Regional Talk > Southern California > How much life left in Adelphia?

reply to IPPlanMan

Emhinkes

Check out these links for more info on the moratoriums:

Link #1: City council on Utility permits

The line reading was interesting:

quote:

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City Council approved a motion instructing the City Engineer not to grant utility / excavation permits or revocable permits and the Department of Water and Power not to approve pole-mounts for telecommunication cabinets and conduits unless exempted through Council offices or, in an emergency, by the Department of Public Works.

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quote:

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5-28-02 - Information Technology and General Services Committee report ADOPTED to:
1. ADOPT the Chief Legislative Analyst (CLA) report recommendations dated May 23, 2002, relative to the AGFSP, attached to the Council file.
2. INSTRUCT the Bureau of Engineering to immediately lift the moratorium on utility and excavation permits enacted under Council file 99-0300 and fully implement the provisions of the AGFSP.
3. REQUEST the City Attorney to prepare and present an Ordinance within 90 days to codify the provisions of the AGFSP into the Los Angeles Municipal Code.
4. INSTRUCT the Bureau of Engineering to coordinate with the Information Technology Agency to post this AGFSP on the City’s homepage.
5. DIRECT City Departments, including the Department of Transportation and the Department of Water and Power, to review their existing policies for other facilities in the public right-of-way and recommend any appropriate changes necessary to comply with the intent of the new AGFSP.
5-30-02 - File to Information Technology and General Services Committee Clerk OK

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reply to MacLeech
"Adelphia didn't launch Century's cable modem plan, they stopped that plan, redesigned, budgeted, and rebuilt with loftier goals in mind. The type of rebuild Adelphia's been doing usually doubles the equipment needed at the street level cabling, all of it having to be placed either on poles or in cabinets, all of it needing more power than before."

Sounds like Adelphia didn't do their homework here first. These plans were probably approved by the city already....sigh....And their goals, while loftier, obviously weren't planned by people who knew that the company would be bankrupt shortly. You think Perron knew this 3 months ago when he said we'd have Powerlink within 60 days in West LA? Was that genuine or lip service? That's the problem with lying.... I'll never trust Adelphia... never.... They haven't earned it. Lemme guess...another 60 days?

For that matter, why wasn't Adelphia forthcoming about what the delays were from? It took the Los Angeles Times to get to the bottom of this. Why the years of lies?

Again, if my phone goes out, I'm not gonna call the DWP and ask them to fix it. Adelphia either didn't know, or they did know and intentionally lied about their progress in our market. (Financials, Rollout Progress, what's the difference?)

"5)Permit may expire after 6 months without job being done."

I like fine print..... So here's something in the fine print.... Let's start that clock.... Sigh. Now this is something you can blame on Adelphia, and not the city. Hey man, rules are rules.

Current blame and prior blame... It's important to know the difference. What a shame Adelphia left themselves in a piss-poor state so that they probably can't even fix my digital cable should it break. That's a load on their shoulders... no one else's.

"How do you think Adelphia could have worked around the moratoriums? "

Clout.... If Rigas had done even 1/10th of what he did in Coudersport in terms of money and clout, we'd have our cable modem. It's all about give and take.... and all Rigas did was take.
--
A proud card carrying member of the Right Wing Conspiracy. "I have spoken... There will be peace in the valley."

reply to MacLeech
With respect to Adelphia, they should have been working with the City during the moratorium period, performing work that did not require an excavation permit or power from DWP. These two points happen to be where Adelphia is log jammed now, right?

But consider the FACT that Adelphia did not commence one iota of construction in LA until the fall of 2000. This work included the stringing of fiber throughout the City. Moreover, consider Mr. Winthrop's words where he now stated publicly that the Sherman Oaks, Eagle Rock and East LA systems are cumulatively less than 50% complete in a release. Consider that Perron's statement in March mentioned the Sherman Oaks system as 40% complete and the Eagle Rock system as 5% complete. My questions to you MacLeech would be (1) what effort did Adelphia engage in to have the moratorium lifted, and (2) what could they have accomplished in the City while they were prevented from installing above ground cabinets, and having DWP provision power to those sites?

On point (1) its important to note that any moratorium of duration greater than one year is presumptively held INVALID should the moratorium be challenged in court.

