redshift
Premium
join:2004-03-23
Beverly Hills, CA
| reply to B
Re: Skype now $29.95 a YEAR unlimited calls
B,
In terms of setting up voip, sip softphones are not as easy to set up and run as skype. To configure sipphone prior to their gizmoproject days on xten was not easy. I used it to communicate with a few friends I have around the world, in the end they got frustrated and gave up and we ended up using skype.
I guess it just depends on the ability to people to work through the kinks in any technology, most people do not spend their time posting on voip forums, nor do they spend their time trying to solve any technical issues they may encounter. I have found that skype is very easy to set up and use for those not technically inclined. |
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HardCoder
join:2006-07-22
Raleigh, NC
 ·ViaTalk
| reply to Agrajag
My wife is away in FL now with the kids and we just got webcams to video chat. We just downloaded it, and I must say, Skype's not too shabby. I have found a problem though, as my email address has numbers in it and Skype does not like that when registering, so I used an alternative. Does anyone know a way around that? |
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spookypuff66
join:2003-11-10
Silverthorne, CO
| said by HardCoder  : I have found a problem though, as my email address has numbers in it and Skype does not like that when registering, so I used an alternative. Does anyone know a way around that? We have two accounts with numbers in the email addresses. No sweat. |
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christcorp
Premium
join:2001-05-21
Cheyenne, WY
 ·Bresnan Online
·VOIPo
| reply to Agrajag
Question for Zoverlord and Bermuda. You mentioned how not everyone has to worry about their network and bandwidth becoming a "Supernode" for the traffic to go through. BUT, as a regular user, are you saying that the actual calls the user makes, IS going to go through other people's networks as part of the path? In other words, instead of a normal SIP call going DIRECTLY from me, the user, to the gateway that puts it back onto the PSTN, or at the worst case scenerio, my call traffic goes DIRECTLY to my voip provider, and THEN directly to the gateway and PSTN; you're saying that a Skype call routes through OTHER people's network to get from me to the party I'm calling?
While I understand that the call is secure and all, I can't say that many people would find comfort in knowing that their calls are linked to other people's networks. Just a thought. If others aren't worried or concerned about their calls routing through other people's networks instead of DIRECTLY to the PSTN gateways, then that's cool for them I guess. Later... Mike... |
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ZOverLord
Premium
join:2003-10-20
Minneapolis, MN
| christcorp,
The Skype web site like most web sites has a help area, please feel free to check it out. Here is a link to information there on how Skype works:
»support.skype.com/index.php?_a=k···C%2Fa%3E
Here is a direct link to Help area.
»support.skype.com/
I am more than happy to help answer questions, but don't want to stop you from doing a little work yourself, first 
--
Black, Grey and White Hats Unite here -> »testing.OnlyTheRightAnswers.com |
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christcorp
Premium
join:2001-05-21
Cheyenne, WY
·Bresnan Online
·VOIPo
| I appreciate your response. I did review the Q/A section of skype prior to asking the question. Maybe I'm just unsure exactly of the procedure, and therefor misunderstanding the possible answer right in front of my face.
I guess the direct question I'm trying to answer is; Do the calls a person makes using Skype to a PSTN phone, go directly from their internet connect to a PSTN gateway, or does it route through other people's connections? e.g. people acting as supernodes. From what I can understand of the P2P concept of Skype, it appears that the calls aren't a direct connection. Just trying to clarify. Thx... Mike... |
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ZOverLord
Premium
join:2003-10-20
Minneapolis, MN
1 edit | christcorp, my first link in my last post answers your question. It had a link here:
»www.skype.com/products/explained.html
Glad to help you with any more questions in the Skype forum, this thread really was/is not about the technical aspects of Skype:
»forum.skype.com/
--
Black, Grey and White Hats Unite here -> »testing.OnlyTheRightAnswers.com |
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christcorp
Premium
join:2001-05-21
Cheyenne, WY | Thanks... Mike..... |
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76766337
join:2004-09-26
Riverside, IL |  Yes please join us over on the Skype Forum. You meet many intelligent and interesting people from all over the world.
