  Logan 5 Wondering what happens next.. Premium,MVM join:2001-05-25 The WasteLAN | reply to rocke86 Re: [Free] Free 3d cad to first 100,000
Educate the massses please...What is this "bleaching" of email addresses of which you and dadkins speak? |
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  dadkins Can you do Blu? Premium,MVM join:2003-09-26 Hercules, CA
·Comcast
| Well first, I was meaning the installer I downloaded from Crapware Headquarters Alibre. I still have it sandboxed.
WindowWasher has what they call Wash with Bleach... Shredder.  |
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  catseyenu Ack Pfft Premium join:2001-11-17 Fix East | reply to Logan 5 I deleted the account from the domain. |
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  OmniUni
@mindspring.com
thumbs down from: catseyenu  Doctor Olds 
| reply to rocke86 Free 3d cad to first 100,000
OH COME ON!!!
WHAT DO YOU EXPECT FOR FREE?
I admit, the google ads are annoying, but it is more than worth it so that I can work with a 3D cad sofware legally.
The truth is, it IS a fully functional software- it does everything that it said it would do. Whether or not it is stripped of features in the pay version is not the point!
I am one of the first 100k, and am far from being disappointed! I AM disappointed that you all would make such a big deal out of not getting EVERYTHING PERFECT out of a free software.
I give Alibre an enormous amount of credit. They have made a powerful CAD package for everyone to use- even if it does include some of Google's ads. Remember, we are talking about text ads here, not flashing GIF's about everything from "Free Prizes" to air conditioning!
Oh, about me: Male, High School Student, eastern US |
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 OmniUni
join:2005-08-03 1 edit | I now have a login here.
That was my post just above. Now, I think I will go use Alibre Design express, a fantastic free software.
Oh, and after reading this forum I will no longer persue an attempt to remove the advertisments. |
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  mers2 Premium,MVM join:2004-03-20 USA clubs:
·AT&T U-Verse
| said by OmniUni :I now have a login here. Congrats on registering. The point you are missing is what was promised vs. what was delivered. In the original offer it was stated this would be fully functional program. Nothing was stated about ads or about the requirement of an internet connection. On top of which there are now questions of what is being transmitted back to Alibre. When questions were raised in the forums massive censorship took place instead of answering questions. The President of the company told one of our members that he would respond to questions here at DSLR and then was a no show. These are not the acts of a reputable company. -- God put me on this Earth to accomplish a certain number of things. Right now, I am so far behind I will never die. |
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  christcorp Premium join:2001-05-21 Cheyenne, WY
·Bresnan Online
·VOIPo
| reply to OmniUni I could live with the google ads if I thought that was the only need for the constant internet connection. From what I've read and seen on the forums, I have a funny feeling that there is a LOT MORE communications going on between their servers and our computers.
A friend went and downloaded and started using the CAD. I've waited to see how he does. I'm a major computer hacker, but I don't really get into tracing traffic. I can see however on my friend's computer, that even though he's just using the CAD program and not really using the internet, that there appears to be a lot of communicating going on. His network connection seems too active for my likes.
You are correct that we shouldn't be too critical about software when it's free. The majority of the criticism is because many of us feel that we were mislead. We also don't like the idea that their "Free" software is basically a trojan communicating who knows what. If I cared to, I might experiment with a firewall to allow the incoming but monitor the outgoing traffic for the software.
Either way, I'm not a high school student, so if I need a CAD program bad enough I'll pay for one. If I knew more about what the software was doing I might take the risk, but blindly letting a piece of software open up 2 way communications between their server and my computer is totally out of the question. Hopefully I'm wrong about what I've seen and read so far. Later./.. Mike.... |
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  catseyenu Ack Pfft Premium join:2001-11-17 Fix East | reply to OmniUni In case there's any question, that was a thumbs down. |
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  rahlquist Redeye
join:2001-10-30 Villa Rica, GA
| reply to OmniUni said by OmniUni :The truth is, it IS a fully functional software- it does everything that it said it would do. Whether or not it is stripped of features in the pay version is not the point! I am one of the first 100k, and am far from being disappointed! I AM disappointed that you all would make such a big deal out of not getting EVERYTHING PERFECT out of a free software. I give Alibre an enormous amount of credit. They have made a powerful CAD package for everyone to use- even if it does include some of Google's ads. Remember, we are talking about text ads here, not flashing GIF's about everything from "Free Prizes" to air conditioning! Functional, yes.
