neilaubin
join:2004-12-04
UK
|  Netgear DG834G intermittent timeout/connectivity
Hello everyone,
I am seriously hoping that someone out there can help me as I am pulling my hair out.
I have a home network of four computers all linked (via cable - not wireless) to the netgear router. The netgear then connects to broadband via a BT ADSL service (UK). All has been fine with this setup for over 6 months.
Recently I have been noticing a steadily growing problem - when trying to connect to a web site then it will often not find the site, timing out saying "website could not be found, check the name and try again". This is very intermittent - one minute it will work fine, the next it will fail. Sometimes you try the same link a few times in a row and it will finally get it. It seems to happens like this on each of the PCs on my network.
I have done the following to try and resolve this so far:
- Reconnected my main PC to the BT terminal adapter that was supplied (i.e. gone around the router entirely) to check the BT connectivity and in this mode it works fine.
- Contacted BT to check the ADSL line and my config. All seemed ok.
- Checked my PC for virus and spyware. There was some spyware there which I have cleaned, but the problem still exists. Been clearing caches very often too.
- Run some tools like the TCPoptimizer to ensure MTU and suchlike are fine.
- Deleted and re-entered all the config of the router as per BT's requirements listed on their website.
- Upgraded the routers software to the latest version.
The annoying thing is that I know it must be the router due to my testing via the BT supplied terminal adapater. I can set up the network differently so that my PC is sharing the internet connection, but that kind of defeats having the router, and I do use the wireless functionality for my laptop.
Thanks for any help you can give,
Neil |
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neilaubin
join:2004-12-04
UK | Re: Netgear DG834G intermittent timeout/connectivi
Additional - once I do get a web site working, then it will work fine. Speed of download is not a problem either. It seems like a DNS thing but I am not a super techy in this area so just need some ideas.
Thanks for any help. |
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neilaubin
join:2004-12-04
UK
| Well, I have tried two more things - downgrading the software on the router to v01.04.01 which I saw in another thread, and also to perform a full hard reset (turned it on whilst paperclip in and left it for 30 seconds).
Both have had no effect - same problems.
I also tried some ping tests from the router and was getting variable results - sometimes it couldn't get a response from google.com and sometimes it was fine...
I am now going back over to using my simple USB terminal adapter for the internet access, and sharing the internet connection. Using the netgear as a hub only now... Really frustrating as now I have gone back to the usb device then it is now steady and solid.
I would really appreciate some help off anyone with some ideas on what to try.
Thanks |
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Big Hoot
join:2002-09-01
Port Neches, TX
| reply to neilaubin
Re: Netgear DG834G intermittent timeout/connectivity
I've noticed the same thing, if a web site won't connect within, say...10 seconds, I get a '404 page not found. Sometimes I just load my favorites in the left side panel and double or triple click the link and that seems to work. And all pages within the main link work OK once the main (link) page loads. If you find the cause, let me know.
Russ |
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neilaubin
join:2004-12-04
UK | Well, due to the lack of help here then I logged a call with Netgear and went through everything I had done. They are now going to replace the router and I will see how I get on with the new one.
Neil |
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Archibold
| Re: Netgear DG834G intermittent timeout/connectivi
I've seen the same symptoms. I've isolated them to the DNS-implementation in the router.
The DG834G acts as some kind of DNS-proxy. It gets the DNS-settings by DHCP from my ISP. But it does not forward these addresses to my clients using DHCP. Instead, it provides it's own address.
The solution for me has been to use static DNS-configuration on my clients.
If I'm correct, a new unit won't solve this issue. Netgear can fix it in the firmware though. One simple solution would be to make the DHCP/DNS-settings configurable. I'd rather have the router pass along the actual DNS-entries. |
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neilaubin
join:2004-12-04
UK | Thanks for this. Can I ask for a full explanation of what you have therefore configured on the router and what you have done on the client. I think I understand but I want to make sure.
Thanks again. |
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WillBristow
@tiscali.co
|  reply to neilaubin
Re: Netgear DG834G intermittent timeout/connectivity
I have had exactly the same issues with the DG834GT but was lucky to find the solution by accident.
I found that when the internet connection dropped I could not log into the router to check the ADSL status. After a little while the connection was restored but checking the error logs and operating time logs there were no resets or time-outs. The next time the internet connection dropped I intended to cycle the power by pulling the power lead to the router but as I moved my hand close to the antenna the internet connection came back to life, moving my hand away from the antenna, the internet connection dropped again. I was not using the wireless connection at the time, my main pc is connected using a wired 10/100 patch cable.
Although not a radio expert I guessed that I had a standing wave problem, the router was locking up when the standing wave appeared as an "echo" to the router. The router was putting all it's efforts into trying to identify the standing wave echo and ignoring the hard-wired cable network.
