 NGOwner
join:2000-11-21 Leawood, KS
| reply to Kaltes Re: Betamax has been overturned
Horseshit. Read the whole opinion before spewing garbage like this.
»a257.g.akamaitech.net/7/257/2422···-480.pdf
quote: In sum, this case is significantly different from Sony and reliance on that case to rule in favor of StreamCast and Grokster was error. Sony dealt with a claim of liability based solely on distributing a product with alternative lawful and unlawful uses, with knowledge that some users would follow the unlawful course. The case struck a balance between the interests of protection and innovation by holding that the product's capability of substantial lawful employment should bar the imputation of fault and consequent secondary liability for the unlawful acts of others.
MGM's evidence in this case most obviously addresses a different basis of liability for distributing a product open to alternative uses. Here, evidence of the distributors' words and deeds going beyond distribution as such shows a purpose to cause and profit from third-party acts of copyright infringement. If liability for inducing infringement is ultimately found, it will not be on the basis of presuming or imputing fault, but from inferring a patently illegal objective from statements and actions showing what that objective was.
** Emphasis Added -- It is impossible to create an idiot-proof product. Humanity is simply too adept at churning out better idiots. |
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  Kaltes Premium join:2002-12-04 Los Angeles, CA
| said by NGOwner :Horseshit. Read the whole opinion before spewing garbage like this. Horseshit yourself. Just because Souter says it doesn't make it true. This case fell squarely within Sony, and it could not have been error to decide it under Sony when the supreme court hasn't gotten around to inventing a new legal rule to decide this case with yet.
The USSC don't know much about, nor do they care much about, intellectual property law, which is why the American people get stuck with bullsh1t decisions like this one. The Betamax case was a good one, but now appears to be a fluke. |
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  Kaltes Premium join:2002-12-04 Los Angeles, CA
| reply to NGOwner said by NGOwner :Horseshit. Read the whole opinion before spewing garbage like this. Also, unlike me, you know nothing of vicarious and contributory infringement, which made up the core analysis of the Grokster case in the lower courts. Unless you are an IP lawyer, don't even TRY to argue about this case with me. You aren't qualified. |
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  tapeloop 1959. I try to kick the ball. I miss. Premium join:2004-06-27 Airstrip One
| said by Kaltes :said by NGOwner :Horseshit. Read the whole opinion before spewing garbage like this. Also, unlike me, you know nothing of vicarious and contributory infringement, which made up the core analysis of the Grokster case in the lower courts. Unless you are an IP lawyer, don't even TRY to argue about this case with me. You aren't qualified. Just curious...are YOU an IP lawyer Kaltes? Or any sort of attorney? Paralegal even? -- Copyright infringement is illegal. Murder is illegal. Therefore, file sharing is murder. |
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  Kaltes Premium join:2002-12-04 Los Angeles, CA
| said by tapeloop :Just curious...are YOU an IP lawyer Kaltes? Or any sort of attorney? Paralegal even? Yes I am an IP lawyer. I have been following this case since the day the district court issued its excellent opinion. |
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  tapeloop 1959. I try to kick the ball. I miss. Premium join:2004-06-27 Airstrip One
| I see. Well rather than wait for Nina Tottenberg's recap this afternoon I'm just now printing out the 55-pg. opinion and dissent to pore over during lunch.  -- Copyright infringement is illegal. Murder is illegal. Therefore, file sharing is murder. |
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 NGOwner
join:2000-11-21 Leawood, KS
1 edit | reply to Kaltes said by Kaltes :
said by NGOwner :Horseshit yourself. Just because Souter says it doesn't make it true.
Considering Souter is speaking for a UNIFIED Supreme Court of the United States on a case brought before it, sonny, I would say that does make it true. said by Kaltes :
said by NGOwner :This case fell squarely within Sony, and it could not have been error to decide it under Sony when the supreme court hasn't gotten around to inventing a new legal rule to decide this case with yet.
See above. In particular the quote: quote: this case most obviously addresses a different basis of liability for distributing a product open to alternative uses. Here, evidence of the distributors' words and deeds going beyond distribution as such shows a purpose to cause and profit from third-party acts of copyright infringement.
That right there is the basis for SCOTUS vacating the lower court's ruling. Sony never showed a purpose to cause and profit from third-party acts of copyright infringement, hence the ruling covering Sony's Betamax. Conversely, Grokster/Streamcast spoke almost exclusively of their products' capability of copyright infringement. Your opinion, despite your (presumed) credentials, is that this is a bullsh1t decision. That's your right. Personally I think it was the right one. [NG]Owner -- It is impossible to create an idiot-proof product. Humanity is simply too adept at churning out better idiots. |
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 russotto
join:2000-10-05 Collegeville, PA | reply to Kaltes So how does this differ from existing law on vicarious infringement? You can't bring up Betamax in that one; Sony pre-dates that particular doctrine. |
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  Kaltes Premium join:2002-12-04 Los Angeles, CA
| reply to NGOwner said by NGOwner :Considering Souter is speaking for a UNIFIED Supreme Court of the United States on a case brought before it, sonny, I would say that does make it true. The supreme court decides the law, not the truth. I suppose you think if the supreme court said 2+2=5, that would be true as well? 
said by NGOwner :That right there is the basis for SCOTUS vacating the lower court's ruling. Wrong. The reasoning is detailed later in the opinion where souter outlines 3 reasons he feels distinguish Grokster. None of those 3 reasons were relevant to the Sony analysis.
said by NGOwner :Sony never showed a purpose to cause and profit from third-party acts of copyright infringement, hence the ruling covering Sony's Betamax. Actually, Sony *DID* exactly that, and this opinion confirms it. Sony marketed "build a library" of copyrighted files, something which clearly encourages infringement. Souter lamely tries to claim this would 'not necessarily' be encouraging infringement, when in fact such a claim would have resulted in this court killing the betamax, and Sony as well.
said by NGOwner :Conversely, Grokster/Streamcast spoke almost exclusively of their products' capability of copyright infringement. You don't know that. You aren't familiar with Groksters marketing materials and internal memos, you are repeating what Souter says as if it were fact, when it is ONE MANS OPINION. The fact that the other 8 went along with it doesnt mean they agreed with every single statement, only the result.
said by NGOwner :Your opinion, despite your (presumed) credentials My credentials are made clear by my reasoning. Your lack of credentials are made clear by the fact that you can do nothing but regurgitate what Souter wrote. |
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  Kaltes Premium join:2002-12-04 Los Angeles, CA
| reply to russotto said by russotto :So how does this differ from existing law on vicarious infringement? You can't bring up Betamax in that one; Sony pre-dates that particular doctrine. Wrong, third party liability for infringement, which includes vicarious liability, predates Sony, so don't talk about shit you don't know, k thx. |
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