Meet their promise, simply put, no.
As I said, in their forums; (paraphrased because they deleted the original post because they are afraid to face their accusers)
Alibre has known for a long time they were going to be giving away adware. Their coders, their marketing people and I certainly hope their CEO all knew it was going to be an adware product. Yet, oooops did we neglect to mention its adware! So sorry! This piece of software is worth thousands of dollars! (in revenue to Alibre maybe)
The bottom line is this. If they had advertised it as Adware people would have made an informed choice. Instead, trying to mislead people they called it FREE. They also neglected to mention originally that a CONSTANT internet connection would be required so their software could send data back and forth. Please note that people here have stated that a good deal of that data is encrypted, yet again Alibre has something to hide? For goodness sake, why would they need a constant connection?
Give them the credit you wish. Personally I find it little more than a BLATANT bait and switch offer. They offered FREE with no system requirement for an internet connection. They delivered FREE, but they are displaying ads which isn't consistent in today's market with FREE software. They are also sending back unknown encrypted data of some sort so let me ask you this.
I am a programmer, I can try to make you the ultimate bookmark software for whichever browser you use. Unfortunately its going to be adware and its going to communicate via an encrypted stream to my servers or my affiliates.
So, do you trust me? How do you know what I am accessing? How can you possibly figure it out? I could quietly comb your computer for personal information, email addresses, your surfing habits, and if I detect a broadband connection I can even scour your machine for competing products and report back and even export all the software keys from your registry. Oh and every thing you do in my software, every thing you create I am going to echo back up to my servers. Never know what you have that I may want.
Now do you trust me? Until someone can prove what's in that data stream I wouldn't let this thing near my machine.
Another point I brought up and I still haven't seen addressed is the license agreement. Has anyone read it carefully? What does it say in regards to drawings you create in this free software? Is it like a photo or recipe contest where once you submit your photos or food, you relinquish all rights to that item?
No I don't wear a tin hat but if you LIE (either blatantly or through omission) to me expect to be scrutinized. If I choose to ask you questions because of that LIE and instead of answering them you remove the questions, don't expect me to feel like you're being honest with me. -- The difference between foresight and hindsight is only a matter of when you bother to think things through. Know about something stupid? |
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  entropy1 Premium join:2002-09-25
·Millenicom
·Comcast
·Sprint Mobile Broa..
| reply to OmniUni Um...is "OMNI" really "Greg" by chance? SOUNDS like someone from this crooked company. No one else would give Alibre "an enormous amount of credit". Haha! What a load of CRAP.  |
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  ssj4android Redefining Reality
join:2002-04-14 Wyoming, MI 1 edit | reply to rocke86 Re: [Free] Free 3d cad to first 100,000
Curiousity got the best of me. Looks like most of the stuff is stored in class files within zip files. |
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 OmniUni
join:2005-08-03
| Free 3d cad to first 100,000
Firstly, I am in no way connected to Alibre, though that would sure make for a nice twist, wouldn't it? 
I mainly use OpenSource software, but there are few options of an easy, 3D CAD that is open. I dislike using pirated software, so I am always on the lookout for a good download.
You all seem to be forgetting what "adware" is. A software is not adware if it has embedded advertisments. Adware is software that displays additional ads without the users consent. As for the possibility of extra communications with Alibre, what do I care? It is not like I have anything to hide!
