slashman
Don't do it . ..
Premium
join:2003-10-01
Batavia, IL
|  Problem with Automatic Update since Tuesday
So far I have been able to work around it by disabling Microsoft Automatic Updates and rebooting. Then everything is fine. I did AS and AV scan on the machines and they come up clean. Is this maybe a patch problem?
Today I had a client call with the same problem. Anyone else see this too? | |
|
 
La Luna
Surviving Ashraful
Premium
join:2001-07-12
Warwick, NY
clubs:
 ·Optimum Online
 ·Vonage
1 edit | Re: Problem with Automatic Update since Tuesday Does the CPU spike up to 100%? That is what's causing the problem. Although it seems like it, it probably isn't directly related to this weeks updates, people have been having this issue, or a similar variation of it, for months and months. Mine just started this week when I tried to get the updates. MS Updates froze, no task manager, no nothing. Only rebooting with the power button helped. Others have the problem when MS AU checks for updates, like you. MS is aware of the issue and has put out a hotfix or two with varying degrees of success, mostly no good. Read the links in my last post in this thread:
»[XP Pro] Windows Update Problem
I switched from MS Updates back to Windows Updates and then I was able to get updates with no problem. I will have to get Office Updates separately as they aren't covered in Windows Updates.
--
~~"As long as America is an infidel enemy, terrorizing it is a duty." Sayed Imam Abdul-Aziz el-Sheriff~~
| |
|
 |
slashman
Don't do it . ..
Premium
join:2003-10-01
Batavia, IL
| Re: Problem with Automatic Update since Tuesday Thanks for the info La Luna.
Maybe the issue was there all along and just coincided with this latest patch Tuesday downloads.
Interesting that I have 50+ PCs configured similiarly (MS Update with download only) and only 4 have had issues. | |
|
| | 
TheJoker
Premium,VIP,MVM
join:2001-04-26
Alexandria, VA
| Re: Problem with Automatic Update since Tuesday There's a reason I have automatic updates turned off. I do install them promptly, but not until I have imaged the system first. And not just for the updates, I won't do any install until I have imaged first. Twenty minutes to do the backup is nothing compared to "Oh my god, what do I do now?"
--
Proud ASAP member since 2005 | |
|
| | |
La Luna
Surviving Ashraful
Premium
join:2001-07-12
Warwick, NY
clubs:
·Optimum Online
·Vonage
| Re: Problem with Automatic Update since Tuesday said by TheJoker  :There's a reason I have automatic updates turned off...... That has nothing to do with it, I had updates set to notify only, which worked fine....I always check and choose updates before installing. Some people have the problem when AU is checking for updates, others have it, like me, when they are trying to get the updates. On or off, it can still happen.
The problem suddenly started this week when I tried to get my updates with MS Updates after notification, hadn't installed any of them yet. It hung at "checking for updates". I have never had a problem with it before, ever.
This has been an ongoing problem for other people for months and months, starting a different times, it has nothing to do with any specific update.
It is obviously some issue with MS Updates itself as switching to and updating with Windows Updates works fine.
--
~~"As long as America is an infidel enemy, terrorizing it is a duty." Sayed Imam Abdul-Aziz el-Sheriff~~
| |
|
| JackCam614
Premium
join:2000-08-24
New Hyde Park, NY
| said by La Luna :.... Read the links in my last post in this thread: » [XP Pro] Windows Update ProblemI switched from MS Updates back to Windows Updates and then I was able to get updates with no problem. I will have to get Office Updates separately as they aren't covered in Windows Updates. Thanks La Luna,
Followed your lead and grabbed 3 High Priority updates from WU, and then went to Office Updates and pulled 5 'Required Updates'.
Many Thanks for the Heads Up.