The City certainly is at fault here for the moratorium being established. But honestly, Adelphia was asleep at the wheel or too busy playing golf or counting cash, as the moratorium could have been challenged in court as early as mid-2000, but no one did anything about it. Lemme guess.... I could have done something, with all of my clout and cash!

But when ALL is said and done, and you step back objectively, you realize that (1) Adelphia agreed to purchase Century, I believe in Sept 98; (2) they closed on the transaction, I believe, in March '99; so (3) during that time they were conducting their own due diligence.

Bottom line, Adelphia should have known about the effort to impose a moratorium early in their review process, and if not, they certainly knew by the time they closed the transaction with Century.

The biggest problem I see here is one of PUBLIC RELATIONS. This is only one of the areas where Adelphia failed, but here it failed big time. Despite the moratorium, and their apparent knowledge of it (which I'm waiting for you to deny....), and its effect on their efforts in the City of LA, they cont'd to tell their customers "within 6 months" with respect to digital cable and/or cable modem. Am I not correct on this?

Remember the Bill Rosendahl letter of Sept '99 that included two coupons, one for cable modem, and another for "digital STB" installation. How can Adelphia reconcile its behavior with the facts it now points to? Hmmm.
--
A proud card carrying member of the Right Wing Conspiracy.

"I have spoken... There will be peace in the valley."
[text was edited by author 2002-06-06 02:55:48]

When I was late in delivering a product to one of my customers, what they told me seems to be applicable here ... "I don't care if you had to walk 20 miles, uphill in both directions under a 110 degree sun through 40 foot snowdrifts - you shouldn't have promised me you would deliver unless you knew you could. I'm interested in product, not hype or excuses.".

Or the one about the gorgeous gal who had been married for 10 years and her virtue was still intact - the reason, her husband was a salesman who kept telling her how good it was going to be.

Ken

At what point should Adelphia be blamed for not sharing this information and for lying to us about what they obviously did know?

4 Days, 4 weeks, 4 months, 4 years? We've been through all those time intervals of promises....

So what's your tolerance level? You obviously seemed to have drawn judgment on mine.
--
A proud card carrying member of the Right Wing Conspiracy. "I have spoken... There will be peace in the valley."

reply to IPPlanMan

said by emhinkes:

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Sounds like Adelphia didn't do their homework here first. These plans were probably approved by the city already....sigh....And their goals, while loftier, obviously weren't planned by people who knew that the company would be bankrupt shortly.

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said by emhinkes:

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For that matter, why wasn't Adelphia forthcoming about what the delays were from? It took the Los Angeles Times to get to the bottom of this. Why the years of lies?

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said by emhinkes:

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Again, if my phone goes out, I'm not gonna call the DWP and ask them to fix it.

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said by emhinkes:

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Adelphia either didn't know, or they did know and intentionally lied about their progress in our market. (Financials, Rollout Progress, what's the difference?)

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said by emhinkes:

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"5)Permit may expire after 6 months without job being done."

I like fine print..... So here's something in the fine print.... Let's start that clock.... Sigh. Now this is something you can blame on Adelphia, and not the city. Hey man, rules are rules.

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said by emhinkes:

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Current blame and prior blame... It's important to know the difference.

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said by emhinkes:

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What a shame Adelphia left themselves in a piss-poor state so that they probably can't even fix my digital cable should it break. That's a load on their shoulders... no one else's.

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said by emhinkes:

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"How do you think Adelphia could have worked around the moratoriums? "
Clout.... If Rigas had done even 1/10th of what he did in Coudersport in terms of money and clout, we'd have our cable modem. It's all about give and take.... and all Rigas did was take.

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"But, now you believe that Adelphia knew it might have to declare bankruptcy back in 1999 so it shouldn't have gone about replacing the previously existing system?"

No, I was referring to the impending moratorium. However, it's also surprising that they didn't see their impending doom either, now that you mention it.

