  amysheehan Premium,VIP,MVM join:1999-12-21 Huntington Beach, CA
·RoadRunner Cable
| reply to eburger68 Re: ASW Vendors in La-La Land
On Feb 5th I noticed the 'funky' numbers and saved my download log to another disc....
Definitions File Loaded: Reference Number : SE1R26 25.01.2005 Internal build : 31 File location : C:\Program Files\Lavasoft\Ad-Aware SE Personal\defs.ref File size : 413418 Bytes Total size : 1303446 Bytes Signature data size : 1273751 Bytes Reference data size : 29183 Bytes Signatures total : 36254 Fingerprints total : 607 Fingerprints size : 22890 Bytes Target categories : 15 Target families : 632
2-5-2005 4:48:31 PM Performing WebUpdate...
Installing Update... Definitions File Loaded: Reference Number : SE1R27 05.02.2005 Internal build : 32 File location : C:\Program Files\Lavasoft\Ad-Aware SE Personal\defs.ref File size : 410347 Bytes Total size : 1296130 Bytes Signature data size : 1266439 Bytes Reference data size : 29179 Bytes Signatures total : 36032 Fingerprints total : 616 Fingerprints size : 23320 Bytes Target categories : 15 Target families : 631
2-5-2005 4:48:40 PM Success Update successfully downloaded and installed.
-------- At least I know now I wasn't seeing things....;) |
|
  Corrine Premium join:2004-08-27
| reply to eburger68 »www.lavasoftsupport.com/index.ph···p=389520
Hi all,
First and foremost, Lavasoft does not have collaborations with any company that has or will have content detected by Ad-Aware. WhenU was indeed removed from our database by research in the last definition file. This was due to WhenU not scoring more than 2 TAC points at the time. In case it turns out that the removal was incorrect, WhenU will naturally be reintroduced to the database.
Thanks Chris Fry www.lavasoft.de -- Corrine, Lavasoft Forum Administrator |
|
 psloss Premium join:2002-02-24 Alpharetta, GA
2 edits | reply to eburger68 Well here's for strange...I scanned last night with the SE1R25 definitions and it found nothing -- not even the Alexa registry stuff that SE1R26 found. That's when I decided to quit and start again this morning.
But no change today -- even after restoring the OS install from Ghost image and reinstalling (first AAW, then BearShare). The logs from the three scans (with SE1R25, SE1R26, and SE1R27) I did are attached. The latter two logs are very similar except that I started taskmgr in between those two scans -- they both pick up the Alexa entries. (The VVSN process is running, post BearShare install, for all three scans.)
FWIW, here's the full command line on the VVSN process:
PID 1496 [XPHOMEGOO\TestAdmin]: '"E:\Program Files\VVSN\VVSN.exe" /cfg:EEPE010501 /d"BearS *hare" /f"E:\Program Files\BearShare\BearShare.exe"'
(*) WARNING 1 long line(s) split Edit, to fix long line...
Philip Sloss
-- Feedback? e-mail: stuff@lupwa.org
|
|
  Dogwood Premium join:2001-01-14 Texas clubs:  | reply to Corrine Well, that is sad. No more Ad-Aware for me or my clients.
I just glad there are still some anti-adware/spyware companies out there with a little self respect. |
|
  Spy Premium join:2001-09-22 NE
| reply to Corrine said by Corrine :» www.lavasoftsupport.com/index.ph···p=389520Hi all,
First and foremost, Lavasoft does not have collaborations with any company that has or will have content detected by Ad-Aware. WhenU was indeed removed from our database by research in the last definition file. This was due to WhenU not scoring more than 2 TAC points at the time. In case it turns out that the removal was incorrect, WhenU will naturally be reintroduced to the database.
Thanks Chris Fry www.lavasoft.de 2 TAC Points? What is this, comedy central? Read here and let me know if you think 2 TAC points is enough for WhenU.
»www.lavasoft.de/ms/tac.shtml |
|
 B Premium,MVM join:2000-10-28
2 edits | reply to psloss said by psloss :Thanks, Eric. And thanks for the TAC search link, DSL_Steve...unfortunately, I can't get it to find WhenU. Anybody else try it? I was able to get it to hit on "coolweb" and "Claria" but not "when", "whenu", or "whenusave" Philip Sloss Nothing on searching for "savenow" either...
Have we gotten to the bottom of this yet?
I'm inclined to believe the official explanation, but I've been known to be gullible before. Corrine, would you care to show us WhenU's category by category TAC score breakdown, please?