All of your questions will be answered.  |
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DogFace05
join:2005-12-09
Cary, NC
| reply to christcorp
Mike, the only time calls are routed via supernodes is in the very rare instances when both peers in a P2P (intra Skype) call are behind NAT routers that Skype is unable to punch a hole through and establish a direct connection between.
In the case of Skypeout PSTN calls, the supernodes serve no purpose whatsoever in routing calls--it wouldn't make any sence whatsoever--and are not used. The calls go straight to the media gateway, which may or may not be owned and operated by Skype--don't know the answer to that--and then on to the PSTN.
The supernodes (as far as routing voice) are nothing different from SIP's outbound proxy, except they are allocated dynamically from other users of the service (in a somewhat leachy, parasitic way, some may say) and not from Skype's own infrastructure, but functionally the same thing.
If you try to make a direct connection via SIP from behind a NAT router to another VoIP user behind NAT, without going through a proxy, you have to set up port forwarding and go through a s__t load of problems getting things to work, and after all the effort it will usually only work with that particular combination of routers and settings on both ends. Skype does it automatically and seamlessly, without any hassles, and it just plain works. |
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B
Premium,MVM
join:2000-10-28
4 edits | reply to Agrajag
Timely article at »arstechnica.com/reviews/hardware···ones.ars covering the current crop of phones. The reviewer seems to like a couple of 'em; but from scanning the review it sounds like all of these things are in exactly the kind of state of infancy I was afraid they would be. Not for me.
Often, I'd try to access my Skype phonebook while sitting right next to my computer and the Linksys USB base station. Rarely, but often enough to mention, the phone was unable to access my Skype account, which meant Skype couldn't be used at all. The CIT300 had some troubles syncing with my Skype buddy list, and would sometimes say the list was unavailable for a few seconds, even though moments earlier it worked fine. This occurred while I was sitting at my desk, as well as behind concrete walls. I wasn't able to pinpoint a specific reason for why this might have been happening. And that's a phone he likes.
With the introduction of the "Dual-Phone" family of Skype phones, it's now possible to have a cordless house phone that uses your standard telephone land-line and also connects wirelessly to a USB base station at your PC for Skype phone calls. One way of looking at this is that even Skype doesn't represent their service as a land line replacement, and thus offers these "dual phone" models - EXPECTING users to maintain a real phone line too -- rather than a straight POTS replacement as the other VoIP providers often position themselves.
May I add that I can't believe how long this thread has gone...
Edit: I finally went to check out Skype's offerings first hand, to see if they had local "SkypeIn" DID numbers -- and they won't tell me!
You need to sign in with your Skype Name to continue.... {and from the SkypeIn page:} We’re still beta testing SkypeIn, so purchase is only available after you sign in to your Account page.
No Emergency Calls
Skype is not a telephony replacement service and cannot be used for emergency dialing.
And at »https://secure.skype.com/store/skypein/start.html it's clearly called a "SkypeIn BETA".
In other words, all the Skype boosters in this thread are, to put it nicely, full of it. Skype is in no way comparable to the various SIP providers who sell POTS equivalent services complete with full analog phone support, straightforward local numbers for inbound and outbound, and E911 compliance. Go on and use Skype all you want, but it's not in the same league as the other more mature products. It's still a glorified chat client. Heck, it doesn't even appear you can port your existing number into Skype?
Some day I expect they'll eliminate the kludginess of separate SkypeIn, SkypeOut, and fat software clients and crazy hardware and make it truly competitive with the likes of Vonage. But it seems you folks on the Skype bandwagon might as well be touting AIM or Yahoo Messenger or something. Skype just has no relevance for a home user considering something seamless like cable VoIP or Vonage or Packet8 and the like as an inexpensive POTS replacement. (It would be a relative nightmare for Grandma to go from POTS to dealing with the nonsense that is Skype in its current form.) It's not the same product, and touting it as such has just wasted everyone's time. Come back in 5 years.
