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unmigrated NPNT customers out of luck

said by savemydsl@telocity.net:

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We have written to you several times over the last few months about an opportunity you had to switch to Telocity from your previous Internet Service Provider. Your transfer was never completed and we wanted to update you on how your switch has been affected by the NorthPoint Communications bankruptcy ruling last week.

As you may know, NorthPoint Communications installed the DSL line in your home. NorthPoint Communications recently filed for bankruptcy and placed its assets for auction. These proceedings have concluded and the winning bidder AT&T -- purchased NorthPoint's national network and has decided to suspend NorthPoint's network operations immediately. They did not purchase the portion of NorthPoint's business pertaining to subscribers.

This unexpected event will mean that your NorthPoint DSL line is no longer operational.

Telocity would very much like to provide your high-speed Internet service. However, because of the outcome of the NorthPoint bankruptcy, Telocity must ask you to place a new order through the normal process by going to:

www.telocity.com

. Telocity will identify one of the other last-mile carriers we work with regularly to provision a new line to your home.
Once you place your order, you can check the status online. We'll keep you informed every step of the way and provide you the best in high speed Internet service.

Please go to www.telocity.com and place your order today.
We look forward to serving you for years to come.

Sincerely,

DSL Assistance Team

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Exactly the same thing happened to me. I called them recently and they said I was supposed to call in when I got the letter. Nowhere in the letter does it say this. According to the letter the switch process was supposed to be handled entirely by them

Either way, screw Telocity. I ordered an ISP switch when Northpoint was still alive to DSLi, but it was never completed. Now that Northpoint's dead they told me they'll switch me to Rhythms. Now THAT'S what I call customers service.
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Resistance, is futile.

reply to Frostbite
I never received one e-mail for the morons that run Telocity. The only communication I ever rec'd was that letter dated December 23, 2000, with the MegaPath and Telocity logos on the letterhead. I called in early January and was told that "the transition should take place over the next two weeks." I called again in February, and was told "you don't show up in our database yet." I laid low since I was happy to still be on PhoenixDSL's network, which is actually MegaPath.

When the news broke last week, obviously, I needed to make a move. But I, like many of you, did not know who my ISP actually was, MegaPath or Telocity. I first called Telocity, who, then had me in their database, but with no "scheduled date for transition." I then called MegaPath in an effort to migrate to Covad via an ISP switch. MegaPath refused to acknowledge me as on their network notwithstanding the fact that they were billing my credit card. So, I called Telocity back in an effort to migrate to Rhythms in the hope of a hot-switch, or at least avoidance of having to purchase new IDSL router equipment. I was told to call "sales" to see if a Rhythms connection was available. "Sales" told me that Telocity was not taking any IDSL customers. After an e-mail to the Phoenix "transition team" expressing my dissatisfaction, I was referred back to Telocity where the rep tried to weasel her way out of what the sales rep told that Telocity was not taking on any IDSL customers. Her explanation was sorta, well we were taking IDSL customers, but now since NP is no longer a viable carrier, we will not be taking your account.

What's to be gleaned here? Well, first, I seriously doubt whether Telocity ever intended to migrate IDSL customers in certain locations, which is why many of us were never transitioned when many other Phoenix customers were. We weren't because they couldn't. They couldn't because their plan was to connect to existing Phoenix-leased IDSL DSLAM equipment in the Northpoint cages, and this req'd an additional investment to Telocity's network that it was loathe to make in light of the risk associated with NP's FR network beginning in January when it filed Ch. 11. Furnishing ADSL subs with their monstruous gateway allowed those subs to immediate connect to Telocity's IP network, but IDSL subs req'd that Telocity make further investment that for the most part they appeared reluctant to do. Of course, you'll never get them to admit this to be the case, but I find their slowness more a reluctance to migrate IDSL customers to their network, particularly in light of the NP bankruptcy proceeding.

Obviously, the news last week put the nail in the coffin with respect to IDSL customers. But did any of us here anything from Telocity? I dunno. But I heard squat. They made absolutely no effort to contact me. And when I contacted them, they replied, as someone else stated, that I should have contacted them earlier about these issues. But I did. So any excuse they give you for lack of communication is just plain BS.

