby
Troy Mcclure
join:2001-11-13
Seattle, WA

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CL Biz rates
I see different rates than that.
These are all plus real taxes and pretend taxes.

For example the coreconnect which has the most taxes takes a $85 cost to $109 in WA.

The faster the speeds, the cheaper the office internet packages are, as they don't contain any real taxes, just small pretend ones that CL adds on.
coryw
join:2013-12-22
Flagstaff, AZ

coryw

Member

It's worth noting that those rates were all generated on a premise that can get 40/20 on a single pair on residential. A premise that can only get 20/896k is going to have slightly different pricing, but it's a good guideline for what kinds of things make the price go up.

For example, 100/12 is 332/mo when 80/40 is 431.

Given that the non-promo residential rate for 20m/896k is like $70/mo, it wouldn't at all have surprised me to see 40/2 at closer to $200/mo, just because Centurylink charges very dearly for the use of two ports. It may be worth if it if saves some time/effort/equipment costs on your end for a load balancing router, however, or you want the better combined upstream pipe without relying on a multi-link VPN provider.

One other interesting note about CenturyLink is that if they ever install fiber, the pricing starts to look really weird too. There's a 40/5 tier, that's maybe $150/mo, and then 60/60 is $200 and 100/100 is $250-ish. This is all with a phone line, so compare to CoreConnect pricing at about $520 for 80/40. I think part of that is that you're still only using one port to get 100/100, so they don't need to charge the bonding tax.

toby
Troy Mcclure
join:2001-11-13
Seattle, WA

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Residential DSL
That max I can get residential on a single pair is 12/.896, with the business line it went to 20/2 over two pairs.

Here is a graphic for residential that has been quoted before here.
firedrakes
join:2009-01-29
Arcadia, FL

firedrakes

Member

i go over my 250gb ever month and not have had a issue. i am also getting their ip tv to. and have a bonded line. none business class
CenturyLink
join:2009-03-09
Boise, ID

CenturyLink to neill6705

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Hi, Neil.
I you're still needing questions answered on this, please send me the details and I'll email you back. I can be reached here: bit.ly/TTUwf

Make sure to include a link to this thread if you contact me.

Thanks!
^Doug

JeeperDon
join:2015-02-19
Albuquerque, NM

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I just got off the phone with CTL supervisor, found out this...

Yes there is a 250G limit, that he claimed is a federal thing. Zero sales people I talked to know there is a limit, will tell you there is none. I've had CTL for 3.5 yrs. I was able to get from them all my monthly data amounts for the three years. For the 1st 18 months I was below 250G. For the past two years I was above it, with a 2014 average about 500G/mo. I never got a notice in those two yrs.

Today the guy tells me it's based upon congestion (said that why sales people don't know of the cap). If my neighborhood shows congestion, they look which IPs are the high flyers, might be a few, and they get an 'intervention web page' notice (my term, not theirs). Mine from yesterday gave the past three months. They were 500ish/500ish/1300G. The last was because we do cloud backups and had to do a restore after a hard drive crash.

Here is the real crap!!!! Once flagged as a bad guy (like me now), every month I go over 250G I get another slap. Six more slaps in a year and they kick me out. Now, while they are slapping me for 251G, all my neighbors can be at 400+ all day, as long as there is no more congestion. Lastly, there is no CTL online tool to tell you what you are using, so you can help manage your usage.

So, since I've been at 500+ for almost 2 yrs, no way I can pare down my life to less than 250G (FYI 15 hrs a week of streaming HD netflix uses about 125G).

billaustin
they call me Mr. Bill
MVM
join:2001-10-13
North Las Vegas, NV

billaustin

MVM

You can convert to a business account with no caps. I would suggest investing in several USB drives instead of using a cloud backup service.

JeeperDon
join:2015-02-19
Albuquerque, NM

JeeperDon

Member

You missed the main points. Such as the sales people don't tell you there are limits when asked, and there is no tool to self monitor your usage, and that the system it triggered by congestion, (not traffic) then policed to one person by traffic. The whole cap system seems thrown together, then band aided.

OpTiC
Premium Member
join:2014-03-08
West Covina, CA

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said by neill6705:

Well, looks like I went over CL's 250GB data cap the last couple of months. The reason for the high data usage, as I stated in my previous post, is that I get IPTV over a GRE tunnel from my employer - a local telco co-op. Now I have two options - switch to a business account or switch back to Dish for TV. I'll probably do the earlier as it will still be less expensive.

I've always found data caps amusing - we'll sell you this really fast connection, but you have to agree not to use it to its full potential.

I agree with your point. It's pretty much caps are telling you we have a faster connection but you can't use it. What is the point of a 1GBPS connection with caps. I know 1GBPS doesn't have caps.