-- B -- In a realm outside causality and function |
|
  Karl Bode News Guy join:2000-03-02
Host: Road Runner PC gaming GAMES PC gaming Tech
| quote: I'm inclined to believe the official explanation, but I've been known to be gullible before. Corrine, would you care to show us WhenU's category by category TAC score breakdown, please?
Yes, I'd like to see this as well. |
|
 psloss Premium join:2002-02-24 Alpharetta, GA
| reply to B said by B :Nothing on searching for "savenow" either... Have we gotten to the bottom of this yet? I'm inclined to believe the official explanation, but I've been known to be gullible before. Corrine, would you care to show us WhenU's category by category TAC score breakdown, please? Of course if the WhenU items (or related items) were in their searchable database we'd already have some idea about their scoring...so I hope those will be added in an update...
Philip Sloss -- Feedback? e-mail: stuff@lupwa.org |
|
  dadkins Can you do Blu? Premium,MVM join:2003-09-26 Hercules, CA
·Comcast
1 edit | reply to eburger68 Things that make you go Hmmm.
Well, I have several OTHER applications that remove that crud from my computer... BAD move Lavasoft!
One more glimpse at the future? |
|
  Corrine Premium join:2004-08-27
| reply to eburger68 B, I am sorry but I have no idea! I don't have access to the Research staff or the tools that they use. I leave evaluations to the professionals like Eric and CJ. As to Research's determination, again, all I have access to is the same public information, copied below. I am not a "tech
Threat Assessment Chart
(Removal): Given one point.
Determining factors: Provides no uninstaller at all or non-functional application uninstaller. Lacks clear evidence of intention. In other words, there is no available evidence to suspect the application's developer of intentionally making his/her software difficult to uninstall other than having a poorly coded or buggy uninstaller.
(Integration): Can cause system instability and is worth two points.
Determining factors: This category is self-explanatory and refers only to the effect a given database candidate has on a user's system.
(Distribution): Unsolicited Install and is given two points.
Determining factors: Intentionally hidden (stealth) install and/or clear evidence of Intention. The application is designed with the clear intention of either making it difficult or impossible to remove using normal removal procedures. Bundled install that is undisclosed. This is different from number one in that it may contain an uninstaller, but there was no notice given to the user pre-install and/or the host application's EULA (End User License Agreement) attempts to hide the application's inclusion as a condition of the host application's install and/or use. Program does not disclose info in EULA, has a confusing EULA, or a hidden EULA listing what is done with collected information.
(Behavior): Malware is given three points automatically regardless of the stated behaviors. All other intentional behaviors are given three points.
Determining factors: Virus / Trojan Horse Connects to perform or aid in a DDoS (Dedicated Denial of Service) attack. Program masks as doing one thing, but does another. Use or creation of Tracking Cookies. Changes browsing results (browser hijack/redirect, replace text/graphics, opens random websites) Operates in stealth (Runs hidden from the user). Opens web sites not initiated by the user/unsolicited popups and/or requests to join a different site. Auto-updates without user permission and/or knowledge. Dials an unprompted or unauthorized Internet connection. Opens or Exploits a System Vulnerability.
(Privacy): Privacy Violations are worth two points.
Determining factors: Connects to a remote system with or without the user's awareness to transmit usage statistics and/or personally identifiable information. Connects to a remote system without the user's awareness to transmit/receive information Tracks the user's surfing habits. »www.lavasoftnews.com/theeye/i12/a1.shtml
-- Corrine, Lavasoft Forum Administrator |
|
 Goldman
join:2002-06-21 Maumelle, AR
| reply to eburger68 Could this explanation be any weaker. They tell us that "in case it turns out that the removal was incorrect"?!?! They know that whenU is one of the more intrusive pieces of garbage that can clutter your Windows installation. You can just feel the trust in Adaware withering away as they attempt to defend the inexcusable. It's really a shame.
Money talks...integrity walks. |
|
 B Premium,MVM join:2000-10-28
| reply to Corrine
Corrine , thanks for answering in any case.
One would really think that one of the TAC measurements should include prior TAC history! In other words, even if a spyware company like WhenU were to suddenly lessen its evil ways, you don't immediately give them a pass...
But that's somewhat a quibble. I would suggest, Corrine, that Lavasoft's official answer is not yet sufficient to satisfy my curiosity, at the least, and probably not enough to satisfy the concerns of many of its customers.
-- B -- In a realm outside causality and function |
|
  hpguru Curb Your Dogma Premium join:2002-04-12
| reply to Corrine said by Corrine :» www.lavasoftsupport.com/index.ph···p=389520Hi all,
First and foremost, Lavasoft does not have collaborations with any company that has or will have content detected by Ad-Aware. WhenU was indeed removed from our database by research in the last definition file. This was due to WhenU not scoring more than 2 TAC points at the time. In case it turns out that the removal was incorrect, WhenU will naturally be reintroduced to the database.