The more important matter that I find irritating is the complete lack of responsibility that MegaPath relinquishes with respect to Phoenix residential customers. The MegaPath rep I talked to failed to recognize the legal obligation MegaPath has with respect to ALL the accounts it ACQUIRED THROUGH PURCHASE from Phoenix. These accounts not only included business accounts, but residential accounts as well. Along with the RIGHTs to these accounts (the assets) comes inseparable RESPONSIBILITIES (liabilities) to maintain a connection irrespective of the NP situation. In short, the OBLIGATION MegaPath assumes with respect to its business customers is no way diminished with respect to the residential accounts it acquired in the SAME transaction UNTIL those residential accounts are PICKED UP by Telocity. Note that Telocity NEVER PAID MegaPath for the right to transition Phoenix residential accounts, as each Phoenix sub was not obligated to move to Telocity. As such, the responsiblity too maintain remaining Phoenix residential acounts remains with MegaPath.

In short, those stranded Phoenix customers who were never picked up by Telocity have rights that are owed them by MegaPath, particularly when MegaPath affords those rights to their business accounts by transitioning to Covad lines. By refusing to assume the same level of responsibility to stranded Phoenix residential customers, IMHO, MegaPath should and can be held liable for damages as measured by subscriber costs in transitioning to a new ISP and carrier, and any increase in monthly subscription over the term of their existing contract with Phoenix.

JMO.

reply to Frostbite
I am also an ex NP customer on idsl through phoenixdsl/megapath/telocity.

Isn't Speakeasy about 2x the cost of phoenixdsl/telocity for idsl about $89/mo + install charges? And just for idsl!

I was about to do the same thing as you and am still trying to find something cheaper. It may be my only choice...

mms.

reply to lml2000
But my contract says that Phoenix may terminate the contract at any time, does yours?

said by NtwkGUY:

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But my contract says that Phoenix may terminate the contract at any time, does yours?

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reply to Anon

said by mms:

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I am also an ex NP customer on idsl through phoenixdsl/megapath/telocity.

Isn't Speakeasy about 2x the cost of phoenixdsl/telocity for idsl about $89/mo + install charges? And just for idsl!

I was about to do the same thing as you and am still trying to find something cheaper. It may be my only choice...

mms.

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reply to lml2000
....
[text was edited by author 2001-04-04 23:57:47]

reply to Frostbite
ImI2000:

It looks like for the average guy, court just isnt an option. It would take a huge class action I think for the average guy in this situation to come out with any payment for damanges or any chance to get some services. By the time such services could be represented as required by a judgement, most ppl would be well....on to something else. It is clear to me that while Megapath certainly has an obligation to serve us and have so crudely failed to do, that we, the average guy, have no practical recourse. I'm sure Megapath knows full well that they will for the most part get away scott free with this irresponsible behaviour. I am in total agreement with what you say, but it is unfortunate that unless you all have a lot of money to sue the pants off Megapath and the now non-existant Phoenixdsl and the non-existant Nortpoint, that these crimes will indeed go unpunished. It is also clear to me that a vast number of people have gone unbilled on a timely basis, to use the contract's wording. We are expected to pay on a timely basis, yet they have failed to bill us on a timely basis. I hardly see how they can stay in business with such incompetence. As there was a DslReports poll including one answer "I am not even getting billed" I conclude that it was an industry wide problem. Shouldnt any company be able to succede in monthly billings of their customers whether its a grain bill a gas bill a chicken bill or a dsl bill? I hardly think the product changes the ability to bill. The dsl business model must have been totally borked from the get go.

Hi mcarp. Just caught your post to me as it was not directly responding to my post, but Frostbite's.

Yes, you are correct, a lawsuit would not be in the cards, and I have never proposed that here. What I would propose is for any disenfranchise sub to dispute any and all new charges by MegaPath or Telocity for service not billed as legally each one of us has a right offset to compensate against damages suffered in getting a new line.

In my own situation, I tried to reach an agreement with MegaPath billing, and they simply respond "Nope, we don't see you on our network." So I said "good, then don't bill me for any unlevied charges."

Now, here on DSLR, in another folder, I get comments from unregistered folk telling me that Telocity "has possession of my account" and that it is now claiming ownership as if I owe them something. I don't because they, Telocity, never furnished me with any service. I have proof that I connected to phoenixdsl.net to the day my line went dead, yet they seem to claim that such connection was their, which is ludicrous. They also refused me IDSL service, so legally they are estopped from asserting any rights against my account in this respect.

You can see how our friend NtwkGUY posted something in response to my post him, but then changed his mind. Likely, given his location in St. Louis he is with Phoenix, and likely he is related to the unregistered person who I just had to blow up at in another folder on DSLR in response to the tone and the ignorance displayed to me.

