TamaraB
Question The Current Paradigm
Premium
join:2000-11-08
Brooklyn NYC
 ·Verizon Online DSL
| reply to six9
Re: Why change it?
said by six9  : Back then IPs were static too. Gawd, for the old days. LOL!
Yeah! I still use my Lynx, elm, and my NN as much as I can. It's getting more difficult. But NOTHING beats a good text-based client for speed and cleanliness! Them days are all but gone though 
Bob
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Motor Vessel - Tamara B.
43' Long-Range Trawler
Cape Elizebeth ME.
See her Here. |
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six9
join:2001-12-03
Atlanta, GA
 ·Comcast
| reply to TamaraB
said by user=TamaraB :
The manufacturer's disregard for safety, and the manufacturer's deceptive marketing and advertising practices.
Alas... There you go. I hear ya man! But you can't possibly be talking about Dell, HP, Lenovo, etc.
From how I read that, blame M$ for only allowing either admin or user for XP Home. (Yes, i know you can do it but it is a PITA to set up accounts that are more than user and less than admin) Face it, Joe Blow buying a Dell isn't going to drop an extra $119 on XP Pro so he can run limited users. That's what we do. And even if we pass on Pro at ordering, we use VLK copies so we don't deal with activation.
I cringed at what one of my users told me today. She said "a friend of mine downloaded Office XP for me off Limewire" and all I could think of was "what kind of viruses and spyware you must have."
I still feel ISPs have a hand in this. When they run the CD on machines, set up a proxy that blocks CWS, gator, etc. WE know how to get rid of it but grandma doesn't need to. Back in the days of @Home their CD set up proxies. That rocked if your IP was banned from a site. Back then IPs were static too. Gawd, for the old days. LOL! |
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sweintz
Premium
join:2002-03-01
Hamden, CT
| reply to Omega
said by Omega :When someone steals your car, and uses it for additional illegal activities, are you punished for it? Depending on circumstances, sometimes the answer to that is YES. If negligence on the part of the car owner can be proven (ie: he left it unlocked in a high crime neighborhood) the owner can be held liable in civil court.
putting a PC on the internet without understanding the security risks (AV needed, firewall needed, etc) is negligent, IMO.
at the very least, qwest should be suspending the accounts of infected users until they clean them up. $5 a spam is a bit much for something unintentional. But they SHOULD suspend on first offense, terminate on second offense for infected PC's. |
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TamaraB
Question The Current Paradigm
Premium
join:2000-11-08
Brooklyn NYC
·Verizon Online DSL
| reply to six9
said by six9 :How about a better crime analogy:
There is much blame for the spam, phish, compromised-PC, identity-theft, credit-card theft pandemic to go around. Much of it has to do with reckless disregard by the user. But a lot of it has to do with the manufacturer. The manufacturer's disregard for safety, and the manufacturer's deceptive marketing and advertising practices.
If a car manufacturer produced a car which was easily broken into, whose locks were defective, which required almost daily "fixes" to keep intruders and car thieves out, and then advertised it as the most secure, and easily-driven, and maintained car on the market, then he should shoulder some of the blame, and a lot of the responsibility and cost. It is hard to blame every user for this pandemic, when the product itself is so defective, and requires almost daily fixes to maintain, even for the most conscientious owner.
What I find so amazing, is the total lack of responsibility ascribed to the manufacturer, even from those who have been injured by the defects due to no fault of their own. Where is the public outcry?
Why do you suppose that is? If this were a car, things would be very different; fines would be levied, the manufacturer would have to pay at least a portion of the damage.
Bob
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Motor Vessel - Tamara B.
43' Long-Range Trawler
Cape Elizebeth ME.
See her Here. |
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drkkgt
Boo
Premium
join:2003-08-26
Whittier, CA
| reply to six9
Since they seem to think they can find the offender to charge $5 (unlike a previous article where ISPs said it would be too much trouble,) and they agree that they offender may not be aware they are infected, wouldn't it make more sense to send a note with their bill saying the users have a certain time period to fix their machine and provide some basic info on how to do it (like links to the major AV vendors, spamhaus, spybot, site etc. or referring them to a repair facility.)
Set the time limit and go back and check, if they aren't fixed, start charging extra or block them.
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"A computer lets you make more mistakes faster than any invention in human history - with the possible exceptions of handguns and tequila."-Mitch Ratliffe |
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six9
join:2001-12-03
Atlanta, GA
·Comcast
| reply to TamaraB
How about a better crime analogy:
You take a buddy to work and he leaves a bag of weed under the seat.
You go home and get caught speeding or run through a stop sign.
You get arrested for the weed. Case in point, Michael Irvin recently. It doesn't matter that it's not yours, it is in your possession.
I think the same thing can go for viruses, zombies, anything else. You ride with questionable individuals (unpatched PC on a high speed connection) and you get the consequences. |
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TamaraB
Question The Current Paradigm
Premium
join:2000-11-08
Brooklyn NYC
·Verizon Online DSL
| reply to Omega
said by Omega :When someone steals your car, and uses it for additional illegal activities, are you punished for it? You certainly can be if the theft, and injury due to the theft was due to your "recklessness, disregard for safety."
It's on the books in every state, and people have been charged, tried, convicted, and imprisoned for it.
"Recklessness, disregard for safety." is a crime when it causes harm to others, as it should be!
Bob
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Motor Vessel - Tamara B.
43' Long-Range Trawler
Cape Elizebeth ME.
See her Here. |
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n2jtx
join:2001-01-13
Glen Head, NY
·Optimum Online
| reply to Omega
said by Omega :When someone steals your car, and uses it for additional illegal activities, are you punished for it? Maybe. If you leave your car parked on the street in a rough area with the doors unlocked and the keys in the ignition and someone steals the car and commits a crime, you might face some charge as you did not take the most basic steps to prevent the theft of your vehicle. At the very least your insurance may not be willing to pay if they find out you did nothing to secure the vehicle.
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I support the right to keep and arm bears. |
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Omega
Displaced Ohioan
Premium
join:2002-07-30
Cheyenne, WY
clubs: 
·Bresnan Online
 ·Verizon Wireless B..
·Comcast
·AT&T Midwest
| reply to six9
When someone steals your car, and uses it for additional illegal activities, are you punished for it?
Just cause people have no idea how to secure a PC properly does not mean they should be fined for it.
The proper way to do it would be to Notify them, shut off internet access, and tell them they won't have internet until their PC is clean.
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My site
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six9
join:2001-12-03
Atlanta, GA
·Comcast
| For God's sake...they should have left it that way. This is just like when someone says something politically incorrect, the next day they apologize, no matter how truthful they were being.
I say fine the hell out of the zombies until they get their machines fixed. For someone to be on high speed and not running AV and fully patched is just STUPID! Even my old parents on dial up run AV and automatic updates. How hard is that? Granted, that doesn't stop malware, but it would help with the viruses causing spam.
ISPs need to start taking a hard line on this matter. If they see an IP spamming, shut 'er down. Shut down port 25 unless they are asked to open it. The amount of spam I see trying to come into my office from residential boxes is friggin ridiculous. I would venture to say that just about all the spam that attempts to get by the 'Cuda are residential in nature. Some hours, there are 1500 email attempts and all are from residential addresses, rr.com, comcast.net, adsl.bellsouth.net, etc. When are the ISPs going to do something? How hard would it be for them to block 25 outgoing on their DHCP range? Of course we all know that might not work for long, the zombies would just change port.
And what good is it to have a penalty of 5 bucks per spam if they exclude zombies? Who are they ever going to hit with that? Does anyone spam the old fashioned way nowadays? |
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