"Why wasn't Adelphia forthcoming? Probably a combination marketing worries, politics, and expectations of the City Council letting the moratorium expire.
Adelphia didn't want to annouce: "Due to the fact the LA City Council has implimented a moratorium, designed to slow or stop the upgrades for the city's telecommunication systems, we won't be able to offer you cable modem service, expanded channel selection, or digital TV services for at least a few years or whenever the city council decides to let us install the equipment necassary."
Adelphia might has well have said: "The city screwed us and doesn't want Adelphia to provide you better service, please go to your nearest DBS provider for service."
"

For once somebody actually addresses the issue. This is lip service, plain and simple. I wonder if the LA Times was involved 4 years ago, we might actually have broadband here. I find it no coincidence that the recent articles in the LA Times, my letters to Adelphia and the city council, have resulted in some significant actions/press releases in the last few months by Adelphia. Adelphia should have come out clean and explained the situation to its paying subs.... Not once in nearly 5 years have they done this. Not once! Terrible judgment on their part.

"No I wouldn't call the DWP to fix my phone (or cable or cellphone for that matter) either. But I'm sure if Verizon, Sprint, Cingular, Adelphia, or any other telecom provider was needing power to activate additional equipment to get their customers better service they would call the DWP."

The DWP wasn't causing the overall holdup here. That was a manufactured lie by Adelphia, and the first time that they actually tried to excuse the slow rollout of service, remember? Otherwise, it was silence and "6 month intervals" for over 4 years.

"The progress was severlly curtailed by the moratorium which was extended several times in 3-6 months timeframes. Does this sound familiar at all? I'm sure had the moratorium been dropped the rebuild would have been done long ago.

As far as the difference between financials and rollouts, ask all of the people in this forum if the current Adelphia money problems has affected their launched cable modem service.
"

I'm sure that it was... but the issue here is that Adelphia was not being truthful and forthcoming about the reasons for the delay. As angry as I am about this lie, had I known the truth years ago, believe me, I would be just as angry at the city back then.

"This makes me wonder if Adelphia could file a lawsuit against the City Council or City of Los Angeles for not allowing Adelphia to upgrade their equipment in a timely manner, thus preventing a very large amount of revenue that could have possible prevented the current cash crunch the company is having now."

Hey, why not?

"If your worried or having problems, give them a call. Otherwise how's your service since your cable boxes were replaced?"

No problems as of yet since the boxes were replaced. I'm just hoping not to lose any channels, that's all.

Thanks for your learned postings. Please address the second one I made when you have a moment.

em
--
A proud card carrying member of the Right Wing Conspiracy. "I have spoken... There will be peace in the valley."

reply to IPPlanMan

Why didn't Adelphia explain the situation...

Em, thanks for the links you found:

»www.larta.org/pl/NewsArticles/la···y00.html

»www.vica.com/old_site/positionpa···row.html

I believe your starting to realize that Adelphia, along with all of the other broadband providers, has had its hands tied in reguards to upgrading the city of Los Angeles.

Its too bad that, at this point, it seems like it might be too little, too late for Adelphia. Had these issues been brought to light earlier by enough concerned residents the City might have allowed the upgrades to proceed unimpeded months or years ago and you would most likely have cable modem service now.

But considering Adelphia's current situation, it will be delayed again for at least another few months. I don't think you will ever know how close you've been to getting cable modem service in your area now...
--
Trace, CableFAQ, NetTech, CiscoTAC
[text was edited by author 2002-06-07 12:07:29]

a very interesting discussion.
I thank everyone for it

Hob
being nice
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These pretzels are making me thirsty

reply to IPPlanMan

edited.

reply to IPPlanMan

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reply to MacLeech

Re: Why didn't Adelphia explain the situation...

Em,
I don't know all of the politics involved, but clearly Adelphia wasn't the only company hurt by this lengthy moratorium. Verizon was clearly slowed in their DSL rollout, as was Sprint (search through the city coucil records) in placing some of its cell sites (which I believe were also used in their wireless ION broadband service).

I think, Adelphia was in the worst position of all the telecom companies due to the late entry into the market, antiquated cable systems, cable service report, heavy debt incured aquiring the franchises, and impending overbuilder. So I don't think the Adelphia management really wanted to take the position of "city whistleblower" and possibly blow the entire franchise deal vital to their success (obviously in question now) from being renegotiated favorably in 2002 (now 2003). That entire situation didn't exist in the mid-90s for Century in Santa Monica. Again its my opinion, concidering the reports I've seen, as far as the real reasons I don't know I wasn't invited to those meetings.

But if what you say is true reguarding moratoriums being "the fact that a moratorium beyond a year is presumptively invalid (as a matter of law)" why didn't any of the other telecom companies take the city to court? Again I think there is much more going on politically than has been revealed so far, otherwise the moratoriums would have been shot down in a heartbeat by every other telecom provider clamoring to provide service to the broadbandless residents of Los Angeles.