Most likely what happened is that Telocity dropped the ball with our accounts. And because they got caught with their pants down by the Northpoint failure, they lost not only a lot of customers who have now gone elsewhere, but also a lot of unbilled accounts MegaPath essential said to Telocity "here, they're yours, we don't want them" and proceeded to remove from their books, but not their network, leaving Telocity to pick them off the network; they never did.

It is Telocity's screw-up which is why they are without our accounts, and I will challenge their any effort to bill my account. They can't; they have no right; they never provided service. Don't forget, they needed consent of earlier transitioned subscribers to bill their CCC before transitioning them to their network. The rules don't change because of Northpoint. No consent; no right to bill.

The problem for Telocity now is that there is never gonna be any transition, whatsoever, so they will never be able to bill my account; they will never see a dime. It now appears they're gonna try and lure me back to their network, which is an utter joke. What do they expect, that I'm going to go with them with dial-up?

Something's up at Telocity. Believe me. But their too stupid to realize that because they are incompetent and failed to transition many IDSL customers before the rug was pulled by T's purchase of Northpoint, that somehow they can come to us and remedy their mistakes. It don't work like that.

They have a bunch a poorly educated, administrative bimbos who believe they can reach lost subscribers accounts. But they can't; they have no legal right. Maybe if I were ever on their network, but I never was. Moreover, they never paid for the RIGHT to our account, and we never consent to it to be placed on their network.

So, in sum, we ex-Phoenix residential IDSL subs weren't the only ones holding the bag. Telocity also got screwed, but they did it to themselves because of their incompetence. What's amazing, however, is how they think they attempt to cure their wounds by taking a strip out of our hides. I, for one, refuse to let them.

reply to mcarp
Hi mcarp. Just caught your post to me as it was not directly responding to my post, but Frostbite's.

Yes, you are correct, a lawsuit would not be in the cards, and I have never proposed that here. What I would propose is for any disenfranchise sub to dispute any and all new charges by MegaPath or Telocity for service not billed as legally each one of us has a right offset to compensate against damages suffered in getting a new line.

In my own situation, I tried to reach an agreement with MegaPath billing, and they simply respond "Nope, we don't see you on our network." So I said "good, then don't bill me for any unlevied charges."

Now, here on DSLR, in another folder, I get comments from unregistered folk telling me that Telocity "has possession of my account" and that it is now claiming ownership as if I owe them something. I don't because they, Telocity, never furnished me with any service. I have proof that I connected to phoenixdsl.net to the day my line went dead, yet they seem to claim that such connection was their, which is ludicrous. They also refused me IDSL service, so legally they are estopped from asserting any rights against my account in this respect.

You can see how our friend NtwkGUY posted something in response to my post him, but then changed his mind. Likely, given his location in St. Louis he is with Phoenix, and likely he is related to the unregistered person who I just had to blow up at in another folder on DSLR in response to the tone and the ignorance displayed to me.

Most likely what happened is that Telocity dropped the ball with our accounts. And because they got caught with their pants down by the Northpoint failure, they lost not only a lot of customers who have now gone elsewhere, but also a lot of unbilled accounts MegaPath essential said to Telocity "here, they're yours, we don't want them" and proceeded to remove from their books, but not their network, leaving Telocity to pick them off the network; they never did.

It is Telocity's screw-up which is why they are without our accounts, and I will challenge their any effort to bill my account. They can't; they have no right; they never provided service. Don't forget, they needed consent of earlier transitioned subscribers to bill their CCC before transitioning them to their network. The rules don't change because of Northpoint. No consent; no right to bill.

The problem for Telocity now is that there is never gonna be any transition, whatsoever, so they will never be able to bill my account; they will never see a dime. It now appears they're gonna try and lure me back to their network, which is an utter joke. What do they expect, that I'm going to go with them with dial-up?

Something's up at Telocity. Believe me. But their too stupid to realize that because they are incompetent and failed to transition many IDSL customers before the rug was pulled by T's purchase of Northpoint, that somehow they can come to us and remedy their mistakes. It don't work like that.

They have a bunch a poorly educated, administrative bimbos who believe they can reach lost subscribers accounts. But they can't; they have no legal right. Maybe if I were ever on their network, but I never was. Moreover, they never paid for the RIGHT to our account, and we never consent to it to be placed on their network.

So, in sum, we ex-Phoenix residential IDSL subs weren't the only ones holding the bag. Telocity also got screwed, but they did it to themselves because of their incompetence. What's amazing, however, is how they think they attempt to cure their wounds by taking a strip out of our hides.