My solution was simply to turn the router from sitting flat on a shelf to mounted vertically (cooling is better this way too) and sorting out the power cable and 10/100 patch cable so that there were no coils or loops near to the antenna. Since I did this a few weeks a ago I have had no problems, I tried yesterday putting the router back in it's original location and flat and guess what, the original fault returned several times in the course of a few hours on the internet.
Hope this may help. (UK user with Tiscali Broadband) |
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Archibold
| reply to neilaubin
Re: Netgear DG834G intermittent timeout/connectivi
neilaubin,
Sure. First, check the DNS-settings on the router. Just go to the "Router status" page in the administrative interface (»192.168.0.1/setup.cgi?next_file=start.htm).
Write down the addresses for "Domain Name Server" in the first section.
Use the addresses when configuring TCP/IP for your clients interfaces. I use Mac and it's quite straightforward. I think it's just as simple on Windows. Just choose the network-interface, modify the TCP/IP-settings and enter the DNS-addresses.
You can ealisy check that the DNS-implementation is flaky by using nslookup. Try switching back and forth between the router and the actual DNS. After a couple of simple queries you'll see that the router is somewhat random in it's responses.
I'll check out WillBristows tips as well. I've seen that my ADSL-line drops connection every now and then and never been able to figure out why. This is a separate issue from the DNS-thing though. |
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WillBristow
@tiscali.co
| reply to neilaubin
Re: Netgear DG834G intermittent timeout/connectivity
Hi Neilaubin & Archibold
Just a few extra thoughts to add to the mix,
First, some UK ISP's will only assign one IP address per ADSL connection so although it's worth trying, using a DNS server address manually entered in each client may only allow one client to connect to the ISP at a time. If you have three clients asking for an IP from the ISP's server it is possible only one of the clients will be assigned an address per dsl connection. This is the main reason why most UK broadband users have routers using NAT (either static or dynamic addressing).
Second, Neilaubin has stated that his set up originally worked ok, I'll assume this was for several months, and now he has started to have problems.
You have to ask what could have changed that started the problem.
If the problem has been becoming more frequent then it could be a hardware fault in the router in which case as NETGEAR is replacing the router he will soon find out if this is the case.
As he has a wireless port in the router that he uses only occasionally, this could be the source of a problem, either a standing wave or external interference. Try disabling wireless in the router setup and see if your problem goes away, if so, start looking for sources of RF interference or move the router to a different location / orientation.
The UK, BT telephone network is often very noisy due to the age of the cable network at street level, Can you sometimes hear crackling sounds when making a phone call? this type of interference can cause the ISP connection to drop sporadically, if you can hear noise on the line then ask BT to make a line test. Even though he can connect to his ISP using the ISP's supplied ADSL modem/gateway adaptor this adaptor may have a better tolerance of line noise than the NETGEAR router.
Lastly, a word of warning about upgrading / downgrading firmware. I use flash memory as part of my work (in medical electronics) and it has a very poor record for failing completely during wiping and flashing. Some manufacturers chips will only re-flash half a dozen times before dying. Only reload firmware if you are absolutely sure the upgrade will fix an issue you are having problems with, don't upgrade if you don't have a problem!!!
Best of Luck |
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bitsurfer
join:2003-08-18
Los Angeles, CA
| reply to neilaubin
Re: Netgear DG834G intermittent timeout/connectivi
I have been using the DG834 and DG834G since it was initially released, and have recently started experiencing the same type of random failures on DNS lookups.
Interestingly, the built-in DHCP server in Firmware 1.05 now assigns the actual DNS server addresses to clients instead of the router's internal address. (Maybe they knew that the DNS proxy was broken?)
Now that I have changed all of the statically assigned machines to use the external DNS servers, there are no problems.
I sure wish that Sveasoft or one of the other groups would port their code over to the DG834/G. It uses the same processor as the WRT54G, so it shouldn't be too difficult.
Netgear doesn't seem to care about providing regular updates for this device. |
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neilaubin
join:2004-12-04
UK | Thanks to everyone so far. I will wait for my router to be returned and will then test it fully and reply here.
Neil |
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Archibold
| reply to WillBristow
WillBristow,
can you explain how address assignment is relevant in this case? Are you possibly mistaking DNS for DHCP?
The address a client is assigned has nothing to do with the DNS-servers, even though information about the latter can be provided the client by the DHCP server as part of the process of address assignment.
At least that's how my computer gets its configuration and all my DNS-request are surely NAT-ed in the router as well as all other traffic. |
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WillBristow
@tiscali.co | reply to Archibold,
Sorry you are correct, I was confusing DNS and DHCP.
regards
Will******* |
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xiphrex
Premium
join:2001-09-13
united kingd
1 edit | reply to WillBristow
Re: Netgear DG834G intermittent timeout/connectivity
This is interesting because I am getting the exact same problem as WillBristow. Same router as well.
All was working fine until a few days ago when the router would seem to be unresposive or very slow. Pinging the router would bring back a ping of 4ms, usually it averages zero.
Just a few minutes ago I had to reboot the router manually to get it to respond.
