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New letter from NP

I wonder how they (NP) figure that they spent sometimes over $1000 per line. Anyone understand what it takes to condition a line? Well I should say that I do and I know for a fact in the states that I did this, it NEVER cost that much to condition a line. BUT, you have to admire NP's ability to try to make themselves look good no matter how bad they already do. I just dont understand the pt of it anymore.
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Matthew
Ex-Northpoint, Qwest, Covad OSP Network Technician

reply to Captain Apathy
Do you know where that letter is posted?
As for the $1000 per line - that is accurate. Our local telco, Ameritech, charges over $400 per install. If the line needs loading coils removed or other conditioning, there are other charges involved.

Bob

said by BoboMI:

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Do you know where that letter is posted?

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reply to Anon
Sorry Bob, that price is terribly inflated. Removing load coils is not the usual when conditioning a line. Bridge tap removal wasnt even the normal. No when the line is conditioned rarely if ever is any work done on it. Other than making the actual connections and putting a tag at the dmarc. That is the "normal procedure" for conditioning lines. And this was my original pt that someone somewhere in the government has to do a better job of oversite if anyone is going to get the ILECs off there high horse.
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Matthew
Ex-Northpoint, Qwest, Covad OSP Network Technician

GJ,

It may be inflated , but that's not what was being discussed. What was under discussion is whether or not the CLEC's / Providers pay the telcos a lot of money per install. They do. The average cost to a CLEC to set up one dsl line is $930.00. So I would tend to believe Northpoint's claim as to how much they spent getting dsl to it's customers.

Bob

Bob,

My response was not to the fact that the cost shouldnt be that much. The statement was in effect situplating that here in Qwest terr. the normal conditioning of the line is $325. I dont know what Ameritech is charging so much for or why NP states thats the average cost unless, they are taking the entire average for the installations to get more money. But in my opinion it is going to kill the other CLEC in having to pay for these over inflated costs for cross over service. This shows that we deffently need some regulation here by the feds.
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Matthew
Ex-Northpoint, Qwest, Covad OSP Network Technician

reply to Anon
Unfortunately, whatever the cost for provisioning a line, the dollar amounts indicate that they needed to get in to the BLACK fast. Which they didn't. What other costs were known when they decided to sell it so cheaply? Sounds like from the start they were on the way to bankruptcy. A word to the wise who are consdiering business start-ups: capitalization/cash is King!
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With apologies to Friedrich Nietzche, "Whatever does not kill me is still a pain in the ass!"

reply to Anon
Unfortunately, whatever the cost for provisioning a line, the dollar amounts indicate that they needed to get in to the BLACK fast. Which they didn't. What other costs were known when they decided to sell it so cheaply? Sounds like from the start they were on the way to bankruptcy. A word to the wise who are considering business start-ups: capitalization/cash is King!
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With apologies to Friedrich Nietzche, "Whatever does not kill me is still a pain in the ass!"

You are so right. In order to stay in business, any business would have to charge enough to make a profit which Northpoint didn't. I don't know how much of the $39.95 monthly fee Northpoint got from MSN, for example, but it probably wasn't all that much. After NP paid the local telco their charge each month I'm sure not much was left. Then I suspect the cost of the installs was staggering and when capital dried up, that was the end.

On top of all this is the "something-for-nothing" mentality which so many of us online have these days....

reply to Captain Apathy
From Personal experience, Northpoint did sometimes spend over 1000 on a new line.

They did with mine. While I didn't have any Coils, and I was close enough to the office, the condition of the cable in my street was soo bad there wasn't a good pair anywhere.

Northpoint, instead of telling me that they couldn't install the line, had a new cable run from the corner to my house. We are on poles here, but still according to the person I spoke to at Verizon, the local phone company, the line probably cost them $3000.

I can only wonder how many other cables they had run.

Ok, Here we go again. This information is from a reliable source for I am speaking from experience. The telco's have the federal requirement to replace, renew and fix cable (aka copper loop) to make it useable for POTS lines. If in the event that there are no lines that can be conditioned then it is the responsibility of the telco to replace them. Of course conditioning a line (one that is useable for a regular POTS line but isnt able to transmit data and thus needs to be conditioned better) is not there requirement and may need to be paid for to be made as such. But as stated before replacement or adding additional cabling so that its capable of being used IS NOT paid for by the CLECS. This provision was made possible by Addendum to the Deregulation Bill revision of 1993.
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Matthew
Ex-Northpoint, Qwest, Covad OSP Network Technician

As an ex-NPC employee I know you are in the right on this.... clue the clueless in!

reply to GarageJoe
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Ok, Here we go again. This information is from a reliable source for I am speaking from experience. The telco's have the federal requirement to replace, renew and fix cable (aka copper loop) to make it useable for POTS lines. If in the event that there are no lines that can be conditioned then it is the responsibility of the telco to replace them. Of course conditioning a line (one that is useable for a regular POTS line but isnt able to transmit data and thus needs to be conditioned better) is not there requirement and may need to be paid for to be made as such. But as stated before replacement or adding additional cabling so that its capable of being used IS NOT paid for by the CLECS. This provision was made possible by Addendum to the Deregulation Bill revision of 1993.
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That is dead bang wrong. You made it up. What the heck is the "Addendum to the Deregulation Bill of 1993?" Do you mean, the Telecommunications Act of 1996, Amending the Communications Act of 1934? Seriously, you are making this stuff up.

That is dead bang wrong. You made it up. What the heck is the "Addendum to the Deregulation Bill of 1993?" Do you mean, the Telecommunications Act of 1996, Amending the Communications Act of 1934? Seriously, you are making this stuff up.

LOL, Apparently I am one that is well versed in the FCC Deregulation Action of 1983 that deregulated the Bell companies into smaller entities. This Deregulation Act was revised in 1993 and then again in 1996. The portion that directly deals this thread subject is stated in the 1993 revision Appendix B. Any other questions you have to the validity of this information perhaps you should check with a lawyer that is well versed in the law, or check on the FCC homepage for further clarification on the matter. I have found the web page that the Telecommunications Act of 1996 deals with and have provided the link here for you. It is under sec. 256. I have a hard copy of the revision of 1993 and would be happy to email thus to you if you would like. The link is »www.fcc.gov/Reports/tcom1996.txt
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Matthew
Ex-Northpoint, Qwest, Covad OSP Network Technician
[text was edited by author 2001-04-24 18:21:02]

Nope, laughable again. S 652 was the senate version of the telcom act. It went into conference committe with the house bill and emerged as the telcom act of 1996. At any rate: what's your point?

Just a suggestion perhaps you should try to back up your statements. I have been wrong before but the link shows directly the point being made. As well as showing the reason for this footnote is well stated in the thread. Reading, while difficult, can be enjoyable and informative IF you take the time. Unfortunately you have to read to gain the benefit.
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Matthew
Ex-Northpoint, Qwest, Covad OSP Network Technician