jvmorris
I Am The Man Who Was Not There.
Premium,MVM
join:2001-04-03
Reston, VA
| reply to POed at VOL
Re: Emails not getting through to my email account
That's already been done . . . twice now in fact, once in early Feb and again a bit earlier today.
I see they've opened a new trouble ticket for me (whoopee doo!  ) I'm kinda curious how long it's going to be before they simply mark this one closed without resolving the problem. Can we start a forum pool on that?
Since there was no e-mail or other communication last time, this time I was specific (repeatedly) call me if you need further information.
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Regards, Joseph V. Morris |
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POed at VOL
@212.17.x.x
| reply to jvmorris
Look at the headers of one of the notification e-mails that you sent to your Errols address, and find the IP address of the machine that actually delivers the notification to the Verizon SMTP server. Submit that IP address to Verizon.
Unfortunately, it looks as though nobody is going to force Verizon to stop this stupid policy. |
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jvmorris
I Am The Man Who Was Not There.
Premium,MVM
join:2001-04-03
Reston, VA
| reply to anon y mouse
Well, I did that back on 6 Feb 2005 for BBR/DSLR Reports. Trouble ticket is marked as closed on this subject on 7 Feb 2005. Rather obviously (from my other thread) that doesn't make a rat's ass worth of difference.
Furthermore, I can find absolutely no blacklist on which BBR/DSLR is listed.
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Regards, Joseph V. Morris |
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anon y mouse
@verizon.ne |  reply to POed at VOL
You have to request specific domains and addresses be whitelisted. What a crock.
»www2.verizon.net/micro/whitelist/ |
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POed at VOL
@netsource.ie
| reply to gracie
the publicized "fix" (and a silly one at that) is to CALL tech support and have them "whitelist" the addy or ip block you need.
Here we are, almost 3 months into this fiasco, and people are still suggesting that the mail is being caught in a standard spam filter.
That's why it is not a good idea to confuse people by stating that you have whitelisted your correspondents. You called Verizon, and asked them to unblock specific addresses. Eventually, they might, or they might not, do that, and they won't tell you whether they have or haven't, or what "logic" they used to make their decision. And if they do decide to allow that IP address to send mail to Verizon.net addresses, they will be able to send it to any verizon.net address, not just yours. |
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gracie
Geek Goddess
Premium
join:2003-07-15
confusion
| reply to CheckinQueue
said by CheckinQueue:Go to » dslstart.verizon.net and log into your primary email account. Click on Check My Mail, then Options, and the Block Sender tab. Select Save messages to folder... and select or make a folder. Be sure to scroll down and click OK. Then add the email addresses AND domain (@...) to the Safe list. that IN NO WAY will unblock an international address that is being blocked by the new policy. let's not confuse this issue with the standard whitelisting that you can do for an addy that is being marked as spam...those emails are saved to your spam box (if you have it enabled.) these addys are blocked from even being received by verizon in the first place.
the publicized "fix" (and a silly one at that) is to CALL tech support and have them "whitelist" the addy or ip block you need. so far, that is the only way around the international block, until they come to their senses.
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graciella! "not tonight dear, I have DSL."
Creating SuperOrganizations Worldwide
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CheckinQueue
@cable.rogers
| reply to gracie
Go to »dslstart.verizon.net and log into your primary email account. Click on Check My Mail, then Options, and the Block Sender tab. Select Save messages to folder... and select or make a folder. Be sure to scroll down and click OK. Then add the email addresses AND domain (@...) to the Safe list. Again, be sure to click OK. It's always a good thing to check the Block Sender folder to make sure emails from places you want to get mail from are not there. Give this process about 24 hours. Then go to dslstart.verizon.net and click on Resource Center and go to Announcements. You want to click on the Statement From Verizon Regarding Spam Filtering 01/17/05. Part way down the message you will see the part where you click "here" to fill out the form. I hope this helps. |
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gracie
Geek Goddess
Premium
join:2003-07-15
confusion
| reply to POed at VOL
said by POed at VOL:
So you can't "whitelist" me...as long as Verizon is blocking acess to their mail server from my ISPs IP addresses, then you'll be wasting your time.