I will try moving the antenna etc and seeing if that fixes it. Also, for my router the DG834GT there are no firmware updates at netgear. We'll see if moving the antenna can solve the problem. Thanks for that post.
EDIT: OK It just happened again, I was on msn messenger, right after I posted the above, internet dropped, and couldnt access router page. I put my hand on the router, and it suddenly let me access the router page and connected to net and all was good. Take my hand away, and it goes unresponsive again.
I tried putting the router up high on my bookcase flat, away from everything, still wouldnt work. I have now put it in a semi vertical position temporarily and its now working. Very very wierd problem, Netgear HAVE to sort this out. Hopefully with a firmware because if its a hardware fault and I have to send it back and wait for a replacement then I will be severly pissed off. I didnt pay around £100 for this 
--
But I, being poor, have only my dreams; I have spread my dreams under your feet; Tread softly because you tread on my dreams. |
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jimscrivener
join:2004-12-29
Hastings UK
| reply to neilaubin
I have a new DG834G wireless router that seems to have a very similar problem. I've been hoping that someone on this thread might have an answer. I have tried the solutions here without success.
Problem:
The router frequently fails to catch a web page - coming up with an error message / page not available.
This happens whether I am using wireless or via Ethernet cable.
The unavailable pages can almost always be loaded successfully by going "back" and re-pressing the link to the page. They invariably succeed second time.
It is an infuriating fault!
I have tried setting the DNS figure from the Router Status page (ADSL port section) into Windows Network Connections / Wireless Network Connections / Properties / Internet protocol TCP/ICP / Properties / Use the following DNS server adresses
(IS that what I was supposed to do???)
Any other solutions / things to try would be very welcome.
Thanks,
Jim |
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neilaubin
join:2004-12-04
UK
| reply to neilaubin
Re: Netgear DG834G intermittent timeout/connectivi
Well - I had a new router through the post from Netgear, and it did exactly the same thing as the original. I am now awaiting a change to my ISP that is going to happen next week. Once the new ISP is in then I will try the router again with some of the suggestions in this thread - but I am not very hopeful.
Hugely frustrating. |
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Will Bristow
@tiscali.co
|  Hello Neil (and Jim),
Sorry to hear you are still having problems.
I have tried many different settings on my DG834GT, apart from the wireless lockup which I know is a separate issue and depends how much metal is close to the router, I have found that the router is at it's fastest and most reliable when I disable the internal DHCP facility and manually assign an IP address to each of my PC's and laptops. My ISP uses a primary and alternate DNS server but I don't think the router queries the alternate, i.e. if the page can't be found or the primary is busy then I don't think this router queries the alternate. It could also be a timeout problem, when I used to connect to the internet just through a modem and single pc if I miss-typed a URL then IE explorer would quite happily wait for up to twenty seconds before responding with "page not found" but using this NETGEAR router and in auto DHCP/DNS mode I would get the "page not found" after just 4 seconds!
I now have two conventional PC's connected by cable and two laptops connected by wireless.
I have set the adaptors in each PC and laptop with an individual IP address.
(I had to remember to set an individual IP address for each possible location for the laptop card / usb adaptor as I got caught out first time and found I couldn't connect via wireless if I put the card or USB adaptor in a different slot, I now have two addresses for a card-bus slot on one laptop and six! for the other laptop with USB ports).
So each PC has it's own fixed IP address, subnet mask is the same for all, gateway is the same for all and primary DNS server and alternate DNS is the same for all. The router set up has been changed so the box "use router as DHCP server" is not ticked.
Now all requests for a web page are passed through the router without interpretation and on the whole this seems very stable I haven't had any "page not found" errors for quite a while.
If you want to try a manual set up it might help, but remember to log into the router first and backup the current setup in case you need to go back, un-tick the "use router as DHCP server" and then save changes, log-out. then go into the PC adaptor TCP/IP settings and set the following (for example)
TCP/IP settings:
IP address:192.168.0.2 (for the first pc and increment by one for each successive pc/laptop)
Sub Net mask: 255.255.255.0
Gateway:192.168.0.1
Primary DNS: xxx.xxx.xxx.xxx
Alternate DNS: xxx.xxx.xxx.xxx
(from the router status page or the advice of your ISP)
If you are using XP the changes are instant, if not, reboot the pc to update the adaptor settings.
Using the router in auto DHCP /DNS mode is much easier to set up but I found as you have that trying to surf the web in this mode is very hit and miss!
Best of luck
Will. |
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jimscrivener
join:2004-12-29
Hastings UK | Many thanks for the detailed help. I have followed your guidelines and hope that it may make a difference. |
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gliderboy
| reply to neilaubin
Re: Netgear DG834G intermittent timeout/connectivity
I am no expert but had a similar problem with an earlier DG814 (not wireless) and solved it by increasing the idle timeout from the default 5 mins to 100 mins. Not ideal but it worked. |
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