Jack | |
|
| |
La Luna
Surviving Ashraful
Premium
join:2001-07-12
Warwick, NY
clubs: | Re: Problem with Automatic Update since Tuesday You're welcome!  | |
|
| |
| |
La Luna
Surviving Ashraful
Premium
join:2001-07-12
Warwick, NY
clubs:
·Optimum Online
·Vonage
| Re: Problem with Automatic Update since Tuesday said by altermatt :said by La Luna :I switched from MS Updates back to Windows Updates and then I was able to get updates with no problem. I will have to get Office Updates separately as they aren't covered in Windows Updates. La Luna, I am one of those who have the LONG wait at MU while it's "checking for updates"; by long I mean LONG, enough to actually make lunch and eat half of it today  . I don't have AU running until just before I go to MU, but I do go to MU on schedule. I would LOVE to use WU and OU separately if that would speed up the process. However, when I tried going to WU (windowsupdate.microsoft.com) today, it checked my Active X and redirected me to MU...I couldn't get it to just use WU. Anyone have any suggestions for getting to WU without being redirected? Trying going to Start>Windows Update (I know, I know, sounds wrong, but it's not), then click on "change settings" on the left side of the page. It will bring you to a page to switch to Windows Updates instead of MS Updates.
Then try to update the normal way, Start>Windows Update.
--
~~"As long as America is an infidel enemy, terrorizing it is a duty." Sayed Imam Abdul-Aziz el-Sheriff~~
| |
|
| | | 
altermatt
Premium
join:2004-01-22
White Plains, NY
 ·Verizon Online DSL
| Re: Problem with Automatic Update since Tuesday said by La Luna :Trying going to Start>Windows Update (I know, I know, sounds wrong, but it's not), then click on "change settings" on the left side of the page. Thanks, I will try that tomorrow. Just to clarify with you, though, that link is to »update.microsoft.com/microsoftup···ln=en-us . (That may be what you meant by "I know it sounds wrong ).
--
The truth of a thing is the feel of it, not the think of it. -- Stanley Kubrick | |
|
| | | |
La Luna
Surviving Ashraful
Premium
join:2001-07-12
Warwick, NY
clubs:
·Optimum Online
·Vonage
| Re: Problem with Automatic Update since Tuesday said by altermatt :said by La Luna :Trying going to Start>Windows Update (I know, I know, sounds wrong, but it's not), then click on "change settings" on the left side of the page. Thanks, I will try that tomorrow. Just to clarify with you, though, that link is to » update.microsoft.com/microsoftup···ln=en-us . (That may be what you meant by "I know it sounds wrong ). Yep, Start says "Windows Updates", giving the impression that's where you're going when you are actually going to MS Updates.
--
~~"As long as America is an infidel enemy, terrorizing it is a duty." Sayed Imam Abdul-Aziz el-Sheriff~~
| |
|
|
|
slashman
Don't do it . ..
Premium
join:2003-10-01
Batavia, IL | Re: Problem with Automatic Update since Tuesday Had two more people call me this morning with the same problem. I wonder if one of the latest updates has brought this utilization problem to light? | |
|
| | |
lrmayer
join:2000-02-19
Arlington, VA
| I had problems on some slower machines (do not use Automatic Updates -- but a batch file to turn on services the go to Microsoft Updates and a "custom" check) -- would go off and hang and then 20 minutes to a half-hour later to an error page.
IMHO -- problem is the checking for Office Updates -- BECAUSE -- the solution which worked every time was to first just go to Office updates -- let it run and install -- very quickly. Then, second to Microsoft updates and scan and identification of the remaining updates took only a few minutes -- no hang as before. Worked every time on slower machines -- down to PII-400! | |
|
rdhw
join:2002-09-21
Cambridge UK
| For a fix to this problem, please do BOTH of the following:
1. For 32-bit systems, download and save to hard disk, and then install:
»download.windowsupdate.com/v7/wi···-x86.exe
2. (not for Vista) Download and install update KB927891:
»support.microsoft.com/kb/927891
If the first of these produces an error message about "Update agent already installed", then execute the installer again manually, with parameter /wuforce as in:
WindowsUpdateAgent30-x86.exe /wuforce
After the fixes have been installed, doing a Microsoft Update or Automatic Update might still take some time (though not as much as before) and processor and disk usage, but it should not lock out user-level interaction with the system and applications, so it should not be an inconvenience.
