 KrKHeavy Artillery For The Little GuyPremium
join:2000-01-17
Tulsa, OK
 ·AT&T DSL Service
| Look at the list of States being pushed to do this Oklahoma (Caved)
Kansas
Missouri
Texas.
Now, lemme see, anyone want to mention which one of the Bully Bells holds sway over these states?
Ding! Yes, it's SBC! Big surprise.
Money talks, and consumer's needs walk. SBC's money, in this case.
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"When the day comes that anyone can bend our country’s laws and lawmakers to serve selfish, competitive ends, that day democratic government dies" -- Preston Tucker, 1948 (Yep, it's dead.) |
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army5
join:2002-04-30
Oklahoma City, OK | Rather than continue to speculate on the what if's of regulation and de-regulation, let's see what SBC has done for Oklahoma since they've received relief. I believe they are dumping 30 million dollars in infrastructure. This will provide DSL in more Oklahoma towns, install more RTs, and extend DSL penetration.
Based on this fact, can you tell me what you find wrong with this?
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Setting a goal is good. Achieving it is awesome.-Author Unknown |
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| Some xperts claim it costs $3,000.00 per subscriber to deploy FTTx. Other xperts claim it costs about the same to deploy xDSL.
Should those numbers hold true, then SBC plans on serving 10,000 broadband customers. Should those numbers be halved, then SBC plans on serving 20,000 customers. Should those numbers be inflated by a factor of 10 ($300 per), then SBC plans on serving 100,000 Okies.
Either way, it looks like SBC plans on deploying diddly-squat.
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"These are complex issues. If you are not mentally up for it, there is a simple proxy that will work just as well as a firm grasp of the technical and business issues: "Figure out what the Baby Bells want (they will tell you) and then try to stop them." |
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KrKHeavy Artillery For The Little GuyPremium
join:2000-01-17
Tulsa, OK Reviews:
·AT&T DSL Service
| reply to army5
Yes, SBC is shelling out $30 million to build infrastructure they should of been building all along, as it will pay for itself.... And now they have a Government granted monopoly. Who suffers? Why the consumers of course.... You know, most businesses have to make an investment first in something in order to gain profit, and there is an element of risk involved.
Not so for ILEC's, apparently. They can demand assured returns *first*, then can build infrastructure which increases their own company value, and they don't have to risk *anything.*
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"When the day comes that anyone can bend our country’s laws and lawmakers to serve selfish, competitive ends, that day democratic government dies" -- Preston Tucker, 1948 (Yep, it's dead.) |
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| said by KrK:
Yes, SBC is shelling out $30 million to build infrastructure they should of been building all along, as it will pay for itself.... And now they have a Government granted monopoly. Who suffers? Why the consumers of course.... You know, most businesses have to make an investment first in something in order to gain profit, and there is an element of risk involved.
Not so for ILEC's, apparently. They can demand assured returns *first*, then can build infrastructure which increases their own company value, and they don't have to risk *anything.*
Why aren't you or anyone else out there deploying? There is no law preventing this. There is even law that requires you to gain wholesale access to right-of-ways, poles, easements, conduits, etc...
Where is YOUR fiber? Where is your DSLAM?
Also, what if (hypothetically) no one in OK or MO owns a computer? How exactly does SBC recoup the cost and get a guaranteed profit?
Boogie |
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KrKHeavy Artillery For The Little GuyPremium
join:2000-01-17
Tulsa, OK Reviews:
·AT&T DSL Service
| said by boogie74:
Why aren't you or anyone else out there deploying?
Because I'm not the ILEC getting a sweetheart deal? |
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| reply to KrK
"You know, most businesses have to make an investment first in something in order to gain profit, and there is an element of risk involved."
WOW!! Really? What exactly is your friendly neighborhood CLEC investing in?? Hmmmm..........Just a thought, but then again, my views differ from most here, so I MUST work for one of the RBOC's......... |
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| reply to KrK
said by KrK:
said by boogie74:
Why aren't you or anyone else out there deploying?
Because I'm not the ILEC getting a sweetheart deal?
What exactly is the sweetheart deal that the ILEC is getting?
Boogie |
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army5
join:2002-04-30
Oklahoma City, OK | reply to Tom Zachman
Tom, since you live in Kansas you may not be aware of what has happened here in OK. SBC has already deployed DSL to 5 new towns after the legislative decision. They should complete the rest of their role out by the end of this year. Could you please tell me how you see this as being diddly-squat?
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Setting a goal is good. Achieving it is awesome.-Author Unknown |
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army5
join:2002-04-30
Oklahoma City, OK | reply to KrK
I'm not going to argue all of the would of's, should of's, and could of's. I am simply posting facts.
said by KrK:
Who suffers? Why the consumer of course....
Could you please show me how the consumers are suffering from SBC's decision to invest $30 million?
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Setting a goal is good. Achieving it is awesome.-Author Unknown |
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KrKHeavy Artillery For The Little GuyPremium
join:2000-01-17
Tulsa, OK Reviews:
·AT&T DSL Service
| reply to boogie74
said by boogie74:
What exactly is the sweetheart deal that the ILEC is getting?
Complete exemption from local or state regulatory oversight. This means that if the people in the service area have a problem with service provided, well, tough. NO recourse, no alternative, no solution.
