bbrookfield
Premium
join:2003-09-24
Indian Rocks Beach, FL
| reply to bbrookfield
Re: [ViaTalk] Partial fix for DTMF issue
Well, not so good as I thought. The Auto setting for DTMF is better then before, but not as good as INBAND. My bank and Credit card did not get the numbers right all the time (About 60% I would Guess). I have reset back to INBAND and will only change it when I need to call for Voice Mail. On a positive note, My wife and I do believe that the call Sound quality is a wee-bit better then before the Firmware upgrade. Funny thing is that in Auto, I get the tone when I press down a digit and get it again when I release the digit (Very short tone each time). In INBAND mode, the tone stays on as long as I hold the button down. Anyone have any tech explanations on what the difference between INBAND and AUTO mode is. INBAND seems more like a typical POTS phone, at least that is how it sounds when I call my Cell and listen as I press different numbers. |
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poolek
join:2003-11-04
Austin, TX
 ·RoadRunner Cable
 ·AT&T U-Verse
 ·ViaTalk
 ·AT&T Yahoo
| I'm not an expert on this stuff, so what I say may be wrong - but this is what I understand from reading stuff...
When you press a button on the phone, it generates the DTMF tone that is sent to the PAP2.
If you have INBAND, nothing is done. The PAP2 passes the DTMF tone through the codec just like any other sound. This tends to work ok with high quality codecs. With codecs that use more compression, the DTMF sound ends up being too distorted to work.
If you have one of the out-of-band options set, the PAP2 recognizes the DTMF tone and sends a signal outside of the codec that indicates which button was pressed. Somewhere on the VOIP server side, the system gets this code then regenerates the DTMF code. This prevents the compression from the codec from messing up the DTMF sound. Somewhere in there, the DTMF sound that's generated by the phone itself is supposed to be muted. I don't know if that occurs at the adaptor or server-side. Where ever it occurs, that's where VT's implementation fails. The first DTMF tone you hear is from your phone handset. The second is the regeneration from VT's server.
I would -guess- that VT VM system isn't 'listening' for DTMF codes, instead it's looking for the out-of-band signals. That's why it doesn't work when you set the adaptor to 'INBAND'. Every other IVR out there would just listen for the tones since they wouldn't have access to the out of band stuff. So, INBAND works with everything else because it doesn't introduce duplication due to the lack of muting, and the codec VT uses is high enough quality to accurately replicate the tone.
Theoretically, you could access VT voicemail with INBAND if you're calling in from any VOIP other provider because VT's voicemail interface to the 'outside' world would be listening for DTMF, not looking for the out of band stuff. It just doesn't work when you're calling from your own VT line.
FWIW - I have the updated firmware and still have issues with DTMF. I firmly believe I'll continued to have issues until the muting issue is resolved (don't know if that's a VT issue or a PAP2 issue), or VT changes their VM to also listen for INBAND DTMF. |
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stevech1
join:2005-01-08
1 edit | reply to bbrookfield
said by bbrookfield  :...My bank and Credit card did not get the numbers right all the time (About 60% I would Guess). I have reset back to INBAND and will only change it when I need to call for Voice Mail. Let's see:
Bank's IVR: no workie
Credit Card Co. IVR: no workie
"... will only change it [to/from INBAND] when I need to call for Voice Mail"
Now that will be convenient for the family members!
Tolerance is a virtue! |
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VTBrendan
Viatalk
Premium,VIP
join:2005-06-27
Clifton Park, NY
| The proper setting for DTMF of your device, is auto. If you are having issues once set to this setting, give our tech support staff a call and have them work with you on this. If you continue to have issues, submit a ticket and ask to have it sent to the attention of iain whom will be able to troubleshoot any issues you are having.
-Brendan |
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ptrowski
Got Helix?
Premium
join:2005-03-14
Putnam, CT
clubs: | reply to stevech1
Bank of America's IVR doubles the DTMF tones, but GMAC works fine...interesting. |
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UPEngineer
Premium
join:2000-12-30
Chickasha, OK
| reply to VTBrendan
I submitted a trouble ticket on July 14th in regards to my dmtf tones on my line not working properly. They were working fine until that time so I don't know what changed. Anyways, I received the following reply shortly after submitting the ticket:
"We are working on this issue and expect a resolution soon.
Karen L Harvey
ViaTalk Support"
The issues still exists and I submitted another follow up ticket with what VTBrendan said to do.
Let's see if it can get resolved! |
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guppy_fish
Premium
join:2003-12-09
Lakeland, FL
·Verizon FIOS
| reply to VTBrendan
VTBrendan,
With all due respect, your DTMF is busted ... No if and or butts about it.
For us VT users, we stick with "inband" because that's what works with the untold millions of places we call. We have NO issues with using inband unless we use VT voice mail. It only works on without "Inband". Auto doesn't work with my clients Voice mail system and we have ten's of people who take the time to post about the double tones.
I have been a very positive supporter of VT, the service and your support have been great, but this issue hasn't made any progress, none, zip, nada ... The issue is not DTMF ( we all can use inband thankyou ), it is your inhouse voice mail needing anything but inband to work
I had assumed you knew it was still fubar'ed and were working inhouse to resolve.
If you still have doubts, or think I'm just a noisy or pushy VT user, use your own service, call a cell phone and listen for yourself on the double tones when Auto is selected.
For me, I just don't use your Voice Mail and have "in Band selected". When the day comes you have a perminate fix, I'll switch back to auto
I am sorry if this post is a bit rough. My intent was for you to understand it has NEVER worked and still doesn't. Most of us just give up. I for one have many other things to do than worry if all my features work.
Best Regards |
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bbrookfield
Premium
join:2003-09-24
Indian Rocks Beach, FL
| I am a certified ViaTalk supporter. The features and price IMHO are the best. My only complaint is that the story I (we) get from VT tech support is not always consistent. Some tech's say "It's a known issue and we are working on it" Some act as if they have not heard of the issue and spend a lot of time trying to solve it for the customer. It would seem to me that AUTO is Viatalks preferred DTMF Xmit method. But we as users are finding that INBAND is what works (Except VT Voicemail). VTBrendan, why can't you setup VT's Voicemail to accept INBAND? The Codec that is used by VT is about the best (At the cost of high bandwidth) quality Codec and this is shown to be true by the use of INBAND as the method we the customers have found to work. What we need here is a quick poll. If you use the AUTO mode and it works, Please let us know. Maybe the problem is restricted to just a few users. IF so, then I am willing to be patient. If not, then lets get working on a fix and make sure all VT's tech support staff are on the same page.
Bill B |
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poolek
join:2003-11-04
Austin, TX
·RoadRunner Cable
·AT&T U-Verse
·ViaTalk
·AT&T Yahoo
| reply to VTBrendan
I submitted a ticket over a week ago (IBU-59585) and haven't received any response yet. With the work-around I found for VM access though, I can leave my adaptor set to 'INBAND' and access all IVRs just fine.
This would be easier if VT Voicemail recognized inband DTMF without having to use a workaround. Either that, or figure out why the duplication is occuring and fix the root cause.
Like guppy_fish said, it's easy to replicate - just set the adaptor to 'auto' and call your cell phone and listen to the tones. The are obviously being duplicated. Or just call the number I listed as an example in my Ticket and listen to it read back the duplicate codes.
This duplication has gotten much more consistent since the system was adjusted a week or two ago. Inband solves the problem for every system I've tried with the single exception of VT VM. |
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