--
Robin Walker »homepage.ntlworld.com/robin.d.h.walker/ for broadband troubleshooting tips | |
|
|
La Luna
Surviving Ashraful
Premium
join:2001-07-12
Warwick, NY
clubs:
·Optimum Online
·Vonage
1 edit | Re: Problem with Automatic Update since Tuesdaysaid by rdhw :For a fix to this problem, please do BOTH of the following: 1. For 32-bit systems, download and save to hard disk, and then install: » download.windowsupdate.com/v7/wi···-x86.exe2. (not for Vista) Download and install update KB927891: » support.microsoft.com/kb/927891If the first of these produces an error message about "Update agent already installed", then execute the installer again manually, with parameter /wuforce as in: WindowsUpdateAgent30-x86.exe /wuforce After the fixes have been installed, doing a Microsoft Update or Automatic Update might still take some time (though not as much as before) and processor and disk usage, but it should not lock out user-level interaction with the system and applications, so it should not be an inconvenience. If that is what's posted about in these links (just two examples), good results for this "fix" have been spotty at best:
»blogs.technet.com/wsus/archive/2···-on.aspx
»episteme.arstechnica.com/eve/for···1831/p/7
--
~~"As long as America is an infidel enemy, terrorizing it is a duty." Sayed Imam Abdul-Aziz el-Sheriff~~
| |
|
| | |
| mikefxu
join:2004-10-05
Titusville, FL
| said by rdhw :For a fix to this problem, please do BOTH of the following: 1. For 32-bit systems, download and save to hard disk, and then install: » download.windowsupdate.com/v7/wi···-x86.exe2. (not for Vista) Download and install update KB927891: » support.microsoft.com/kb/927891If the first of these produces an error message about "Update agent already installed", then execute the installer again manually, with parameter /wuforce as in: WindowsUpdateAgent30-x86.exe /wuforce After the fixes have been installed, doing a Microsoft Update or Automatic Update might still take some time (though not as much as before) and processor and disk usage, but it should not lock out user-level interaction with the system and applications, so it should not be an inconvenience. If this works I love you long time! | |
|
| | |
| | | mikefxu
join:2004-10-05
Titusville, FL
| Re: Problem with Automatic Update since Tuesday said by La Luna :said by mikefxu :If this works I love you long time! Please let us know if that works for you, I've read reports that it did nothing. It worked immediately, 5 minutes after installing those two files, WU popped up and said 8 updates to install. No maxing out processor either. I have cpu monitor on task bar and randomly svchost.exe would max out and I would kill it for the past month or so. | |
|
| | | | |
| | | | | mikefxu
join:2004-10-05
Titusville, FL | Re: Problem with Automatic Update since Tuesday The worse that can happen is you are right where you started 2 minutes ago, hurry give it a try! | |
|
DSL_Steve
Premium
join:2003-11-28
Woodbury, CT
1 edit | I had the same problem with my wife's XP Home PC. I thought it was because I had just installed Windows Defender on her PC so I uninstalled it and rebooted. I *did* open the Task Maneger and noticed Windows update was overly active. Nice to know it has nothing to do with Defender. As an aside, my Vista PC didn't exhibit the problem. | |
|
Chillin
No i7, no care.
Premium
join:2002-04-22
Schwenksville, PA | I had this issue first of the week also. Stumbled on some other forums with similar answers. I think im back on track now.
UGH.
--
Graphic Disorder | |
|
|
|
La Luna
Surviving Ashraful
Premium
join:2001-07-12
Warwick, NY
clubs:
·Optimum Online
·Vonage
2 edits | Re: Problem with Automatic Update since Tuesday said by nixen :This happens to my laptop, periodically. One day, I'll go to unlock my PC and it's hot and frozen. I'll have to power it off and back on. A few seconds after logging in, it spikes to 100% and the damned windows update is leaking memory all over the place and eating CPU. I'll have to disable it. Eventually, I manually perform an update and Windows Update will stabilize again for a few months. Then the cycle will start all over. The latest round started yesterday. Sucktastic. Try what I posted above for altermatt . It worked for me (and others I came across in my mission to find out what's going on). Just remember you have to get Office updates separately. It's not a fix, but it's a workaround for now.
I haven't disabled AU notifications, they are still set to NOTIFY only. I got one this morning for Windows Defender, updated with no CPU/hanging problem.