-- B
P.S. The Wengo folks have far more on the ball -- they just released a beta Flash version of their Wengo/OpenWengo SIP phone. Screw 19 MB downloads; just embed a Flash object on your web page and have people call you (I don't know the size). »slashdot.org/articles/06/12/16/2347200.shtml |
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GTFan
join:2004-12-03
4 edits | reply to ptrowski
I've read through this whole thread and I STILL cannot find a valid reason why the Skype protocol is not widely available on all of the common ATAs, thus allowing me to use my own phones with the service. They get their money from use of the service (like any provider), not the protocol. So why haven't they paid Linksys to include support for it on the PAP2? Linksys is selling Skype phones now, so this makes no sense to me.
I will not pay more money for special phones or to have a PC running 24x7 just so I can use Skype in and out. |
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B
Premium,MVM
join:2000-10-28
2 edits | Yeah, it didn't make sense to me either, as to why they don't already have an ATA-work-alike. redshift said earlier they get "revenue" from the softphone, but I thought it was ad-free so I didn't understand, unless they were selling demographics or spying or something. Then I found...
http://www.skype.com/download/adwarefree/
What is Adware?
Adware relates to software that has the primary commercial purpose of automatically delivering advertising messages to a user without informing the user and that is hard to turn off. Because you always have the ability to turn advertising messages off on the Skype software, we believe Skype is free of adware.
Well, actually adware is... software that displays ads, so apparently Skype's softphone is adware. I didn't realize. I thought they were trying to get as far as possible from their Kazaa spyware roots by shunning ads. (Clearly I haven't used Skype and by now have less incentive to do so than ever.  ) It does explain some of the bloat; those rotating ad spyware engines don't come lightly. Do the hardware phones display ads in the interface as well?
-- B
--
In a realm outside causality and function |
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76766337
join:2004-09-26
Riverside, IL
2 edits |  reply to B
I am sorry but I have to ask what planet you have been living on for the past 3 and a half years? Honestly your post is funny.
As you know, I am a SunRocket Rocketeer. I believe that SunRocket is currently the best value for old style legacy VOIP service, HOWEVER, ultimately I do not feel that ANY of the existing VOIP providers Vonage, SunRocket, Packet8, ViaTalk et al have any potential for long term longevity. They will all go belly up.
On the other hand Skype, if they play their cards right, has exquisite financial potential. It is not obvious and basically requires looking at it metaphorically as a diamond from many different facets. If I was Meg Whitman, would I have bought Skype? I don't know, maybe, maybe not. As I have mentioned previously, I have used Skype since the early beta almost 3.5 years ago. I have used it a lot and have followed every blip in it's life as I have found it a fascinating idea. I know that on the Internet according to the old New Yorker cartoon, "nobody really knows that you are a dog" however, I really am a retired investment banker.
Finance and Economics are my life and have been, really since childhood. It is simply my world view. I am very open minded and I attempt to apply a rational thought process to everything. Basically, I follow the scientific method, I form a hypothesis and then constantly try to tear it apart, challenge and disprove it. I have followed the same path in thinking about Skype over the past 3.5 years. At this point I sincerely believe that Skype is going to prove to be an extremely disruptive as well as profitable factor in the telephony market. I could however change my mind on a dime.
Believe me I am a very cynical and shrewd and I constantly challenge and rethink all of my assumptions and hypothesis's not just with regard to Skype but with regard to everything. I do not believe in absolutes or fundamentalism either in religion or in anything! Ptrowski will love that sentence
I am thinking of writing up a small simple paper regarding my economic and financial thoughts with regard to Skype. Maybe I will and then again maybe I won't. One of the first rules of a good businessman and especially someone who is involved in finance is to fire your ego. Thus, I keep a pretty compartmentalized mind when it comes to finance, and I refuse to argue with people on the internet regarding finance or economics, instead I like to sit back in the tall weeds, observe people and study human behavior. I also never ever give financial advice. (I do however love to play little characters on the Internet, I am a natural troll)
On the other hand since I do not have either a long or short position in eBay, I may write something up, just to watch people try to tear it apart.
