major marco
Res Firma Mitescere Nescit
Premium
join:2003-02-13
Stepford, CA
clubs:
| reply to fundamentalz
Re: That's A Good Knee Slapper
said by fundamentalz  :good job of proving my point by labeling people that disagree as cry babies. People who hit the hey mod button are crybabies. That was my point.
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»www.hermes-press.com/brainwash1.htm |
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fundamentalz
The Basics
Premium
join:2004-04-30
Moorpark, CA
1 edit | reply to fundamentalz
"Hey Mod"ing a comment does not guarantee that it will be deleted, simply that the post is brought to their attention. The call of whether or not to delete a post is their discretion. If they agree that the post was inflamitory, then i am sure that they will take the appropriate action.
By the way, good job of proving my point by labeling people that disagree as cry babies.
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I subscribe to the theory of intellectual osmosis. Unfortunately, I must now cease our conversation and move away from you before my intelligence begins to drop. Good day. |
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major marco
Res Firma Mitescere Nescit
Premium
join:2003-02-13
Stepford, CA
clubs:
| reply to fundamentalz
said by fundamentalz :I hardly think that public discourse includes anyone who disagrees with the majority opinion to be immediately branded and ostracized. Discourse is fine, but the personal attacks that are becoming all too common in the news posts around here are doing nothing to enhance the discussion Then do what everyone else does. Go crying to the thought police and hey mod the post. That will result in your comments being deleted and the discussion getting locked followed by a sanctimonious warning for flaming or trolling which are fun euphemisms used to let you know that some crybaby didn't like your opinion.
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»www.hermes-press.com/brainwash1.htm |
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fundamentalz
The Basics
Premium
join:2004-04-30
Moorpark, CA
| reply to major marco
I hardly think that public discourse includes anyone who disagrees with the majority opinion to be immediately branded and ostracized. Discourse is fine, but the personal attacks that are becoming all too common in the news posts around here are doing nothing to enhance the discussion
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I subscribe to the theory of intellectual osmosis. Unfortunately, I must now cease our conversation and move away from you before my intelligence begins to drop. Good day. |
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major marco
Res Firma Mitescere Nescit
Premium
join:2003-02-13
Stepford, CA
clubs:
| reply to fundamentalz
said by fundamentalz :What i mean by that is the act of one person stating their opinion on a subject, with all people following just saying "I totally agree". In the occasion that someone disagrees you just get the majority flaming the minority opinion. This usually happens when someone brings up a piracy related issue, when any news regarding countries other than U.S. taking ownership of the internet, or when politicians are mentioned somehow Funny but I thought that's what free speech and public discourse was all about.
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»www.hermes-press.com/brainwash1.htm |
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major marco
Res Firma Mitescere Nescit
Premium
join:2003-02-13
Stepford, CA
clubs:
| reply to Derek_Wildstar
Re: WRONG
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Derek_Wildstar
Why the fck is Shane walking in there?
join:2001-02-24
Iscandar
| reply to RadioDoc
said by RadioDoc :said by Steve :said by RadioDoc :You are not a mod anymore either (gee I wonder why?) I resigned; shall we speculate about you? No need to speculate. I stood up to the bullshit that made people like you a mod and called a spade a spade. I refused to compromise my beliefs. They fired me for it. You resigned because you couldn't take the heat. Looks like the pissing contest has begun in earnest.
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"One thousand years of pain!"
All hail the Hypnotoad! |
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fundamentalz
The Basics
Premium
join:2004-04-30
Moorpark, CA
| reply to major marco
Re: That's A Good Knee Slapper
said by major marco :Define hate rallies. What i mean by that is the act of one person stating their opinion on a subject, with all people following just saying "I totally agree". In the occasion that someone disagrees you just get the majority flaming the minority opinion. This usually happens when someone brings up a piracy related issue, when any news regarding countries other than U.S. taking ownership of the internet, or when politicians are mentioned somehow
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I subscribe to the theory of intellectual osmosis. Unfortunately, I must now cease our conversation and move away from you before my intelligence begins to drop. Good day. |
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major marco
Res Firma Mitescere Nescit
Premium
join:2003-02-13
Stepford, CA
clubs:
| reply to fundamentalz
said by fundamentalz :I for one, am tired of the hate rally's that are the news postings relating to either piracy/RIAA, politicians, or international issues. Define hate rallies.
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»www.hermes-press.com/brainwash1.htm |
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Steve
I'm a PC, so shut up
Consultant
join:2001-03-10
Yorba Linda, CA
| reply to SRFireside
Re: WRONG
said by SRFireside :Please clarify. Are you against casual file trading where people just share and download a few songs or just the power users who brag about the gigs of stuff they have and would rather pay hundreds of dollars NOT paying for music? You didn't really clarify that on the start, and that might account for some of the bickering. I thought I was pretty clear on this ("burning through their 50G caps"), but I'll say it explicity.
Almost everybody shares with their friends, and this is not new to the computer world: making a copy of a cassette was common years and years ago. It's not really legal, but in many cases this casual trading *does* lead to music purchases. I know that people have sent me MP3s before: if I like it, I buy it.
Or if you own a vinyl album, grabbing the MP3 of a song that somebody else ripped doesn't seem like "stealing" to me either. You own a license to the music, you're just getting the bits in a different form.
These folks are not the problem.
It's the power users who are flagrant and brazen about it. I've heard people say "I won't ever pay for music" who are the problem. It's the teenagers to whom it *never occurs to them* that music is something you buy who are the problem.
