winky
Turn Left At The Moon
join:2001-02-11
Saint Louis, MO
| reply to broadbander
Re: Go MOM!
"Of course, the massive of mainstream rap is incredibly limited to predictable and tiny repetitive vocal patterns by artists unaware of what they are presenting. Mainstream rap culture's negative reinforcement of a stereotypically misogynistic and sadistic way of life far outweights its artistic value."
DAMN! That's one of the most intelligent comments I've heard on any subject in a long time. Although I do find some of the rythmic patterns in rap very interesting. There is someone somewhere behind the scenes on some of these pieces that obviously knows how to switch from 6/8 to 6/12 and back to 4/4 but I sincerely doubt many of the artists would recognize it on paper.
"To quote Illiam Sphere ...
The underground is where the value is found."
Unfortunately, it's not where the money is.
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Is that a real poncho, or is that a Sears poncho? |
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Desdinova
join:2003-01-26
Gaithersburg, MD
| reply to broadbander
I agree completely (though I confess I don't recognize most of th artists you mention...which is a reflection on me and not them *grin*). One of my favorite post-modern collage groups is Negativland. In their earlier work they demonstrated that ANY random collection of sounds becomes a song once familiarity with the tones becomes acquired and the "randmoness" becomes a predictable sequence. The same with Eno and his tape loops and other experiments.
I'd much rather be on the extreme edge or on the fringes; the Middle-Of-The-Road is where you get run over. |
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herby2day1
join:2005-03-08
Queensbury, NY
| reply to guitarzan
actually i'm a 20 year old white male from new york, i may live in the country of new york but more of a reason that myself listen to rap and liking it is strange, i grew up on country and classical music, and didn't hear my first "rap/hip-hop song" until i was 17, i don't know anyone my age that likes as wide of variety of music as I do. Do you know any 20 yr male that enjoys Mozart, and composers of the time? i sure as hell don't. As for a misunderstanding maybe I did however what gangstas run the RIAA |
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broadbander
join:2005-07-21
Brooklyn, NY
| reply to Desdinova
said by Desdinova  :I personally don't care for rap at all, but I definitely feel it's a form of singing. The chromatic range is much narrower (usually no broader than three or four semitones) than "normal" singing and it takes its tonal structure from the timing and rhythm as opposed to the melody or counter melody. If you remove the words from a rap and reduce the vocal track to a series of musical tones, it definitely follows a tonal pattern (albeit a very limited one). To my ears, none of this makes it any easier to listen to, though...*grin* The best of the underground avant-garde today is embedded in hip-hop. Sample-based music (as practiced by Vampire Rodents, Matmos and MC Tracheotomy), new sound-scape (as best exemplified by Dalek's post-industrial rap symphonies) and other forms of even bolder vocal experimentation (Cannibal Ox, some of Blackilicious' work, Rahzel's beat boxing). The turntablist has developed into a virtuosic position (DJ Faust and Kid606 come to mind). Whether a piece of art is pleasing to the ear, eye, or whatever is often irrelevant to the aim of the work. Rap is certainly music and some of the most alien and odd postmodern music yet.
Of course, the massive of mainstream rap is incredibly limited to predictable and tiny repetitive vocal patterns by artists unaware of what they are presenting. Mainstream rap culture's negative reinforcement of a stereotypically misogynistic and sadistic way of life far outweights its artistic value.
To quote Illiam Sphere ...