Also, both computers I have connected to the internet are... well, one is junk, and the other is just a little too slow for CAD. I have sent an e-mail to alibre about whether there will be any way for me to use the software on my desktop which is not connected to the internet. Although at the moment I respect Alibre as a company, this opinion hinges on the assumption that I will recieve a response to my e-mail, even it is is 'i'm sorry, we can't help you'. Surely, Alibre would not lose any business to a high school student who's income is loose change, and the odd computer job. Despite the adds, I still feel that Aibre has delivered what they promised- an easy, capable CAD. I was either wondering if it was a scam to get email addresses, or the software would be a trial, or some other dissappointment. Even if Design express was not EVERYTHING I hoped it to be, it is free, and does tons more than any other FREE CAD.
Well, I'm always up for a lively debate... and a little forum like this will certainly get Alibre's attention eventually... so let's keep posting! 
OmniUni |
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  Cudni La Merma - Vigilado Premium,MVM join:2003-12-20 Someshire
| said by OmniUni :As for the possibility of extra communications with Alibre, what do I care? It is not like I have anything to hide! That is an interesting attitude and very conformist and accommodating at that. Not very many users would be so understanding with equally nothing to hide. I can tell you that if it turns out any extra communication is transmitted without user's prior knowledge or approval there will be a devil to pay 
Cudni -- Think locally, @#!? globally!Help yourself so God can help you |
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  salzan Experienced Optimist Premium join:2004-01-08 WA State
| reply to OmniUni I have nothing to hide either. Just a few license keys, a couple of email addresses, the odd password and, oh yeah, everything else that's on my computer.
Now that you're establishing a friendly email rapport with the good folks at Alibre, why don't you ask them why Design Xpress needs to have an encrypted dialogue with their servers every couple of minutes? And while you're at it, ask them what's in the packets? Please let us know.
said by OmniUni :Well, I'm always up for a lively debate... and a little forum like this will certainly get Alibre's attention eventually... so let's keep posting! I have a feeling they know about us. |
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  cob_ 1310nm Of Goodness Premium join:2003-07-08 Tulsa, OK
| reply to rocke86 Re: [Free] Free 3d cad to first 100,000
quote: As for the possibility of extra communications with Alibre, what do I care? It is not like I have anything to hide!
Like your computer's name and whatever's in the encrypted comms? You might be a little too trusting, or naive. |
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  dadkins Can you do Blu? Premium,MVM join:2003-09-26 Hercules, CA
·Comcast
2 edits | reply to rocke86 With all that has been discovered about this POS, I nuked it and have put Alibre on the old SPAM list!
Screw this!
Oh, and what do I expect for free... well, from a REPUTABLE company, working software that doesn't call home.
Take that "What do you expect for free" here and see what kind of response you get: »All Things Unix
I have alot of free software that works great! No ads either!  |
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  rahlquist Redeye
join:2001-10-30 Villa Rica, GA
| reply to OmniUni Re: Free 3d cad to first 100,000
said by OmniUni :You all seem to be forgetting what "adware" is. A software is not adware if it has embedded advertisments. Adware is software that displays additional ads without the users consent. As for the possibility of extra communications with Alibre, what do I care? It is not like I have anything to hide! Friendly debate it is then 
Adware straight from wikipedia;
Adware or advertising-supported software is any computer program or software package in which advertisements or other marketing material are included with or automatically loaded by the software and displayed or played back after installation or in which information about the computer or its users activities is uploaded automatically when the user has not requested it. These applications often present banner ads in pop-up windows or through a bar that appears on a computer screen.
The Opera web browser is a popular example. Adware helps some developers recover programming development costs, and it may allow the software to be provided to the user of the application free of charge or at a reduced price: due to the advertising, the programmer may still profit from the wide use of their work, motivating them to write, maintain, and upgrade the software product.
Some adware is also shareware, as such it may be used as term of distinction used to differentiate between types of shareware software. What differentiates adware from other shareware is that it is primarily advertising supported. Users may also be given the option to pay for a "registered" or "licensed" copy, which typically does away with the advertisements. Other types of shareware include demoware, nagware, crippleware, freeware, loyaltyware, and even spyware.
