boaterbob Premium Member join:2005-08-01 Moncks Corner, SC |
Disabeling 180db alarm on carbon monoxide detectorI would like to have a carbon monoxide detector with a number screen but either w/o a horn or being able to disarm the horn - also battery operated. This is to allow me to move it all around w/o the horn ever going off in the house during my testing but still allow me to see the the concentrations (if any) in different areas. |
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garys_2k Premium Member join:2004-05-07 Farmington, MI |
garys_2k
Premium Member
2015-Feb-25 3:15 pm
May have to conduct wire snipper surgery on one. |
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1 recommendation |
to boaterbob
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2 recommendations |
to boaterbob
+1 to dharel1705 What you are trying to do is not going to work well at all, since a detector is designed to monitor an area over a period of time, and looks for build-up trends in CO. They do NOT respond therefore (by design) to rapid level changes, such as a car pulling into a garage, and then shut off, followed by the doorway then being opened to the living space and bringing in a "draft" of CO. If they were that sensitive, they would go off far too often and cause many false-positives. |
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TheMG Premium Member join:2007-09-04 Canada MikroTik RB450G Cisco DPC3008 Cisco SPA112
2 recommendations |
to boaterbob
I agree with the other posters that you need a proper CO testing/measuring tool.
CO detectors are very slow to react. It can take many minutes up to several hours for those detectors to respond to small or moderate concentrations of CO. They're not like smoke detectors which respond nearly instantly to smoke. Even very high CO concentrations can take a couple minutes for a typical CO detector to alarm.
This slow response time is ok when used as an alarm, since CO slowly builds up inside a building, it doesn't suddenly go from no CO to a high life-threatening concentration.
But as a tool for surveying CO levels that slow response time makes them nearly useless, and I would question the accuracy of the measurements. |
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garys_2k Premium Member join:2004-05-07 Farmington, MI
1 recommendation |
to mattmag
+2, and thanks for the information! |
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boaterbob Premium Member join:2005-08-01 Moncks Corner, SC |
Okay, I'm off to research CO 'testers' - appreciate the help. Can always get a 'tester' at THD and if it doesn't do the job, return it.
Everything in my house is electric (live in the Charleston, SC area) except a wood burning fire place that was converted to a propane ventless gas log stove by the builder when the house was new. It's this propane ventless gas log fireplace I want to check for possible carbon monoxide. |
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boaterbob |
FYIO - an interesting FAQ from one Web site - again just some useful reading for a novice. » sensorcon.com/solutions- ··· tor-faqs |
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LazMan Premium Member join:2003-03-26 Beverly Hills, CA
1 recommendation |
to boaterbob
Just to build on what others have said...
CO detectors, by design, monitor what's called a "Time Weighted Average" - in English, the higher the concentration, the faster it will alarm - at 40 ppm, it may take an hour for the alarm to trigger; and at 400 ppm it may take 10 minutes, and at 1000 ppm, it should be nearly instantaneous.
CO monitors, on the other hand, are designed to continuously monitor and report CO levels.
Also, by code & law, there is a minimum audible alert level for CO detectors...
CO monitors aren't cheap - I'll warn you ahead of time... An MSA Altair CO detector is about $250.
Are you experiencing symptoms, or is your current alarm going off? Why are you looking for, or expecting CO throughout the home?
CO is essentially the same density as air (CO = .97 vs Air = 1.0) - so it mixes very easily, and completely with 'normal' air - so typically there aren't great variations within the conditioned space of a home... |
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boaterbob Premium Member join:2005-08-01 Moncks Corner, SC |
The reason for the tester is simply, as I posted, I have 4br/3bth house in SC with a wood burning fireplace (chimney, etc) that was converted by the house builder before we bought it new - 7 years ago/2007 - to a ventless log propane fireplace using propane from an outside tank. The pilot stay on full time. Never had any issues, especially with the chimney never being 100% draft free as the original damper always has a small fraction of an inch gap when it is closed - normal amount I suppose.
But, would a ventless log propane stove used only on occasion, but with the pilot always on, cause any CO issues? Guess I simply wanted to know. Have not had any problems in the past - that I know of!
But I want to be safe. |
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rody_44 Premium Member join:2004-02-20 Quakertown, PA
2 recommendations |
rody_44
Premium Member
2015-Feb-26 9:39 am
Imagine all the people that have gas stoves and ovens with pilots always lit and they have no exhaust. In otherwords no it shouldnt be a issue. But with any fireplace its good to have a CO2 monitor. But i would want a monitor not a tester for that. |
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chamberc Premium Member join:2008-08-05 Addison, TX |
to boaterbob
I have a ventless NG insert with pilot always on and have no CO issues. Now granted it is in a 40x 36 living room, but doesn't cause any detection problems. We have 17 wired CO/Fire detectors and have never had a detection issue. |
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LazMan Premium Member join:2003-03-26 Beverly Hills, CA
2 recommendations |
to boaterbob
Your reasons are sound - but that's exactly what a standard residential CO detector is for... To detect a build up of CO within the home. Get one (I happen to like Kidde Nighthawk CO/Gas detectors, personally), place it near your sleeping area, and maintain it per the instructions.
To get a monitor is, IMO, overkill...
