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Sugar Land, TX
reply to quibbly

Re: Even Balance (PUNKBUSTER) Problems

Again, great comments in regards to what I have started. I have noticed, that in the day, I'm bashed to no end. In the evenings, the comments are postive. Whould this be because children are on the computers in the daytime due to Spring Break and Adults in the evening?

Anyway, I've been informed that this thread has caught the attention of TechTV. If this is the case, it will only help to expand this cause. To date, there has been no attempt from Even Balance to contact me (Well, past few days). They have all my contact information, including my contacts at Harris County. With this thread, it would better Even Balance to come here and make a post. If they are not a shaddy company, why not?

As per my feelings about EB, I support them in what they are trying to do, but disagree on how they are doing it. My goal is not to destroy the company, harm them, decrease their revenue, etc..., but to educate them.

All they need to do is the following:

1) Send me the proof that I requested
2) Change their EULA to state:
a. Will only scan resident memory that is used by
the game.
b. Scan only the directory the game is installed.
c. Take pictures of only the game that is played.
d. No invasive information outside of the game
will be scanned, captured, looked at, etc...
e. Have updates allowed only when requested
(like with Microsoft. Can enable or disable
automatic updates)
f. Will store the above information in a secure
area at EB and will be given out on request
by the authorized party (ie: banned player)
g. No global ban. Only kicked and banned from
server where played on. If valid proof of
cheat is presented to player, then global ban
could be an option (but only after multiple
h. List who has authorization to access the above
i. Define in plain english, what is considered
cheating, hacking, etc.
3) If global ban is proved to be necessary, only after the player has received some kind of multiple warning's while playing the game.

I have played Raven Shield and Punkbuster use to have it setup in this format: Player with cheat join's the game server, is found to have a hack. A message pop's on the screen that the player is using a hack/cheat, then the player is kicked. In my personal belief, it should be up to the server admin to ban the player, not Even Balance. That is what a server Admin is about. I myself hosted a Raven Shield server. I would look at the list of people who were kicked form the server for cheating, then I would ban them. If I was on-line, I would ban immediately.

Now, this is another example of how Even Balance has made multiple mistakes in regards to cheaters. This is from an email I received:

I use to cheat in BF1942 when the game was full of cheaters. Since Punkbuster was activated, I stopped. It has been months since I cheated. The other day I started playing and I received a global ban. I didn't cheat. When I looked in my game directory, one of the old cheat executes was there (but not activated). I forgot that was in the directory. I emailed Even Balance multiple time and they would not respond. How is that fair? I didn't cheat, and I haven't since Punk Buster was installed? How can they ban me for having an old cheat file in my directory when I didn't use it?

I feel for the above player. This is where Even Balance has made multiple errors and has played both Judge and Jury.

This is my two cents,


Oklahoma City, OK
Ok... here we go...

First... Evenbalance doesn't play Judge and jury, they provide a service to the community, each and every server out there has the ability to turn on or turn off punkbuster... sv_punkbuster 0/1, with that as a known, there is also a setting to turn off global banning which I can't remember off the top of my head.

Now for your answers...

1. So now they're suppose to keep track of everyone they bust? Their program isn't VITAL to you playing online. It's only vital to play online with servers that decide to use the punkbuster service, hence the command sv_punkbuster 1 has to be set on the server.

a. I don't know if this is even possible, but here's an example how this won't work... Their are programs out there that read PIXLE color of certain pixels, now alot of games cross hairs change color when over an enemy. Now if this program is used it could auto shoot for you if you just happen to go over an enemy, hence a hack outside of the game being used in a game. IT WON'T WORK.
b. Scan only the directory. Hackers can make symoblic links to actual programs in other directories so a program thinks their in one directory when they really aren't. In lame man's terms... a shortcut to the real file, all they do is put the real file outside the punkbuster or game directory and if punkbuster uses it they would break your new EULA... IT WON'T WORK.
c. Take pictures in game... That's what they do. Punkbuster isn't even running if the game isn't running. Ths screenshots you are worried about are requested by the server you're playing on. It can be set on certain intervals or they can request a screenshot. This is done because people hack the video drivers to allow people to see thru walls... hence hacking. IT WON'T WORK.
d. I know of people who have hacks on their machine, as long as they aren't resident in memory, they haven't been banned.
e. The updates are the hacks definition files. This is updated every so often with new known hacks, without auto updating, you'd have so much trouble, this was disabled in SoF2 when it first launched almost nobody had the right version so no one could connect. Since punkbuster doesn't have a gui you had to command line update it...
f. It's their right to keep or not keep the data. It's up to the people contracting them to either request that or not request that, I'm sure that's a money issue EA or whoever doesn't really want to pay for.
g. NO GLOBAL BAN... ok, this is a good key point... because... THIS CAN BE DISABLED BY THE SERVER YOU CONNECT TO. It's up to that server weather or not to use this feature.
h. a live database of everyone who can see that db isn't viable. That's like saying you want a name of every person who has the ability to see your passwords for IMs or something like this messageboard. Even if they MD5 your password, they can copy your md5 password, put their own md5 password read your stuff then put your encrypted password back and you wouldn't know a thing.
i. There are so many damn hacks out there, this also isn't viable.

3. A global ban isn't required, it's up to the admin of the server weather they use this option or not. Bitch at that admin for not wanting to constantly ban people all day long.

On the guy who had a hack and was banned, more then likely someone generated his cdkey and got him banned.

Oklahoma City, OK

1 recommendation

reply to quibbly
If this ever makes it to tech tv and a professional is on the pro side, your argument is going to look very very stupid.

You: Punkbuster scans your hard drive
EB: YOU AGREED TO IT. We do it to ensure integrity of the definition files for our program. We do nothing more then make sure you're not cheating(ie.. opengl hacks, game hacks, packet sniffing programs...)

You: If I don't agree to it I can't use the new patch and can't play my online game.
EB: You don't have to have Punkbuster installed to play, and you can still play patched servers that choose not to use the Punkbuster service. It's up to the server's admin weather or not he wants to use our service.

You: Well, my cdkey was globally banned and can't connect to any Punkbuster servers.
EB: Well, you can connect to servers without Punkbuster enabled, or punkbuster servers enabled but global banning disabled. It's up to the server's admin, we only offer them the service, they decide weather they want to use it or not.

You're asking for people not to have a choice AND THAT IS ALL. IT IS NOT YOUR RIGHT TO PLAY ON AN ONLINE SERVER, IT IS A PRIVILEGE.

Basicly you as an individual have to decide for yourself what risks your willing to take and what risks your not willing to take. I'd rather use a system where someone is making money off of anti cheats, then go out and find a "FREE" one where they may cover the cost of their webserver/bandwidth by including spyware... but that's me.

Hey, if you get this EULA to be invalid, you can go after evil norton who scans your hard drive for virii, yeah right, they're stealing my info and when they do an auto update, they transmit my info to a master database. What is this world coming to?

Got Funk??
Lebanon, PA
Dude,you have absolutely no idea what you're talking about.Go back,read the entire thread,and then post your opinions.

Don't be a troll.