mr man
join:2008-08-02
Denver, CO
| reply to neotorian
Re: Cost of Worker Replacement Must Be Decreasing
Be lucky for what you got. Craft folks make over $22 an hour and higher if you are a tech, plus overtime. Asking for union employees to pay part of your medical bennies is not asking much for the type of work/labor craft folks do.
Many other telcos and unionized employers cut out a lot of those bennies and Verizon will be setting a bad precedence if they give in to the union.
Verizon Wireless is non union and they are carrying the weight of the telco. Line loss means less revenue. Be happy you have a job, but be a little more realistic. Wireless employees are paid less an hour and have to pay for part of their bennies, yet they are securely employed. Outsourcing is a way for the company to count their land line lossess. And we know that is happening now. A strike will not stop that.
Expensive to replace? I think not. There are plenty of skilled contractors out there that can splice, test, answer phones, enter orders and install services that would love to have a stable job and pay into a decent health plan. What some may know in the field on a specific issue can be learned by anyone that puts their mind into it.
Unions act like blankets, all or nothing. This means they protect the very hard workers the same way they protect slackers. I used to be in a Verizon telco area and i can tell you that I have seen some techs out there just leeching, practicing to take on their new Walmart jobs while others should be promoted to mid or high management for their dedication to their hard earned money.
Sure, Mr Ivan and his cronies make an insane amount of money and I bet verizon is like a slew of other companies with slews of CEO's of this and that, making money and readying with their golden parachutes before they are made scapegoats; it is coporate greed at it's best. But, no one will intercede with that. So if the company revenues are down, what make you think that biting the hand that feeds you will cry uncle because of a strike vote? They can turn around and employ from the job pool, pay them less in return for a stable job as easy as 123. Read the news, it has happened before.
Be happy for what you have. Cut your spending and invest..even a pension is not enough 10 to 20 years from now.. |
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cwire
join:2007-06-07
Bedford, KY
 ·AT&T Southeast
1 edit | are those wireless employees climbing poles in snow storms? do they crawl underneath some of the nastiest houses that can be imagined to install jacks? no, the bulk of the wireless employees are desk jockeys. should they be paid the same as the guys who risk life and limb everyday to keep the network up? do you know who gets the call in the middle of the night when the t-lines are down that feed your precious cell towers? that would be me. i get up at 2am and drive to towns i've never been to, to repair the circuits that without, the towers would be useless. screw you, i will not settle for less because we are losing landline customers. there is a lot more to the union employees jobs than pots. we are the heart any of the baby bells. |
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S_engineer
join:2007-05-16
Chicago, IL
 ·Comcast
| reply to mr man
said by mr man  :Be happy for what you have. Cut your spending and invest..even a pension is not enough 10 to 20 years from now.. yeah thats it...invest. Buy shares in the same companies that are cutting US jobs by outsourcing and gutting the middle class by accepting non-union unskilled labor. Hope your grandchildren are happy working for Walmart!
"Weekends...brought to you by unions everywhere!" |
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Hellrazor
join:2002-02-02
Abyss
| said by S_engineer :said by mr man :Be happy for what you have. Cut your spending and invest..even a pension is not enough 10 to 20 years from now.. yeah thats it...invest. Buy shares in the same companies that are cutting US jobs by outsourcing and gutting the middle class by accepting non-union unskilled labor. Hope your grandchildren are happy working for Walmart! "Weekends...brought to you by unions everywhere!" You could buy stock in Verizon. If you guys think you are so good, the stock can only go up.
"Non-union unskilled labor" Now that is an amusing quote. So a union tech is automaticly better than a non-union tech? You clowns are so full of shit it isn't funny. I worked on both sides of the union fence. All a union does is protect screwoffs, screw everyone but the majority present for voting and brainwash people who can't think for themselves.
In case you haven't noticed the big union shops like the UAW are falling apart. The unions have priced themselves right out of business in the US. It isn't the big corp pushing companies overseas, it is the overpaid union workers who are bancrupting them. Notice the nice overpaid union autoworkers who halfed new hires wages? Now tell me who is selling out? |
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sparky57
join:2003-05-18
New Bedford, MA | reply to cwire
As a Verizon CO tech in New England,I couldn't have said it better. We are the Network! |
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SteveCon
IBEW 2222 Boston, MA
Premium
join:2004-09-02
Burlington, MA | reply to cwire
Dead on, Brother! |
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dennismurphy
Put me on hold? I'll put YOU on hold
Premium
join:2002-11-19
Parsippany, NJ
·Optimum Online
| reply to cwire
said by cwire :are those wireless employees climbing poles in snow storms? do they crawl underneath some of the nastiest houses that can be imagined to install jacks? no, the bulk of the wireless employees are desk jockeys. should they be paid the same as the guys who risk life and limb everyday to keep the network up? do you know who gets the call in the middle of the night when the t-lines are down that feed your precious cell towers? that would be me. i get up at 2am and drive to towns i've never been to, to repair the circuits that without, the towers would be useless. screw you, i will not settle for less because we are losing landline customers. there is a lot more to the union employees jobs than pots. we are the heart any of the baby bells. Amazing how this happens every 4 years ... you folks have absolutely NO CLUE about the wireless industry and how it works.