--
~~"As long as America is an infidel enemy, terrorizing it is a duty." Sayed Imam Abdul-Aziz el-Sheriff~~
| |
|
Gooiool
May God bless you.
Premium
join:2006-11-27
Roland, OK
clubs:
| said by slashman :I am having a weird issue since this Tuesday. I have several pcs that will slow down and then not launch any programs within a couple of minutes of launch. Even task manager will not come up. So far I have been able to work around it by disabling Microsoft Automatic Updates and rebooting. Then everything is fine. I did AS and AV scan on the machines and they come up clean. Is this maybe a patch problem? Today I had a client call with the same problem. Anyone else see this too? Same here but only one pc out of 4 was effected ...
--
As always thank you Gooiool ©2005.Team Discovery
Please join us in the fight against cancer and juvenile diseases.Project Hope | |
|
OZO
Premium
join:2003-01-17
| The problem is due to a poor memory management used in program doing update. It happens when a badly written program/module calls memory allocation / deallocation functions extremely often (querying small portions of bytes multiple times instead of taking a bigger block and properly utilizing it). Do you need an example? Assume that that there is a badly written "strings" class where concatenation of two strings done by calling a realloc function for every byte added from the second to the first string. No one will do that except a novice programmer... And it looks like the case here.
If you watch what's going on with Process Explorer you can see that most of the time CPU is running "ntdll.dll!RtlAllocateHeap+0x18c" method, which is called from "ole32.dll!StringFromGUID2+0x627". It's part of "svchost.exe -k netsvcs" process.
Obviously the program was NOT thoroughly tested. At least I'm sure that developers do not know what profiler is for... To help to solve it quicker I've even made some basic recommendations for its developers (see this post).
Unfortunately there is nothing we can do about it just to wait until the problem will be finally fixed by m$. My experience shows that two previous attempts (916089 and 927891) were unsuccessful (see this post). Let's wait and hope that next fix will eventually help...
--
Keep it simple, it'll become complex by itself... | |
|
| |
| | OZO
Premium
join:2003-01-17
| Re: Problem with Automatic Update since Tuesday said by La Luna :The weird thing for me is that this just *suddenly* started happening. I've had this computer for a year and a half, always getting updates with no problem, until this week. Others report having the problem months ago. I wonder what triggers it, or what keeps it from ever triggering? There is a noticeable difference between computer running 90% of CPU and one that require 100%. In former case you will never see it (unless you desire to watch it on purpose). In latter case computer tries to do many other things to schedule the processes, change priorities and actually may ask for "avalanche" of extra tasks needed for processing. It may drop its "effectiveness" significantly. That's the time when user begin to see the problem. We have different computers, with different processing power, running in different environment. We have dofferent number of installed fixes (and programs) too. It may explain that some folks see it, and others may not yet. There is a lot of other reasons though.
--
Keep it simple, it'll become complex by itself... | |
|
| |
| | mikefxu
join:2004-10-05
Titusville, FL | Re: Problem with Automatic Update since Tuesday I have 2 W2K3 servers and I havent had any problems but they are updated via WSUS. | |
|
| rdhw
join:2002-09-21
Cambridge UK
| said by OZO :My experience shows that two previous attempts ( 916089 and 927891) were unsuccessful Please be aware that 927891 was silently updated to v3 on 7th May, containing v3.1.4000.4039 of msi.dll dated 18 April 2007. The KB article has not yet caught up. It is this version you should be trying in conjunction with the new UpdateAgent30.
--
Robin Walker »homepage.ntlworld.com/robin.d.h.walker/ for broadband troubleshooting tips | |
|
| | OZO
Premium
join:2003-01-17
| Re: Problem with Automatic Update since Tuesday said by rdhw :said by OZO :My experience shows that two previous attempts ( 916089 and 927891) were unsuccessful Please be aware that 927891 was silently updated to v3 on 7th May, containing v3.1.4000.4039 of msi.dll dated 18 April 2007. The KB article has not yet caught up. It is this version you should be trying in conjunction with the new UpdateAgent30. Thank you rdhw !
I'll reinstall it.