Skype is really (at least for me)a fascinating economic model. Very elegant almost beautiful and I have not felt this way since the unveiling of the Black-Scholes model by Fisher Black and Myron Scholes back in the spring of 1973. (They later won the Nobel prize in Economics.) Here is a link if you are interested:
»en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black-Scholes
Now I must go back into character as bluebermuda
--
What the world needs is more geniuses with humility. There are so few of us left. Do not be be hectoring or arrogant. Those who disagree with you are not necessarily stupid or insane. Nobody needs to be described as silly;let your analysis prove it. |
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76766337
join:2004-09-26
Riverside, IL |  reply to B
There is no spyware or adware in Skype. |
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B
Premium,MVM
join:2000-10-28
| reply to 76766337
That's great, but what the heck are you talking about? I don't particularly care how amazingly well crafted Skype's business position is or about their future dominance. I care about what Skype does or does not offer me and other people. You're the former investor; I'm a consumer.
And to answer your question, I'm living here on earth where people still use, you know, TELEPHONES.
Which of my observations in my earlier posts above is inaccurate, anyway?
There is no spyware or adware in Skype. So you're saying that, despite their web site's statement and your own shock that I've managed to go three years without running Skype, they do NOT display ads in any of their products? Then would you please share with us (a) how they make money from the softphone other than as a come-on for add-on products and (b) why the heck they DON'T yet have an ATA workalike for residential analog copper?
-- B
--
In a realm outside causality and function |
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christcorp
Premium
join:2001-05-21
Cheyenne, WY
·Bresnan Online
·VOIPo
| reply to Agrajag
I think that the bottom line with Skype is that for all intent and purpose, it is still just another "Softphone". You can get a DID number for inbound calls, and you can dial any PSTN, Cell, overseas line, or other Skype user for between $55-$70 a year. Depending on what deal you sign up for.
If you don't want the "Softphone" version of Skype, then there will be an additional cost of between $160-$200 for a Wifi phone.
No matter which way you go, you get the advantage of a low price, (Relative), and decent reliability. You don't get many of the advantages of a traditional POTS line or SIP voip system. i.e. Adding fax, directv, additional jacks/phones, etc... to the system.
As a softphone, the price is similar to many other softphones. e.g. $60-$70 a years. One advantage is the unlimited minutes. For most people, unlimited is a catch phrase because most people don't use those types of minutes. And unless Skype is your only phone, then it's also unlikely to deal in the thousands of minutes for the average person.
So, all in all, Skype is yet another voip phone service. It does have the advantage of allowing you to have just an outgoing line for a very low cost. But, to accurately compare it to other voip services, potential customers need to compare the price, features, capabilities, etc... If it meets your needs, then it seems like a viable option. If it doesn't meet your needs, there are plenty of other providers. Later... Mike.... |
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redshift
Premium
join:2004-03-23
Beverly Hills, CA
| reply to B
Couple of things,
When I said revenue, I meant that their software is ad free, but it is how they bundle on their extra services that do make them money. They need the software to exist otherwise they loose the alternate forms of revenue that are all based on the software.
Also I'm not sure about the others on this forum but I 100% believe that skype is not a replacement for POTS, nor do I think that they market themselves as such. It is primarily a way for people to communicate p2p for free, as well as taking advantage of low priced long distance in a relatively non intimidating manner.
--
"So this is how liberty dies. With thunderous applause." |
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Maxo
Your tax dollars at work.
Premium,VIP
join:2002-11-04
Tallahassee, FL
clubs:
| said by redshift :Also I'm not sure about the others on this forum but I 100% believe that skype is not a replacement for POTS, nor do I think that they market themselves as such. When I signed up it specifically stated it was not meant to be used as a replacement for regular telephone service. |
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claudeo
join:2000-02-23
Redmond, WA | reply to Agrajag
Skype is definitely not a replacement for a "real" phone service. |
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