As far as the work Adelphia has accomplished, its been pretty extensive (albeit at a very slow pace) otherwise you wouldn't have the digital cable service you have(although now that I check, it isn't the full digital lineup, so your area is still bandwidth starved at some point).

Construction that needed permits wasn't completely halted, just extremely constrained and under very close scutiny by the city council.

quote from city council report:

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9-14-99 - This days Council session - Motion - Miscikowski Mover 1999 / Hernandez - On February 23, 1999 the City Council approved a motion instructing the City Engineer not to grant utility/excavation permits or revocable permits and the Dept of Water and Power not to approve pole-mounts for telecommunication cabinets and conduits unless exempted through Council offices or in an emergency by the Dept of Public Works

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"The politics run deep..."

Not now they don't.... This Cindy Miscikowski got a fire lit under her butt by that LA Times article.

»www.latimes.com/business/la-0000···16.story

(Copied because registration is required for LA Times)

March 16, 2002
Adelphia Says City Slowing Its Broadband Roll-Out
Internet: Company says reconstruction work for high-speed services is being delayed by lack of electricity from DWP.
 

   By JON HEALEY, TIMES STAFF WRITER
Despite a boost from federal regulators, the largest cable operator in Los Angeles said Friday that its roll-out of high-speed Internet services didn't have the power needed to get out of low gear--and blamed the city for the delay.

Of the five cable operators serving Greater Los Angeles, Adelphia Communications Corp. has offered high-speed cable modem service to the smallest percentage of its service area--a little less than 40%. By contrast, AT&T Corp., Cox Communications Inc., Charter Communications Inc. and Time Warner Cable say they have made cable modems available to at least 93% of their subscribers.

Cable modems have three main advantages over dial-up Internet access: They're up to 20 times faster, they're always connected to the Internet, and they don't tie up a phone line. The service, which typically costs $20 to $30 more a month than a dial-up account, is widely viewed as one of the critical precursors to the distribution of music and movies via the Internet. Aiming to promote high-speed Internet access, the Federal Communications Commission said Thursday that cable modems were an information service, not a cable service, greatly reducing the threat of local regulation.

But Lee Perron, Adelphia's vice president of corporate affairs in Southern California, said the main hurdle for his company had not been regulation; it had been getting the Los Angeles Department of Water and Power to provide electricity.

Before it can offer service to former customers of Century Communications Corp., which Adelphia bought for $5.2 billion in 1999, Adelphia must replace Century's antiquated cables with high-capacity two-way systems that allow data to flow in and out of a home.
Perron said reconstruction work in the Sherman Oaks and Westwood areas was only about 40% finished. In the Eagle Rock area, only 5% of the system has been redone.

Perron and Larry Windsor, regional government affairs manager for Adelphia, said the construction was being delayed by the DWP, which had been slow to provide power, and the Department of Public Works, which had dragged its feet on trenching permits.
Adelphia has about 500 miles of network to install and is building only 25 to 30 miles a week because of the administrative delays, Perron said.

"We have literally approximately 500 power supplies [for the new system] already hung on the poles," Perron said. "Some of them have been there for a year and a half. We're just waiting for them to get turned on."
DWP officials had no immediate response to Adelphia's complaints.

Windsor said the explanation from the DWP and Public Works had been the same: Hiring freezes had backed up the flow of work. The firm has been asking city officials, including City Council members Jack Weiss and Cindy Miscikowski, to help Adelphia press city agencies to pick up the pace.

Lisa Hansen, a spokeswoman for Weiss, said his aides had passed along Adelphia's concerns to the DWP. Miscikowski's office had no immediate comment.

Perron said Adelphia planned to start offering cable modem services in neighborhoods where its cables had been upgraded, even though the rebuild was far from complete. The company plans to launch services in West Los Angeles and Sherman Oaks within 60 days, and in Eagle Rock within 90 days, he said.

Compare that article to this one:

»www6.ladwp.com/whatnew/dwpnews/042502.htm

Hmmmm..... And just a month later, the DWP was all smiles.... Sigh....

Interesting how this occurred under the guise of a Moratorium.... selective Moratorium that is.
[text was edited by author 2002-06-07 20:03:07]