--
Keep it simple, it'll become complex by itself... | |
|
|
HA Nut
Premium
join:2004-05-13
USA | I'm starting to see this bug creep up more and more. I'm hoping the new updated files will help... | |
|
|
|
HA Nut
Premium
join:2004-05-13
USA
| Re: Problem with Automatic Update since Tuesday said by La Luna :Well, here goes nothing. I'm going for it. Why do I feel like I'm sky diving for the first time? Is this angst necessary for updating a computer?  Thank goodness for ShadowProtect, True Image, Ghost, Image for DOS or whatever one uses for backup images. Worth their weight in gold sometimes... | |
|
La Luna
Surviving Ashraful
Premium
join:2001-07-12
Warwick, NY
clubs: | One more quick question.....do I install KB927891 first or the other one? Just want to make sure I do it in the right order. | |
|
OZO
Premium
join:2003-01-17
| After installing new two packages and several reboots running "Custom" check took 3:30 min, wich is better than previous 17 min.
What I did:
1. Uninstall v2 of 927891, reboot.
2. Install v3 of 927891, reboot.
3. Install UpdateAgent v3.0, reboot.
4. Check and install latest updates, reboot.
It's better now. Thank you rdhw for the links and advice to re-install 927891 fix.
It may be the best that can be done for now, who knows. Real improvement may bring only a new SP3 package though. In this case we will not need to check / download / install more then hundred(!) latest updates (since SP2).
When it will finally come to us, bringing to the end this obvious absurd of downloading so many hotfixes separately?
--
Keep it simple, it'll become complex by itself... | |
|
|
See 7 replies to this post |
|
La Luna
Surviving Ashraful
Premium
join:2001-07-12
Warwick, NY
clubs: | YAY!! It seems to have worked!! Took about 2 1/2 minutes, but no freezes or anything. | |
|
|
HA Nut
Premium
join:2004-05-13
USA
| Re: Problem with Automatic Update since Tuesday said by La Luna :YAY!! It seems to have worked!! Took about 2 1/2 minutes, but no freezes or anything. Glad to hear it! Both you and OZO have given me the hope it will work on the PCs I need to fix. | |
|
|
|
HA Nut
Premium
join:2004-05-13
USA
1 edit | Re: Problem with Automatic Update since Tuesday said by gworkman7 :So now what to do? All KBs talk about 2003 Server and XP. I have 2000 Server and I have the issue. I utilized the switch from "Microsoft Update" to "Windows Update" and my server is now performing as expected. I called Microsoft and was told I needed to provide a credit card so they can charge me $245 to speak to somebody. So my options are no updates and eventually I'll get hit with some worm or updates and my server won't run. You'd think this company has enough money that they don't need to charge it's customers to fix issues they cause in the first place. I could understand being charged if this were my lack of ability to manage a server, but c'mon... No question that MS does not want to support it's older OS's. No profit in it. (The only thing they gain would be happy customers. ) But short of going to another completely different OS, most of us will have no choice but to upgrade. 
I'm a PC person and don't know much about servers. At this point in time, MS will still let PC owners get updates manually by using the TechNet site. »www.microsoft.com/technet/securi···may.mspx Is this an avenue you could take advantage of? | |
|
| |
| | |
yeti34
RC Onroad racin
join:2001-04-12
Salt Lake City, UT
| This really sucks and I wish I had seen this thread before I went out and got a new HD. I thought I just had a HD going out on me and figured I just needed to replace it. I can't return it for it is used since that is what I am runnning off of now. I will try to get this update and hopee it solves the issue. I have to reread to find out what I need, for I just skimmed over everything and thought I needed to post. I did not notice it on my other PC's for I have not had them on in awhile. I love this site for info but only wished I had seen it sooner. Live and learn I guess. | |
|
nu2this
NOT
Premium
join:2005-04-07
Hallandale, FL
| one way to fix this issue, since most people have to update to use Vista... take it a step further and update to a mac... then you don't have to worry about these issues...
and... you can also run windows on a mac...
--
Why are you so surprised to see sinners in church? Are you shocked to see sick people in a hospital too? | |
|
jstone00
join:2004-06-19
Fortuna, CA | I, too, was having the problem described in the first post in this thread. The fixes described in previous posts worked for me, and I've now successfully updated my machines. Thank you! | |
|
|
|
|
|