Some adware programs have been criticized for occasionally including code that tracks a user's personal information and passes it on to third parties, without the user's knowledge or consent. These programs are often called spyware; however, the word adware is sometimes also used to describe spyware.
Spyware has prompted an outcry from computer security and privacy advocates, including the Electronic Privacy Information Center [1]. Often, spyware applications send the user's browsing habits to an adserving company, which then targets adverts at the user based on their interests. Kazaa and eXeem are popular programs which incorporate software of this type.
Adware programs other than spyware do not invisibly collect and upload this activity record or personal information when the user of the computer has not expected or approved of the transfer, but some vendors of adware maintain that their application which does this is not also spyware, due to disclosure of program activities: for example, a product vendor may indicate that since somewhere in the product's Terms of Use, there is a clause that third-party software will be included that may collect and may report on computer use, that this Terms of Use disclosure means the product is just adware.
A number of software applications are available to help computer users search for and modify adware programs to block the presentation of advertisements and to remove spyware modules. To avoid a backlash, as with the advertising industry in general, creators of adware must balance their attempts to generate revenue with users' desire to be left alone. »en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adware
By the above definition its very clear. It's definately adware in my book. Heck by that definition it's possibly even spyware depending on what information is being transferred and the content of lisc. agreement. Most people dont want the ads, and it sends tracking information of some sort back, what that tracking information is nobody but Alibre and possibly Kewordranking.com know. It may not track what you're doing, or it may. Since the data stream is encrypted its hard to say. Maybe some brave soul will try out this software with Winternals.com's regmon and filemon running and see just what its processes read. Of course thats assuming that it doesnt just sniff data right off your etherent like programs such as Ethereal and "What is transferring" do.
Honesty at this point would be Alibre's friend, however I dont think thats in the cards since all the questions on topics such as this got dumped from their forums. -- The difference between foresight and hindsight is only a matter of when you bother to think things through. Know about something stupid? |
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  Logan 5 Wondering what happens next.. Premium,MVM join:2001-05-25 The WasteLAN
·Pacific Bell - SBC
| reply to salzan said by salzan :I have nothing to hide either. Just a few license keys, a couple of email addresses, the odd password and, oh yeah, everything else that's on my computer. Now that you're establishing a friendly email rapport with the good folks at Alibre, why don't you ask them why Design Xpress needs to have an encrypted dialogue with their servers every couple of minutes? And while you're at it, ask them what's in the packets? Please let us know. said by OmniUni :Well, I'm always up for a lively debate... and a little forum like this will certainly get Alibre's attention eventually... so let's keep posting! I have a feeling they know about us. Ya think....??? Indeed they do, because I've specifically talked with Greg Milliken via IM in the Alibre forums and he was very communicative...
That is until I made an offer for him to come here to THIS very thread and 'splain hisself.........He declined.  |
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  salzan Experienced Optimist Premium join:2004-01-08 WA State
| I guess I forgot /sarcasm. 
I also had links to BBR in some of my posts at Alibre but they were all deleted...
Maybe Greg just got the dates mixed up? /sarcasm
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 OmniUni
join:2005-08-03
| reply to rocke86 Nothing to Hide
I do very little on Windows.
Anything I am worried about is on Linux, including email which is on Google's Linux servers. And if micro$oft's own validation program thinks my copy of Win2k is legit, than how will Alibre tell? I reformat every few months, so there is little personal information to find as 90% is faked anyway.
Dadkins: what open source CAD is equivalent to Alibre Design express? If you can find one, I will switch in an instant- no matter how many dependencies I must solve! (though I must admit, I'm still new to compiling) personally, I found a number of promising projects, but nothing quite ready yet.
Rahlquist: Thank you, I revise my statement. I do not mind ads as long as they are non-intrusive and I see them knowingly. Therefore, I do not mind the ads in Alibre Design Express. The software may, however, be adware. I love wikipedia, don't you?  |
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