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"When the day comes that anyone can bend our country’s laws and lawmakers to serve selfish, competitive ends, that day democratic government dies" -- Preston Tucker, 1948 (Yep, it's dead.) |
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KrKHeavy Artillery For The Little GuyPremium
join:2000-01-17
Tulsa, OK Reviews:
·AT&T DSL Service
| reply to army5
said by army5:
Could you please show me how the consumers are suffering from SBC's decision to invest $30 million?
I'll have to wait until they're done building it to show you the abuses that will follow.
I wish you guys got to live in the World you want to force on the rest of us. I'd love to see you in the grips of unregulated industry and see how happy you'd be then.
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"When the day comes that anyone can bend our country’s laws and lawmakers to serve selfish, competitive ends, that day democratic government dies" -- Preston Tucker, 1948 (Yep, it's dead.) |
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KrKHeavy Artillery For The Little GuyPremium
join:2000-01-17
Tulsa, OK Reviews:
·AT&T DSL Service
| reply to army5
What he really means is awhile back SBC halted their expansion plans and started using extortion and bribery to get what they wanted--- and it worked, and then they *resumed* their rollout. Too bad the people of Oklahoma had to give up their protections under the law. We'll just have trust SBC to do what's right from now on, because we sure as hell can't compel them to do what's right.
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"When the day comes that anyone can bend our country’s laws and lawmakers to serve selfish, competitive ends, that day democratic government dies" -- Preston Tucker, 1948 (Yep, it's dead.) |
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| reply to KrK
said by KrK:
said by boogie74:
What exactly is the sweetheart deal that the ILEC is getting?
Complete exemption from local or state regulatory oversight. This means that if the people in the service area have a problem with service provided, well, tough. NO recourse, no alternative, no solution.
Now just to understand this, you are saying that you wouldn't want to deploy your own DSL network because you wouldn't get the same "sweet deal" that SBC is getting...
The "sweet deal" being no regulatory oversight for DSL service, you are saying that SBC would have no regulatory oversight but you would?
Also, if you deployed your own DSL service to compete with SBC, then the customer would have no choice anyways since SBC would still be the only choice for DSL due to the lack of regulatory oversight?
Your argument is lacking substance here. Please back this up with something substantive...
Boogie |
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KrKHeavy Artillery For The Little GuyPremium
join:2000-01-17
Tulsa, OK | You can lead a horse to water but you can't make 'em drink... |
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| said by KrK:
You can lead a horse to water but you can't make 'em drink...
So you're saying now, that you COULD deploy your own DSL but you choose not too (despite the OBVIOUS offer to do so). And then you complain that SBC has an all out, uncontrollable monopoly on DSL due to the fact that you refuse to go into business offering it yourself??
I am completely confused... exactly how would you prefer that SBC force "the horse to drink" to use your words? How should SBC force other companies to invest in offering DSL to compete with SBC?
And if they can't force the horse to drink (once again, using your words), they should be regulated buy water for every horse that wants it?
Very confusing stance you have... you're pissed off at a company for offering a product that no one else WANTS to offer- BECAUSE, no one else wants to offer it to you. And because no one else wants to offer it, the company you are pissed off at should have a leash on them??
Boogie |
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 bistro777Donuts-Is There Anything They Can't Do?Premium
join:2002-02-07
Englewood, CO | reply to KrK
A link from a blurb today about your caring friends at SBC - - -
SBC Managers To Canvas Neighborhoods To Listen To Customers And Share Service Info - Local Employees Hit the Streets in Wisconsin to Demonstrate Dedication to Consumers (Subtitle: Whoever thought this one up gets massive brownie points with the brass.)
»biz.yahoo.com/bw/030207/72156_1.html
You can fool some of the people all of the time, and those are the people you need to concentrate on. |
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| reply to KrK
said by KrK:
You know, most businesses have to make an investment first in something in order to gain profit, and there is an element of risk involved.
I am still awaiting your brilliante answer as to what exactly your friendly neighborhood CLECs have invested in?? You just said "Most businesses have to make an investment first......TO GAIN A PROFIT"
Wow, them there CLECs are laying infrastructure right and left to make them there profits they are making, but I forgot that is OK, because that is called competition. |
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KrKHeavy Artillery For The Little GuyPremium
join:2000-01-17
Tulsa, OK Reviews:
·AT&T DSL Service
| reply to boogie74
said by boogie74:
I am completely confused...
To this, I would have to say you and I are in complete agreement. |
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KrKHeavy Artillery For The Little GuyPremium
join:2000-01-17
Tulsa, OK Reviews:
·AT&T DSL Service
| reply to Not From The Phone C
said by Not From The Phone C:
so I MUST work for one of the RBOC's.........
Or at least just blatantly shill for them. Same difference.
Given the RBOC's lobbying and political wheeling and dealing, any CLEC would be dumb to build anything else right now. They'll end up not being allowed to use it... better to wait for a more pro-consumer leadership change at the FCC to get the ball rolling in the right direction.
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"When the day comes that anyone can bend our country’s laws and lawmakers to serve selfish, competitive ends, that day democratic government dies" -- Preston Tucker, 1948 (Yep, it's dead.) |
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