Steve
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Stephen J. Friedl • Unix Wizard • Microsoft Security MVP • Tustin, California USA • my web site |
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asdfdfdf
@xtraport.net | reply to asdfdfdf
sorry C. above should be "reduce the number of BURNS" |
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SRFireside
join:2001-01-19
Houston, TX
| reply to Steve
Please clarify. Are you against casual file trading where people just share and download a few songs or just the power users who brag about the gigs of stuff they have and would rather pay hundreds of dollars NOT paying for music? You didn't really clarify that on the start, and that might account for some of the bickering. |
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asdfdfdf
@xtraport.net
| reply to redhatnation
I wouldn't refer to the service as mediocre. I think it is a solid service. I think this distracts from the main point.
I would like to explain, though, why I think it is a bad idea to participate in these services.
I understand your argument that you do not feel the terms are restricting you presently. That is valid, but the fact remains that those terms are not legal obligations on their part. They can change those terms whenever they choose and, because you are tied down to a drm system, they can enforce those changes with simple software alterations. With cd sales, if the industry tried to force retroactive changes in what was considered acceptable use, of what you had previously purchased, they had, as a practical matter, no power to enforce such changes on you. DRM acts as a lock in. Once you are in it your use of what you have purchased is under their control and you have no way to get out, without giving up use of everything you bought.
You actually have LESS freedom then you did under cd distribution where their ability to dictate terms as to how you used what you purchased was limited by practical realities. This is the reality of drm in the internet age. It is actually creating a world where the buyer has LESS freedom and power than they did with the old distribution models.
Why should we allow the industry to construct new models that give them even greater control than they had before? This turns the openness and freedom of the internet on its head.
This is why drm is so insidious. It places ALL the power in their hands and it allows them to change all the terms at any time, for any reason they choose. People don't seem to notice this fact underneath the generous terms of service. Don't be seduced into believing that, because the present terms are reasonable, you are in the same situation as you were with the cd distribution model. You are, in fact, handing more power over to the industry.
I think it is naive to believe that the terms you are presently under are anything other than a carrot to get people to buy into a drm system. Once the majority of people have accepted such a system control will be tightened down. There is no reason to think that the industry view has changed in any fundamental way in this regard.
People say, well you can burn it and rerip it. True and this is why I think it is naive to believe that they won't be doing away with burning down the road. There are already indications that the industry is pressuring to A. increase prices to 1.5 to 2.5 per track if they can't B. get rid of per track downloads entirely and force the purchase of full albums. C. reduce the number of downloads(and there is little doubt, in my mind, that this number will be reduced little by little until it is zero burns). |
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SRFireside
join:2001-01-19
Houston, TX
| reply to RadioDoc
You're getting way out of line. Take the personal insults and attacks on a private message. That goes for all of you. Now about this topic. iTunes is a success because it draws in a lot of business. Doesn't matter if P2P numbers are higher. The RIAA said a song download business model wouldn't fly, yet here it is. It's still flying in spite of Apple hardly making any money.
Drex_CS's original post was off the mark to begin with. Doesn't matter if the claims from iTunes is correct or not. At this point they certainly are the most popular paid download service there is. On the business end that's what counts. You all should be happy about this. That means the RIAA was wrong about the business model and don't have nearly as much leverage in fighting file trading. It means people are buying music instead of getting it for free, thus further diminishing the RIAA's claims. It means artists are getting some money for their efforts (at least in pianotech's case). It's a win-win situation no matter what side of the fence you are on.
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N Yazdi
join:2004-04-19
Omaha, NE | reply to AbBaZaBbA
itunes is a very nifty program when you play around with it, i was a mmjb/wmp/winamp user but now use itunes almost exclusively |
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BeesTea
Network Janitor
Premium,VIP
join:2003-03-08
00000 | reply to RadioDoc
I don't sing for anyone, just as you say, calling "a spade a spade".
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$ /bin/whoami
nobody |
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BeesTea
Network Janitor
Premium,VIP
join:2003-03-08
00000
| reply to RadioDoc
said by RadioDoc :Nowhere is there anything about "piracy". Well, other than the News topic that is.
Forums » News articles » iTunes Vs. Piracy » WRONG
It's also the first word of the first post in this thread.
C'mon
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$ /bin/whoami
nobody |
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RadioDoc
58ef2c0
Premium,ExMod 2000-03
join:2000-05-11
 ·AT&T Midwest
| reply to Steve
said by Steve :said by RadioDoc :You are not a mod anymore either (gee I wonder why?) I resigned; shall we speculate about you? No need to speculate. I stood up to the bullshit that made people like you a mod and called a spade a spade. I refused to compromise my beliefs. They fired me for it. You resigned because you couldn't take the heat.The greed of the RIAA-member companies is legendary. You can't make that go away by using sleazy debating tactics. I don't believe I ever tried to. Holding the thread up to a strong light, we see that I called them thugs and hoped that their entire business model would go away. I am not sure that qualifies me as any kind of RIAA fanboy. But they are not the only greedy ones. Those who are trying to bring about better business models are doing good work, but there is a large contingent of those who are not taking this principled approach, and just take everything they can get without any consideration for artists and won't ever pay anybody. RIAA's greed at least has a fig leaf of moral cover, in that they are acting as agents for valid copyright owners. Those who steal in wholesale have no such principled cover. Steve
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Attitudes are contagious. Mine might kill you. |
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