CO is a product of incomplete combustion - properly adjusted, clean burning pilots or burners hardly produce any CO at all. It's clogged/blocked vents or orifices, and cracked heat exchangers that generally lead to excessive CO production.
I don't like ventless logs, myself - but if they are properly maintained, and your home isn't super-sealed, they should be fine.
But do get a CO detector, install it, and pay attention to it... they don't go off for no reason! |
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to boaterbob
said by boaterbob:But, would a ventless log propane stove used only on occasion, but with the pilot always on, cause any CO issues? Guess I simply wanted to know. Have not had any problems in the past - that I know of! Good reason to want to know, and +1 to what LazMan said. That's a perfect application for a regular CO detector, and that's what you want to know anyway--- Is the long-term presence of the pilot safe. Again, you're a step ahead of most folks. |
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to boaterbob
said by boaterbob:But, would a ventless log propane stove used only on occasion, but with the pilot always on, cause any CO issues? Guess I simply wanted to know. Have not had any problems in the past - that I know of! We have a Vermont Castings ventless propane and use exactly as you (maybe 10 years now). When we got it I was frankly disbelieving of the ventless concept, and very concerned as we have birds (parrots), but have to say we've never had a CO problem. But neither have we used the upstairs rooms as sleeping rooms (and our house is wide-open to the 2nd story) so if your situation is different you should by all means have a CO detector. But I would have to say by observation of our own that even in a very tight house like ours it seems never to have any smell or CO or buildup of any kind. |
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TheMG Premium Member join:2007-09-04 Canada MikroTik RB450G Cisco DPC3008 Cisco SPA112
1 edit |
TheMG
Premium Member
2015-Feb-27 2:19 pm
said by tomupnorth:so if your situation is different you should by all means have a CO detector. ANYONE who has ANY fuel-burning (gas, oil, etc, ventless or vented) appliances in their home SHOULD have a CO alarm. It's $30 that could one day save your life. Cheap insurance if you ask me. said by tomupnorth:even in a very tight house like ours it seems never to have any smell or CO or buildup of any kind. CO has NO SMELL!!! That's why it's so dangerous, because by the time you realize what's going on it might be too late. Or if a fuel burning appliance malfunctions in the middle of the night, you might die in your sleep without ever knowing it. The other thing that's dangerous are the symptoms, which are mainly fatigue, headaches, and nausea. People who encounter these symptoms tend to think they're just coming down with the flu, so they go to bed to sleep it off, which may be the last thing they ever do. CO is a "silent" killer. Every year many people die in their own homes due to a malfunctioning fuel burning appliance, because they did not have a CO alarm. |
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ke4pym Premium Member join:2004-07-24 Charlotte, NC |
to boaterbob
You know, if Nest really wanted to get in on the safety thing, they need to build a CO detector that can link to the thermostat and if a hazard condition presents itself it could turn the heat off.
Granted this would be limited to those certain situations. But in my home the only system that could kill anything with CO would be the furnace. |
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MK101 Premium Member join:2001-03-13 Around |
MK101
Premium Member
2015-Feb-27 4:17 pm
They do...
For your safety, when Nest Protect detects emergency levels of carbon monoxide (CO) it communicates with the Nest Learning Thermostats in your home to shut off your fossil fuel based home heating system. |
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to TheMG
said by TheMG:CO has NO SMELL!!!
That's why it's so dangerous Nice rant, but I know this. I said no smell or CO, not smell of CO. We've been very happy with our ventless propane appliance. |
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LazMan Premium Member join:2003-03-26 Beverly Hills, CA |
LazMan
Premium Member
2015-Feb-27 5:01 pm
said by tomupnorth:said by TheMG:CO has NO SMELL!!!
That's why it's so dangerous Nice rant, but I know this. I said no smell or CO, not smell of CO. We've been very happy with our ventless propane appliance. Do you have a CO detector? If not; no way of knowing the levels of CO in your home. TheMG's right on - just this month, I've been to multiple CO calls, where the homeowners dismissed the alarms sounding as a false alarm, and the headache, weakness, and tired feelings they had to the flu... One house was in excess of 200 ppm; others were in the 40-80 range. |
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bgeery join:2011-07-28 Yucca Valley, CA |
to boaterbob
I know others have already posted good info, but I'll add my two cents anyway.
CO is insidious. You often cannot tell it's about to kill you without an alarm for early warning. Many people die with NO symptoms at all. They just pass out where they stand and never wake up.
Just last winter, 5 people died, in my small town of 20K people, from CO poisoning. Whole families die.
Spend the money on detectors. |
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fartness (banned)Donald Trump 2016 join:2003-03-25 Look Outside |
to boaterbob
Gas company came and had a tester that detected CO. Looked expensive though but was small and handheld. |
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jrs8084 Premium Member join:2002-03-02 Statesville, NC |
to boaterbob
I have ventless gas logs that I use (they are actually cast faux logs with a bunch of holes in them) Not pretty, but convenient. The dog loves them.
I know some people complain about the indoor air quality, but I have never had a problem. Then again, my home is of '53 construction, so it isn't as tight as Dick's hat band like new homes.
When I started using the logs often (around 2000) I got an additional CO detector specifically for that room. That model displayed the actual PPM. How accurate it was, I don't know, but I would use them for hours, and I never saw any change in the PPM. |
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