The underground is where the value is found. |
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Desdinova
join:2003-01-26
Gaithersburg, MD
| reply to guitarzan
I personally don't care for rap at all, but I definitely feel it's a form of singing. The chromatic range is much narrower (usually no broader than three or four semitones) than "normal" singing and it takes its tonal structure from the timing and rhythm as opposed to the melody or counter melody. If you remove the words from a rap and reduce the vocal track to a series of musical tones, it definitely follows a tonal pattern (albeit a very limited one). To my ears, none of this makes it any easier to listen to, though...*grin* |
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guitarzan
Premium
join:2004-05-04
Skytop, PA
 ·epix
| reply to herby2day1
said by herby2day1 : I listen to rap, just because you think rap is garbage doesn't mean you need to bash it. A lot of topics get bashed on this site,including the RIAA and the music they release.Why would rap be an exception.? I called it for what it is, hate filled pollution.The same can be said of marilyn manson.To my ears that's not music.It has no melody, no chorus,no soaring high or low vocals, no guitar riffs that sticks in ones head all day.
said by herby2day1 :If you weren't a 40 white man from east bumf*ck
My musical taste and distastes are my opinion based upon years of enjoying music.If you weren't a 15- 20 year old colored person from west or middle bumf*ckMy opinion has what to do with your liking rap.? You don't know me, my age or the color of my skin.
said by herby2day1 :you would understand that alot of that so called rap music is not just sang by "gangstas" but by alot of people and if you tried to even put something together to sound like a rap you would realize that its just as hard to put a rap together You misunderstood what i posted.While there are rappers calling themselves Gangsta rappers I have even seen "the best of gangsta rap" cd compilations for sale.The only gangstas I referred to in my post is the "gangstas" in charge of the RIAA.Name me one rap song in which there is actually singing.All it is just talking and rhyhming, hence the label "rap" Lyrics such as, say yeah, get yer hands in the air, yo yo yo who's in the house, are not hard to pen. said by herby2day1 :And the so called Gangstas as you put it listen to alot of other music, Re read to see who i actually called gangstas. said by herby2day1 :What was it the 50's that Elvis was really popular and everyone wanted him banned because he was Inappropriate. I guess it was the way Elvis the pelvis moved his hips while singing and from what i understand tv cameras would not show his waistline while performing.Check out the rap of DMX »www.getlyrics.com/artists.php/D
His(DMX) rap is of a wanna be gangsta with very foul language.
Elvis Presley sang a lot of music including Gospel music.Elvis was a class act compared to the offensive language of rappers.
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Bass....the glue of rhythm and harmony...the heartbeat of the band.! Shaking the earth with deep,sonorous vibrations.The dark ominous thunder of an approching storm. |
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bent
not broken
Premium
join:2004-10-04
Loveland, CO
clubs: | reply to Music Guy
Bah. SST gots 'em all beat. |
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pahuser
| reply to herby2day1
Ya ya ya, you forget to mention incremental acceptance of increasingly immoral behavior, and the additional justifications for the tolerance of violent behavior. Rap is ok???, because the others introduced, and carried through with a "lavish" dance move, which translated to sex and drugs, then rap, which in many videos shows nearly nude dancing, coupled with rape, killing, cheating, stealing, sex, drugs, etc. Rap is merely the icing on the music industries layer cake of musical trash (no, not all music - just the bad stuff we are referring to). Kinda sounds like country music don't it Jed.
All these songs suck. Just so happens that rap combines all levels of wrong doing in many of its songs. Plus it just sounds like crap anyway. |
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SRFireside
join:2001-01-19
Houston, TX | reply to herby2day1
Well said. However I still don't like 50 Cent.  |
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herby2day1
join:2005-03-08
Queensbury, NY
| reply to guitarzan
This is the type of post that really burst my bubble. I listen to rap, i listen to rock, i listen to country, I've been known to listen to Frank Sinatra, big band music, just because you think rap is garbage doesn't mean you need to bash it. If you weren't a 40 white man from east bumf*ck you would understand that alot of that so called rap music is not just sang by "gangstas" but by alot of people and if you tried to even put something together to sound like a rap you would realize that its just as hard to put a rap together then a big band song or a country tune. And the so called Gangstas as you put it listen to alot of other music, such as country and the oldies cause it helps them better their form of music. Get your heads outta your a$$ and realize that what you say about rap is what parents of kids in the 60's and 70's were saying about Rock, and what parents in the 30's and 40's were saying about the the music of the time. What was it the 50's that Elvis was really popular and everyone wanted him banned because he was Inappropriate. Now hes a national icon. |
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lazarus_
join:2002-08-31
Resolute, NU
| reply to Ga Dawg
said by Ga Dawg :Since when did people go to jail in civil cases? I dunno, maybe they will get slapped with a huge bill of $300k per song, and when they default on the payments long enough they will get placed in jail? How should I know..
