 HallPremium,MVM
join:2000-04-28
Dayton, OH
kudos:1 | reply to plat2on1
Re: Deal with it..... said by plat2on1:
uhm, by blocking port 25 they are telling users they cannot use external PAY email services and they MUST use ISP provided account. thats absolutely ridiculous.
Bullsh*t... With Earthlink/Mindspring, who blocks outbound port 25, you can use any e-mail address, account, reply-to, etc, etc you want to. All you HAVE to use is smtp.earthlink.net, smtp.mindspring.com, or smtpauth.earthlink.net to SEND messages. What is the harm in that ?? |
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 GNXPowerGot Boost?Premium
join:2003-12-18
Huntington Beach, CA | Which was my point exactly. Problems can arise though if your provider's SMTP server sucks or you want your own header information.
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Don't have it?!? Demand it!!! The Anime Network »www.theanimenetwork.com |
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HallPremium,MVM
join:2000-04-28
Dayton, OH
kudos:1 | Honestly, how many *regular* users need their own header info ?? How many *regular* users know what the hell "headers" are ?? That's those things gearheads put on their cars that make 'em really loud, right ?? 
I don't know how a SMTP server can "suck" other than it being down. Any decent sized ISP will have redundant machines running SMTP though. |
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 roamer1sticking it out at you
join:2001-03-24
Atlanta, GA | reply to GNXPower
said by GNXPower:
Which was my point exactly. Problems can arise though if your provider's SMTP server sucks or you want your own header information.
You can add all the X-headers you want even if you have to use your ISP's mail server. (Among other things, you can run a "local" mail server and smarthost everything out the ISP's mail server. BT, DT.)
-SC
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No-Bull SE US Wireless Info: »www.sewireless.info/
Atlanta Apt/Condo Cable & Broadband Info: »www.atlaptcable.info/ |
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plat2on1
join:2002-08-21
Hopewell Junction, NY | reply to Hall
said by Hall:
said by plat2on1:
uhm, by blocking port 25 they are telling users they cannot use external PAY email services and they MUST use ISP provided account. thats absolutely ridiculous.
Bullsh*t... With Earthlink/Mindspring, who blocks outbound port 25, you can use any e-mail address, account, reply-to, etc, etc you want to. All you HAVE to use is smtp.earthlink.net, smtp.mindspring.com, or smtpauth.earthlink.net to SEND messages. What is the harm in that ??
wheres the harm in that? the whole point of using an external pay service is so you dont have to rely on your isp. |
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| reply to Hall
SMTP servers can suck in lots of ways...dropped messages, messages that take a week or more to deliver(big issue when comcast was first on their own after @home died. It's better now...), not supporting SSL, etc etc.
Now back to the thing about 'regular' users. How many regular users are going to know to use smtp.comcast.net or whatever instead of the server they were told to use when they signed up for their third party e-mail account? And who are they gonna call? Comcast wouldn't be my first instinct...I would go bother the tech support of the third party e-mail. And probably not get very much help by doing so... |
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| reply to Hall
Hall, I used to post in the EL forum as an official Tech. There are always problems with EL servers, sometimes the routing can be messed up between two of them and it takes 10 hours for messages to go over an internal 100mbit connection from 1 server to another (sitting in the same room). There are lots of reasons why people want to be able to use an SMTP server from their own hosting provider.
#1. That way their email cant be logged by the ISP's email server.... (aside from the ISP sniffing their traffic, AKA Carnivore/DCS1000)
#2. Having mail server show up as "mail.mydomain.com" instead of *.earthlink.net
#3. Avoiding EarthLink's blacklist that happens all the time from auto mass-blacklisting spam lists.
I'm sure there are many more... I realize the hosting company can set up a mail server listening on a different port, but should every other company on the internet have to do something special because some isps are breaking standard port numbers?
This is how censorship starts. |
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 cowboySo Much For SubtletyPremium
join:2000-03-14
Morgan Hill, CA | reply to Hall
most users don't....
I, and many others, however regulary use either:
* My work email, or
* My home email, or
* Special project email
and I need to do this from:
* One of my many work boxen
* ditto from home
* from the laptop whilst on the road
Some ISPs(bellsouth) let you use any headers, which works ok - but it doesn't let me use their smarthosts unless I am actually on their subnets (no tls/auth) 
Some (I've heard) prohibit you from using anything other than their own domains (fine for general users, a killer for me).
Some (the hotel I'm staying at), intercept port 25 traffic to their own dummy smarthost to get around DUL type blocks.