again, to clarify...yes, the emails are blocked totally---until a u.s. verizon customer calls and requests the block be lifted---what we are calling "whitelisting" (different from the usual easy as pie whitelisting of just adding an address to a list so it isn't marked as spam). if you are a home user going through a large isp with a changing ip address, i guess it would be a challenge for them to do this. the cases in which i've done it have been for businesses. and verizon is VERY clear on this...customer calls, requests that a specific addy or block of ips is "whitelisted" (allowed to come through), and eventually, they are...IF verizon feels they are "worthy".  .
we have now done this with four different european correspondents and have helped quite a few verizon users do it as well. so i think we may be disagreeing more on semantics...an individual customer CAN request this for an individual correspondent, and if it can be done without opening a huge hole (say, whitelisting an entire isp), verizon will do it.
i still fully abhor this stupid policy of theirs, just want to clarify.
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graciella! "not tonight dear, I have DSL."
Creating SuperOrganizations Worldwide
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POed at VOL
@netsource.ie
| reply to gracie
Gracie, if I telnet to port 25 on relay.verizon.net (the address listed in the MX record for verizon.net) the connection is refused. This refusal occurs before verizon knows what e-mail address I am sending from, or what e-mail address I am sending to. There is nothing that you, as an individual verizon customer, can do that will allow me to send e-mail to you, except to ask verizon to "whitelist" my address. And if Verizon does that, then my IP address is "whitelisted" for any and all connections that I make to their mail server, not just for e-mail sent to you.
Whether my e-mail makes it through any actual spam filters that occur further up the line, that you can control on a personal basis, is neither here nor there, as today my e-mails never make it as far as any spam filters.
So you can't "whitelist" me, or any of my e-mail addresses. You can add any addresses you like to your "whitelists", but as long as Verizon is blocking acess to their mail server from my ISPs IP addresses, then you'll be wasting your time. |
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gracie
Geek Goddess
Premium
join:2003-07-15
confusion
| reply to POed at VOL
said by POed at VOL:
You didn't whitelist anyone - you may have asked VOL to add your correspondents SMTP servers to a company wide whitelist, but it's important that you don't give the impression that any individual VOL customer can control which "foreign" e-mails make it through. actually, i beg to differ. i DID whitelist them, and yes, any individual VOL customer CAN control which foreign emails make it through---to THEM. it is not necessarily a company-wide whitelist at all, though often when they see it is benign, they will make it so. this was a private correspondent with their own mail server, NOT an isp email user, so allowing their mail through TO ME should have been a cinch, and not taken the full four weeks and much yelling that it took.
so i share your annoyance with this ridiculous policy, but did want to clarify.
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graciella! "not tonight dear, I have DSL."
Creating SuperOrganizations Worldwide
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POed at VOL
@netsource.ie
| reply to gracie
gave me a chance to either whitelist them
You didn't whitelist anyone - you may have asked VOL to add your correspondents SMTP servers to a company wide whitelist, but it's important that you don't give the impression that any individual VOL customer can control which "foreign" e-mails make it through.
What did you have to do to get your correspondents mailservers whitelisted? My friends have given up calling VOL support on the issue, as they have repeatedly been ignored (and misled, and lied to, but that's about what they've come to expect from VOL anyway). |
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gracie
Geek Goddess
Premium
join:2003-07-15
confusion
| reply to POed at VOL
said by POed at VOL:
Just to be clear on this - Verizon isn't deleting or withholding the e-mail, they are refusing to accept delivery of the e-mail in the first place. definitely---and the sender SHOULD see that in his logs/bounced mail. much as i'm ticked off at VOL for the block, let's not blame them for holding on/throwing out mail. the senders i've had problems with were all getting bounced messages that the relay failed (i.e. they were not accepting delivery), notified me, and that gave me a chance to either whitelist them or, in most cases, just tell them to use my own domain addys.
let me tell you, there are a lot of people in europe now who think verizon stinks, just like a lot of affected users here. what a stupid move on their part!
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graciella! "not tonight dear, I have DSL."
Creating SuperOrganizations Worldwide
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POed at VOL
@netsource.ie
| reply to keith2468
5. Deleting or withholding the email, rather than the normal process of routing it to "spam" folder that users can be access via webmail (which is what most ISPs do with non-viral spam).
Just to be clear on this - Verizon isn't deleting or withholding the e-mail, they are refusing to accept delivery of the e-mail in the first place. |
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keith2468
Premium,MVM
join:2001-02-03
Winnipeg, MB
| reply to Laser0
I've been a big proponent of enhanced spam filtering by ISPs.
