Efficient → SpeedStream to existing routed LAN

I have my SpeedStream 5200 modem connected to a SMC router which handles DHCP for my 6 windows clients. Although the modem is configured with DHCP it doesn't appear to cause a conflict with the SMC box. I would have thought that the modem would just be a fancy DSL passthru, but when I tried disabling DHCP I lost the ability to interface to it thru 192.168.254.254 and when I restored that option I really don't have any bridge/router options displayed. It just provides a PPPoA connection as a default. Does anyone see a problem with setup? Second question, is related to debugging problems between the modem and the ISP? I'm seeing drops and delays (2 or 3 times a day) and I know that Frontier won't work with me when I have a OEM box in the mix..so I'm curious what type of data I'll need to provide to get them to agree that the problem is on their side of the link? I can usually log onto the modem and it still shows a connection but upon rebooting it the connection really works again.

You are running Double NAT/NAPT so that is inherently more difficult to work with. The 5200 you have (since it logs in with PPPoA) is already a Full Router and the only way you could turn off the NAPT translation (DHCP just hands out IP addresses) is to have multiple Public IPs as that is required on all LAN connected Devices and PCs with NAPT disabled. If you have only one Public IP from your ISP you will need to leave NAPT enabled.

Since the 5200 you have is a Router all you really need to run a LAN is a 10/100 multi-port Switch and not a second Router like you have.

You can use your second Router in one of two ways.

1) Use it as a simple Switch by plugging in the 5200's LAN connection to one of the LAN ports on the SMC Router. This would basically bypass the second Router, allow you see the 5200 Web Management Interface from any connected PC and remove the extra layer of NAT/NAPT. If you are going to run any servers this would be the way to go unless you return the SMC (or sell it) to purchase a multi-port switch instead. The 5200 can hand out up to 253 IP addresses and is a Fully Featured Router with Firewall all in itself.

2) Continue to run in Double NAT/NAPT mode by going through both Routers and have to manually connect a PC to just the 5200 to interact with it's Web Management Interface for any trouble-shooting diagnostics, reading of statistics and log entries. If you plan to run servers this becomes very complicated and sometimes it just does not work with some servers (especially game servers and FTP servers).

You may want to read these FAQ entries:

»Efficient Networks Forum FAQ »Where can I find the 5200 Router User Guide (v2.1)?

»Efficient Networks Forum FAQ »Is there newer Firmware for Frontier.net 5200s that allows Port Forwarding?

»Efficient Networks Forum FAQ »How can I free all the menu commands for the 5200 as seen in the User Guide?

Hope this helps.

Regards,

Doctor Olds

boink! Didn't occur to me to bypass the SMC router and just plug the modem into a LAN port, but if there is no way to make the Modem be dumb, then this is a better fall back plan. I have no plans for servers, just lots of clients via this DSL connection. With option 1, I already see in this approach that I can now use the DSL GUI appl to actually see the modem status...something that was previously hidden when it was behind the SMC Router. This should allow me to get a better handle on performance/reliabilty of the DSL service.

Thanks very much for the insight.:D

Glad to help.

Don't forget to request the updated version 2 of the Router Firmware from your ISP (they will email it to you). It has more menus open so that more options are available then you can free any that are still hidden after the update.

Regards,

Doctor Olds

Is there a way to address the printer I have attached to this SMC router,,,which I just turned into a dump hub? Presumably, the SMC router doesn't have an IP addr assigned to it anymore, and thus the printer configured to it is unreachable. I remember printing a test page to this when I made the recommended change, just didn't hang out to see that it actually printed (it didn't, of course).

I don't use a print server setup so I honestly do not know. I just share my printers between all of my PCs over the LAN instead. I can print from any PC to any Printer.

Regards,

Doctor Olds

I also have an SMC router and was toying with connecting it to a 5200 configured as a router (my 5200 came out of the box configured as a bridge) If you want the SMC device to do the PPPOE function, you can make the 5200 act like a bridge instead of a router by connecting directly to it and logging into the Speedstream Management Interface @ 192.168.2.1 (make sure your default gateway is set to 192.168.2.1)Go to Advanced and change to Bridge Mode (reset to factory defaults might also work) Reconnect your router and configure it for PPPOE and you should be good to go.
BTW when I did my 5200 router experiment, It left all ports open and there was no configuration to open, close or forward any ports. Must be the firmware that came with my unit.