Many of the recent anti-spam techniques kill my functionality completely!!! You think my employer is going add a DNS record so I can email from the hotel? Is Bellsouth?
If most ISPs just started requiring TLS and/or SMTP AUTH so
we could use them from anywhere - even outlook supports both these days, we could make a dent in the spam - and I might support force smarthost usage (without From: domain checks)
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Richard Nelson |
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cowboySo Much For SubtletyPremium
join:2000-03-14
Morgan Hill, CA | reply to Hall
said by Hall:
said by plat2on1:
uhm, by blocking port 25 they are telling users they cannot use external PAY email services and they MUST use ISP provided account. thats absolutely ridiculous.
Bullsh*t... With Earthlink/Mindspring, who blocks outbound port 25, you can use any e-mail address, account, reply-to, etc, etc you want to. All you HAVE to use is smtp.earthlink.net, smtp.mindspring.com, or smtpauth.earthlink.net to SEND messages. What is the harm in that ??
What part of external services did you not understand ? You're talking about using your ISPs smarthost services - which should be favoured when possible... but not all ISPs are clueful enough to rely on
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Richard Nelson |
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qcsdave
join:2002-06-29
Greenville, SC | reply to GNXPower
So basically people who run Spam Servers from their home computer and People who spread virus's by not securing their machine will be affected.. Hmmmm How Horrible!
note sarcasm |
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| reply to Hall
Blah blah you can just use your ISP's SMTP and change the reply-to address blah blah.
WHAT ABOUT FILE ATTACHMENTS? If you have an external mail server that you pay for it probably allows for a decent size file attachment, but your ISP probably has a miniscule limit or even disables attachments altogether. |
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HallPremium,MVM
join:2000-04-28
Dayton, OH
kudos:1 | Give me a break.... E-mail is NOT the best method for sending "large" files. |
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 RARPSL
join:1999-12-08
Suffern, NY | reply to Hall
said by Hall:
said by plat2on1:
uhm, by blocking port 25 they are telling users they cannot use external PAY email services and they MUST use ISP provided account. thats absolutely ridiculous.
Bullsh*t... With Earthlink/Mindspring, who blocks outbound port 25, you can use any e-mail address, account, reply-to, etc, etc you want to. All you HAVE to use is smtp.earthlink.net, smtp.mindspring.com, or smtpauth.earthlink.net to SEND messages. What is the harm in that ??
The harm is that Earthlink's smtp.earthlink.net servers that are reachable from Non-Earthlink Connectivity (as would be the case if you are on the road and at a hotel using DSL from your room) do not respond on Port587 (I do not know if the ones from the Earthlink LAN do either). Thus you must screw with your settings every time you change connectivity instead of having settings that are Connectivity Independent. If you must use Port 25 to get to Earthlink from the Internet, what happens when you use some other ISP for connectivity who ALSO blocks Port25? If you force all LAN traffic through your servers, you should have Port587 available as a Port25 Alternative for both LAN and WAN (Internet) connectivity sessions . |
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wentlancYou Can't Fix Dumb..
join:2003-07-30
Maineville, OH | reply to cowboy
With webmail and VPN, you should be able to use any mail from anyplace you need to. And if your company does not have VPN or webmail services, then shame on them.
puritan |
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cowboySo Much For SubtletyPremium
join:2000-03-14
Morgan Hill, CA | said by wentlanc:
With webmail and VPN, you should be able to use any mail from anyplace you need to. And if your company does not have VPN or webmail services, then shame on them.
Sorry, I don't keep my mail on the ISP's servers... quotas and all that - it needs to be either on *my* server, or my laptop.
Not to mention that my ISP's webmail is not a good example of web enabled design
My company does provide VPN capabilities - but as mentioned somewhere else in this thread; that is only 1/3 of my needs.
It does not however have webmail (yet), it uses Lotus Notes (with no imap either)
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Richard Nelson |
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mrs213
join:2002-05-25
Pittsburgh, PA | reply to Hall
Preach on, brotha/sista.
One of the key points is, my parents (your average technology "masses" user) don't even know what a port is, and don't care. Most people (even a lot of gearheads I know) don't bother with running a mail server or playing tricks with mail servers. They use Hotmail or change the REPLY-TO on their Outlook client to a forwarding address or whatnot.
Those playing with the mail servers and find themselves limited are in the VAST minority, and aren't even a blip on the broadband providers' collective radar. This is for the good of the entire network. I suggest you cope. |
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