JimF
join:2003-06-15
Allentown, PA
| reply to alanisrox69
Re: New Channels in LV?
Actually, that is good to know. At least they have preserved the master in a high-quality format. They can then compress it as they wish. The U.S. can offer more channels if it wants, and the Europeans can have higher quality. Maybe we can have some of both. |
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alanisrox69
join:2005-03-29
LHV, PA
 ·RCN CABLE
| reply to wbertram
Nah, they are doing their own fresh encodes from master material, not taking a mpeg-2 encode from another channel and re-encoding it.
More than likely they are getting a master HD format, something on a D1 tape or higher (not sure how HD content can be delivered) and then converting it from that "master" format straight to h.264. The h264 channels are even pre-encoding the material using multiple passes. HBO used to do in house transfers from film, but they don't anymore. Now, in the US the master gets played and is encoded in real-time to mpeg-2, this is what causes macroblocking and such (also the lower bitrate of US HD channels contributes to blocking). If you take a look at some of the h.264 samples on the net, you'll see macroblocking is reduced substantially (if it's there at all) versus a US mpeg-2 capture.
-Derek-
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CHECK YOUR FSLC TAXES!!! |
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JimF
join:2003-06-15
Allentown, PA
1 edit | reply to alanisrox69
said by alanisrox69  :right now h.264 streams in Europe are high bitrate. almost all of them are 17.57mbps with a 384kbps audio track. That is interesting to know. There must be a reason they are using such a high bitrate. It may be because it was originally encoded in MPEG2, and they need to oversample it that much to maintain the quality. If they started out with H.264 encoding, they should be able to get a reduction in bitrate of about 2.5 or so over MPEG2 at comparable quality. |
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Stavs
join:2006-03-14
Allentown, PA | reply to Bane_
Please no more Spanish channels! They could at least have the decency to have subtitles in English on these channels so we can understand whats going on.
I really want National Geographic HD. |
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Bane_
join:2003-03-03 | reply to wbertram
Hey RCN, how about a spanish HD channel? Anything? Please?  |
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ESPN
join:2003-02-22
Allentown, PA | reply to jcpudd
Those markets pay a higher monthly fee than PA. |
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jcpudd
join:2001-09-05
Bethlehem, PA
| reply to wbertram
How about we get the channels by default that the other markets get and don't have to pay for like Discovery HD Theatre, ESPN HDTV, HD Net, and HD Net Movies.
I think its ridiculous that we have to pay for those when all but the NY markets do not have to. |
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topcatvtech
join:2005-07-20
Chicago, IL | reply to wbertram
This follows an overall industry trend to eliminate analog premium channels. Don't know or want to speculate what that bandwith will be used for but it's always good to be proactive and free up bandwith and reserve it for future use. |
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alanisrox69
join:2005-03-29
LHV, PA
·RCN CABLE
| reply to wbertram
Not necessarily...
right now h.264 streams in Europe are high bitrate. almost all of them are 17.57mbps with a 384kbps audio track.
so in essence it's the same size that a mpeg-2 would be because it's the same bitrate.
-Derek-
--
CHECK YOUR FSLC TAXES!!! |
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jhlmsln
join:2005-05-01
Washington, DC
| reply to wbertram
If we can't get anymore HD channels until RCN
eliminates some old analog channels, we are
DOOMED. In no way RCN is going to get rid of
those money makers just to satisfy us HD customers.
Personally i think all of the changes RCN is making
is to strengthen their for sale pitch.
jhl |
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JimF
join:2003-06-15
Allentown, PA | reply to wbertram
Speaking of which, what about H.264? I hear that it is becoming the standard in Europe for HD over cable, and the satellites use it. It would pretty much solve the capacity problem. |
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alanisrox69
join:2005-03-29
LHV, PA
·RCN CABLE
1 edit | reply to wbertram
Well, re: Dish.
While they may have more HD channels, not all of them are True Full HD. Some of their channels like MonstersHD, HDNet, HDNet Movies, and StarzHD are all compressed to 1280x1080i/1440x1080i. All of the old VOOM channels are 1280x1080i as well, but since Dish is the only one that carries them, I guess that's the best you're gonna get anyways. StarzHD looks horrible on Dish. It's not compressed right and always has ghosting and other artifact problems. Blech!
Over the summer Dish started compressing HDNet. As you may or may now know, HDNet is dedicated in providing the highest quality HD transfers at the highest bitrate. They send all of their content out at 1920x1080i with a bitrate of ~18.5mbps. Dish compresses HDNet now to 1440x1080i and ~11mbps. And in doing so, the audio is almost always out of synch with the video, and re-compressing on the fly makes HD looks like crap.
So here's a case where more is not always better.
One thing I like about RCN is that on all of their HD channels (at least in my area), they send them out uncompressed and untouched as they are sent out OTA or C-Band (I believe they pull in the premiums via C-Band, but I could be wrong).
Service Electric in my area compresses certain channels bitrate wise, but not resolution wise (720p channels are 1280x720p, and 1080i channels are 1920x1080i). I assume because they have limited QAM capacity. Channels like ABC and HDNet have lower bitrates than they should. ABC averages 7mbps where it should be 13mbps and HDNet averages 14mbps where it should be 18,5mbps. CBS and NBC average 15mbps where they should be 17.57mbps (like what RCN provides). Luckily Service Electric doesn't compress the premiums, they only offer 3, but those are untouched.
The difference on Service Electric is not much, but if comparing an RCN capture versus a Service Electric capture of the same show side to side you can see the difference in artifacting.
As for Dish, they should just ditch some of the SD channels to open more bandwidth up for the HD ones so they can return them to Full resolution and full bitrate.
-Derek-
--
CHECK YOUR FSLC TAXES!!! |
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wbertram
join:2005-08-19
Allentown, PA
| reply to jmirabella
Hmmm, whatever happened to that old saying re something like "the customer is always right..."?
Customer: I would like more HD channels, like DISH offers.
RCN: Sorry, how about some additional channels in a language you don't understand.
Can't we have some of each?
I realize you don't choose the programming, but I assume you do have some access to those who do make these decisions, and pass on the customer concern about the lack of HD channels. |
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jmirabella
Joe Mirabella
Premium,VIP
join:2003-10-20
Lanham, MD
clubs:
1 edit | reply to wbertram
I dont think thats an option |
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wbertram
join:2005-08-19
Allentown, PA
| reply to jmirabella
said by jmirabella :or various other things that can go in those 5 RF channels.. Joe,
How about a subscriber vote on what the subscribers would like to see go in there?
RCN provide the options, the subscribers vote on which ones they prefer. |
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mjr
Premium
join:2003-09-18
Bethlehem, PA
| reply to wbertram
Like Cable Modem downstream bandwidth to support the people upgrading to 20MBPS service...
Though, I'd be hoping for more HD.. and/or digital simulcast... (read better pic quality, and probably more PVR storage space for SD content (the headend encodes more efficiently than the encoders in our STB's...) |
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jmirabella
Joe Mirabella
Premium,VIP
join:2003-10-20
Lanham, MD
clubs: | reply to wbertram
or various other things that can go in those 5 RF channels.. |
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wbertram
join:2005-08-19
Allentown, PA
| I noticed today that RCN has finally pulled the analog carriers from channels 14-18 (The old analog premium channels that they announced back in June that they were droppin).
This leaves 5 rf channels available for:
30 new digital channels, or
10 new HD channels, or
Some combination thereof, or
Additional foreign language channels. |
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