Thanks Chris Fry www.lavasoft.de If this is indeed the case, it seems you would have saved yourself some heartache and the trust of your end-users if you required spyware vendors to maintain a below threshold TAC score over a period of several consecutive months. Twenty-four months seems like a nice round figure. -- Boundlessly expands the sky and nothing stops the white clouds from freely flying about. |
|
  antiserious The Future ain't what it used to be Premium join:2001-12-12 Scranton, PA
| reply to Corrine
... still doesn't pass the smell test, sorry ... and I would suggest that if WhenU passes your 'TAC' test, perhaps it's time to re-evaluate THOSE standards ... I think hpguru's suggestion of 'maintaining a below threshold TAC score over a period of time' is a much more prudent approach, especially since it's obvious to all that explaining your actions in advance is NOT in the Lavasoft game plan ...
... but hey, it's your company, your product, and YOUR credibility at stake - here's hoping that means something to you folks ...
... I bet their refund policy gets a workout in the next few days ... wonder if they have one ...
-- ... "Nobody's perfect - well, there was this one guy, but we killed Him" ... Christopher Moore, 'Lamb' ... |
|
  Doctor Four My other vehicle is a TARDIS Premium join:2000-09-05 Dallas, TX
·AT&T U-Verse
| reply to eburger68 After having read all this, and Lavasoft's rather weak answer to questions that many people in this forum are still asking of them (and others in the anti spyware community are likely asking as well), I may not wait until the end of the week to uninstall Ad Aware. It is getting removed when I get home this afternoon. Trust has been broken here, and Lavasoft's answer isn't satisfactory to people who are concerned about this. -- "Kayura or Badamon, whichever you are, you should know that I will never give up this battle. By the will of the Ancient, I shall succeed!" - Shuten (Anubis) from the Ronin Warriors.To RIAA/MPAA - You can sue but you can't catch everyone! |
|
  salzan Experienced Optimist Premium join:2004-01-08 WA State
1 edit | reply to Corrine So they are telling us that the inclusion of the warnings in Bearshare (and I assume all other WhenU containing software) was enough to lower the TAC to an "acceptable" level of 2?
Which 2?
What about all the existing installs done before this warning? Are they now undetected because WhenU is currently OK?
How about I install an archived version of Bearshare?
Personally, I'm just not buying into this lame response. |
|
 Kr0m
join:2000-10-26 Fredericton, NB
| reply to antiserious gah, this is horrible. Bad Lavasoft.. bad. I wonder how many other pieces of adware/spyware have been removed from their reference lists over the past months due to their 'ratings'. I guess that's what I get for having 'blind' trust in a company's software. Now I have to go and tell people to remove ad-aware from countless PCs I've worked on, and to not support Lavasoft anymore. -- Fredericton, New Brunswick, Canada |
|
  dadkins Can you do Blu? Premium,MVM join:2003-09-26 Hercules, CA | reply to eburger68 Ya know, ever since one of our own regulars was fired from Lavasoft, they sure have gone into the crapper.
Talk about stepping in it! |
|
  StraitShoot Who Loves Ya Baby? - Theo Kojak Premium join:2003-02-08 Clinton, MA
2 edits | reply to The sparrow4 said by The sparrow4 :First and foremost, Lavasoft does not have collaborations with any company that has or will have content detected by Ad-Aware. Why should we believe THAT statement, when trust is already out the window? said by The sparrow4 :WhenU was indeed removed from our database by research in the last definition file. That statement ALONE pretty much says it all...
said by The sparrow4 :This was due to WhenU not scoring more than 2 TAC points at the time. In case it turns out that the removal was incorrect, WhenU will naturally be reintroduced to the database. Thanks Chris Fry www.lavasoft.de Well, according to Straitshoot's "H&IISP" Test (Hoenesty & Integrity in Spyware programs...), Lavasoft failed miserably, and Adaware will be swiftly and FOREVER removed from my home system today... Bye Lavasoft!
|
|
  Oremina Tempus edax rerum Premium join:2004-06-02 England
2 edits | reply to dadkins said by dadkins :Ya know, ever since one of our own regulars was fired from Lavasoft, they sure have gone into the crapper. Talk about stepping in it! That thought had also crossed my mind, got to be worth a penny for his thoughts...and he sure as hell must be watching this thread.:)
Must say 'tho that I also feel just a bit sorry for Corrine who has to take all the flak as the "face" of Lavasoft, whilst whichever dum-dum made this daft decision hides away in his office somewhere. -- Oremina
|
|