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Once you watch it, you can't un-watch it! |
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spamdumpster
join:2005-08-28
San Jose, CA | reply to wirelesswoes
I support these women too. What the RIAA has been doing is nothing short of intimidation and it's wrong. Oh, and wirelesswoes, your baggage is showing honey. Thought that you should know that not every little thing proves that all men are evil. |
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Music Guy
@adelphia.net | reply to broadbander
Nice List.
But don't forget Lookout! and Epitaph. |
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Ga Dawg
join:2003-09-11
Marietta, GA | reply to lazarus_
Since when did people go to jail in civil cases? |
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broadbander
join:2005-07-21
Brooklyn, NY
| reply to SRFireside
said by SRFireside :Not true. There are plenty of genres of music out there. Even in the Top 40 circles Hip Hop (or Rap if you prefer) is not the only genre available. However with the record labels having a tight grip on radio and music video stations you only see a very limited amount of what's out there. Namely the acts that get the labels the most money. Fear not everybody. Just look beyond the mainstream and you will find music is still going strong and beautiful. That's what makes P2P so wonderful. You can find so much good stuff out there if you're willing to look. Right on Fireside!
Some labels that I have found release consistently good and fun to listen to music ...
Arts & Crafts (indie)
Dischord (punk and post-punk)
Barsuk (indie pop)
Kill Rock Stars (indie rock)
Matador (everything)
DFA (for dancier stuff-except Black Dice, no no, stay away from Black Dice)
K records (indie, folk)
Def Jux (for hip hop)
Sub Pop (everything)
There's so many more, but these are just my personal faves. If any one else has suggestions, feel free to share! |
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BonezX
Basement Dweller
Premium
join:2004-04-13
Canada
| reply to wirelesswoes
said by wirelesswoes :It seems women have more balls then men. Stick it to the RIAA MOM! it has more to do with, their mothers and not university students. |
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SRFireside
join:2001-01-19
Houston, TX
| reply to DaveNJ
Not true. There are plenty of genres of music out there. Even in the Top 40 circles Hip Hop (or Rap if you prefer) is not the only genre available. However with the record labels having a tight grip on radio and music video stations you only see a very limited amount of what's out there. Namely the acts that get the labels the most money.
Fear not everybody. Just look beyond the mainstream and you will find music is still going strong and beautiful. That's what makes P2P so wonderful. You can find so much good stuff out there if you're willing to look. |
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DaveNJ
No Fear
join:1999-09-01
New Jersey
 ·Comcast
·Patriot Media
| reply to broadbander
said by broadbander :said by Cyron :Were you growing up in the 30's and 40's? Ever since Rock hit mainstream, they're have been songs kids shouldn't listen to. There were probably more songs about drugs and sex in the late 60's and 70's than there are today. Please see ... nearly all rap music. Broadbander is right, nearly all music today is a SINGLE genre, at least in the 60-80s we had many types of music. MTV,mtv2, mtv9832 is all the same music. This morning i turned on mtv(by mistake), and turned to mtv pop, i couldnt tell the difference between the 2 videos. Its like the same video played all day long.
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Feed your Faith, not your doubts |
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lazarus_
join:2002-08-31
Resolute, NU
| reply to wirelesswoes
said by wirelesswoes :It seems women have more balls then men. Stick it to the RIAA MOM! Watch them lose, go to jail and have their kids put in a foster home. haha.
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Once you watch it, you can't un-watch it! |
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TheMadSwede
Premium
join:2001-01-30
Holland, MI
·Charter Pipeline
| reply to kpatz
said by kpatz :When I was growing up, there were never parental advisory stickers on music... there was no need for them! How old are you?!
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