Your setup information will not work as their ISP is PPPoA not PPPoE. SMC Aftermarket Routers do not know about PPPoA and they cannot connect to any PPPoA connection.

said by dialedout:

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I have my SpeedStream 5200 modem...

[snip]

It just provides a PPPoA connection as a default.

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Regards,

Doctor Olds

SMC7004ABR in use for its print server and 4 port switch, no wan connection.

The WAN port is not used.
One of its lan ports is connected to a lan port on another router.
It is the only device on the lan with a IP address of 192.168.2.1
The SMC print server software is installed on each computer.
The printer has a parallel port connector.

All lan devices are on the same subnet and have the same subnet mask.

said by wayjac:

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SMC7004ABR in use for its print server and 4 port switch, no wan connection.

The WAN port is not used.
One of its lan ports is connected to a lan port on another router.
It is the only device on the lan with a IP address of 192.168.2.1
The SMC print server software is installed on each computer.
The printer has a parallel port connector.

All lan devices are on the same subnet and have the same subnet mask.

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Did you use a crossover cable to connect the 5200 to the lan port of the SMC router? I changed my 5200's IP to 192.168.2.1 from the default 192.168.254.254, will this work or should I change it back?

said by Data_Dan:

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BTW when I did my 5200 router experiment, It left all ports open and there was no configuration to open, close or forward any ports. Must be the firmware that came with my unit.

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That's because the 5200 you have is *not* a Router and it is running crippled Firmware at the request of your ISP. The 5200 that the original poster has is a Full featured Router and their ISP offers a newer upgrade to Full Router Firmware with working port forwarding plus a NAPT based Firewall along with an IP Filtering Firewall to it's customers.

You should ask in your ISP's Support Forum (not here in the Efficient Forum in other words) why they do not offer to do the same for you?

Regards,

Doctor Olds

Oops! I forgot to mention I did the update to E240 A3 70 52 7080 a few days ago and the 5200 is now a fully functioning router,firewalled and my necessary ports are forwarded. Works well and I can see my dsl line condition stats. Telneting into it works well too!
I also have an SMC 7004ABR and want to continue using the print server. I setup the 5200 the same as my SMC on the lan side (192.168.2.1) cuz my NICS are currently configured with static IPs and for a default gateway of 192.168.2.1. I realize something has to change in order to use both routers or I'll get an IP conflict. The 5200 is currently connected to my PC only. It's doing the DHCP work. In order to have both routers connected do I make the WAN of the SMC static or dynamic to the 5200 and disable DHCP and the firewall on the SMC? My networking topology skills are quite lacking as you see but I'm a keen learner!

Since I am apparently back in business, let me restate my config for posterity purposes. The Speedstream 5200 (192.168.254.254) is in fact in "bridge-router" mode and it is distributing IP addrs to my 6 clients (in my case, this is 192.168.254.100-199). The Speedstream is connected to an Ethernet port on the SMC router using a standard cable. Nothing is plugged into the WAN port. The SMC router has DHCP disabled and in my case its default IP addr was 192.168.2.1 which put it outside the Speedstream IP addr range. Once I reconfigured the SMC router's gateway addr (LAN IP) to fall within the 192.168.254.xxx range I was again able to reach its mgt interface (make sure if doesn't conflict with the 100-199 IP range though). The status shows that the DSL connection is disconnected (ie. not using WAN). Once I updated the printer port to use 192.168.254.1 I was able to print again thru the SMC connection. You need to do this on all Clients.

said by dialedout:

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Since I am apparently back in business, let me restate my config for posterity purposes. The Speedstream 5200 (192.168.254.254) is in fact in "bridge-router" mode and it is distributing IP addrs to my 6 clients

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If the 5200 is distributing IP addresses that means it is a Router since I've never seen any Bridges advertised that have a working DHCP Server, A DNS Server, Port Fowarding tables, a Firewall, and IP Filtering Rule setup page like the 5200.

It *is* a Router, not a Bridge-Router.

Regards,

Doctor Olds

You may be technically correct. I'm only repeating what is shown in the DSL modem status (current mode: Bridge - Router).

Doc its right there in the image you posted....

Under the normal mode of operation, referred to as "bridge/routing" mode

The 2nd image is from the 5200 User Guide. The Router/Modem HTTP Interface (1st image) doesn't say "DSL modem status (current mode: Bridge - Router)" as you posted earlier.

Regards,

Doctor Olds