But there is a right way and a wrong way to do it.
Verizon has gone about this in the most completely wrong way possible.
1. No advance notification to the customer.
2. No effective customer controlled overrides.
3. Applying the customer's whitelist after filtering, instead of before.
4. Xenophobic basis for filtering.
5. Deleting or withholding the email, rather than the normal process of routing it to "spam" folder that users can be access via webmail (which is what most ISPs do with non-viral spam).
Maybe they want to save money by having you choose to switch your email to hotmail.
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(Virus&Hijacking FAQ + Submit suspected malware + Backups FAQ + Security FAQ TOC) |
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gracie
Geek Goddess
Premium
join:2003-07-15
confusion
| reply to Rod P
said by Rod P  :gracie, you're right... Bottom line is that I certainly don't like the issue join the club! i've been such a verizon evangelist in the past, and am really furious at this ridiculous implementation of supposed "spam-reducing" measures...only a totally clueless technophobe could have thought this up. ironically, i get VERY little spam on my verizon accounts, thanks to their excellent spam filters well before they implemented this silliness, so to my mind, it wasn't even helpful.
and it sure as heck made a lot of us fans into pretty p-o'd customers! their spokesperson's comment that we should "use the phone" for important communications, and their asinine "whitelist" pseudo-solution, coupled with their refusal to admit that they screwed up and to back off from this misguided plan, added insult to injury. and i have my own domains so am able to still receive email from europe; i pity those who have no alternative other than getting a yahoo, etc. account. shameful.
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graciella! "not tonight dear, I have DSL."
Creating SuperOrganizations Worldwide
Creating & Hosting SuperSites Worldwide |
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POed at VOL
@netsource.ie
| reply to kenyg
Verizon is simply blocking access to Port 25 (the SMTP port) from all European IP addresses, except for the handful that it has bothered to "whitelist". In other words, as far as any affected mail server on this side of the ocean is concerned, relay.verizon.net doesn't exist. In other words, the mail isn't being filtered, the verizon mail server is effectively hiding from us.
Normally an e-mail server will hang on to an e-mail and retry, often up to 7 days, before it decides that the server isn't coming back, and will then inform the sender that it couldn't deliver the message. So it might be as long as a week before the sender is notified that the message couldn't be delivered (and some servers might not give any notification, but I would have thought that that would be unusual).
One of the most aggravating things about this is that there is far more spam coming from the US than there is coming from Europe. |
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kenyg
join:2001-02-09
Hatboro, PA
| reply to Laser0
As far as I know - one of the huge problems is that the emails DO NOT get bounced back to the sender. They just never show up to the recipient, and as far as the sender knows they have gone through - which in not the case.
Evidenlty Vz is just dumping them into a bit-bucket somewhere.
So, until your distant party calls you - you have no idea.
Until things are fixed - switch to another email - I did.
Ken
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aye aye captain! |
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Rod P
Premium
join:2003-02-09
Purcellville, VA | reply to gracie
gracie, you're right, I am the one who is confused. With 11 pages of messages, I did not read them all. Bottom line is that I certainly don't like the issue and will have to pursue it further with Verizon. Thanks for your responses.
Rod P |
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gracie
Geek Goddess
Premium
join:2003-07-15
confusion
| reply to Rod P
said by Rod P : What is a "whitelist"? I don't know what you are talking about. guess it wasn't me who was confused . This thread was started because verizon decided to block almost all international emails, and told its customers that if they wanted to unblock a specific addy, they had to call and whitelist it. while most of us did that with the one or two that we usually receive mail from, it is a PITA, and ridiculous for those who receive a lot of mail from different international addys.
did you read the thread from the beginning? i suspect that somewhere along the way, it got diverted, and both you and i may have missed a lot .
there is a class action lawsuit going on now about this. also covered earlier in this thread.
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graciella! "not tonight dear, I have DSL."
Creating SuperOrganizations Worldwide
Creating & Hosting SuperSites Worldwide |
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Rod P
Premium
join:2003-02-09
Purcellville, VA
| reply to gracie
said by gracie :said by Rod P : are these addresses that you have specifically whitelisted, and the whitelist isn't working? What is a "whitelist"? I don't know what you are talking about. Are you saying I now have to generate a list of E-Mail addresses outside the US, inorder to continue to communicate with them via my Verizon account? |
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