Guess what?
You're damned right Wireless has folks climbing towers. You're damned right they deal with customers day in and day out. You're damned right they get called in the middle of the night to keep things running.
You're not the only ones out there working your tails off. If landline is the 'heart' of the baby bells, then wireless is the brains of the operation. |
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SilentMan
join:2002-07-15
New York, NY
| reply to SteveCon
said by SteveCon :Dead on, Brother! Amazing to see people here defending a multibillion dollar company they have no stake in against the workers who keep the company going and making millions for its execs and top investors. You people defending corporations are just little joes with no class conscience who are always potential victims of these corporate vultures you like to defend, keep that in mind.
Workers Unite! |
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supergirl
join:2007-03-20
Pensacola, FL
 ·Cox VOIP
·Skype
·Cox HSI
·AT&T Southeast
·magicjack.com
| reply to Hellrazor
Unions are only 8.8% of all U.S. labor (not counting gov't union jobs--in other words, lazy gov't employees). That was twice that about 15 years ago.
Corruption in unions and unions effectively breaking companies, like GM, Ford, with their overpaid wages is why they are on their way out. GM and Ford's stupidity is 50% to blame but the other 50% rest on their unions. Only professional unions, have no idea why, are increasing. If unions, the CWA, think they will unionize WalMart, they are on crack or herion. They unionized other grocery stores and look at the results--WalMart crushes them. I really don't see how Winn Dixie stays afloat next to a WalMart here when prices are about 10% lower at WalMart. Well, 4 employees at Winn Dixie and maybe 30-40 at WalMart is why. And, no, Winn Dixie employees make minimum wage, which is less than WalMart ($10 an hour for most).
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Saving the world keeps me busy. However, I find Earth very primitive from my home planet of Krypton.
-Supergirl |
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SteveCon
IBEW 2222 Boston, MA
Premium
join:2004-09-02
Burlington, MA | reply to SilentMan
I think your reply was intended for someone other than me. |
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jwersan
R.I.P. Mom, Brian, Ziggy, and Max.
Premium
join:2004-12-20
Port Jefferson Station, NY
clubs:
·Optimum Online
| I find the posts by people who are against Unions quite interesting, and almost laughable to boot.
Without beating a dead horse here, too much, I have come to realise that most people who despise unions are either jealous or have worked in a retail/supermarket union, and think their experiences are indicative of all unions.
While not a perfect system, every worker in this country owes their job and the benefits/conditions to a Union worker and the union they are members of, for fighting for those benefits/rights.
Unions exist to fight for worker's rights and to protect their membership from management abuses.
Union or not, a bad worker will be terminated, average and above will continue to work, as it should be.
Workers have ZERO say in what happens at any company, so they can not be held accountable for mismanagement at the companies they work for.
Union labor is more highly trained and more efficient than their non-union counterparts, so the pay differential is negligible and in most cases a job can be cheaper with union workers.
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RIAA/MPAA... Bite me!!!!
In constant search for intelligent life on Earth! |
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seige101
join:2003-06-23
Palmer, MA
·Comcast Digital Vo..
·Comcast
·Verizon Online DSL
| said by jwersan :Union labor is more highly trained and more efficient than their non-union counterparts, so the pay differential is negligible and in most cases a job can be cheaper with union workers. I call bs right there. I am currently working in a large building, the previous electrical contractor in the building was union, I am non union. I am retro fitting line voltage HCAC controls, and the shoddy work the previous company did was a joke. There is no consistency, some blatant unsafe connections and then the units where they installed the controls but never made the final connections. |
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jwersan
R.I.P. Mom, Brian, Ziggy, and Max.
Premium
join:2004-12-20
Port Jefferson Station, NY
clubs:
·Optimum Online
| said by seige101 :said by jwersan :Union labor is more highly trained and more efficient than their non-union counterparts, so the pay differential is negligible and in most cases a job can be cheaper with union workers. I call bs right there. I am currently working in a large building, the previous electrical contractor in the building was union, I am non union. I am retro fitting line voltage HCAC controls, and the shoddy work the previous company did was a joke. There is no consistency, some blatant unsafe connections and then the units where they installed the controls but never made the final connections. Well I too have seen the opposite, BLATANT electrical code violations and numerous unsafe conditions by non-union electrical workers..
Even at the job I am at now, the electrical code violations would run pages, if the inspectors were to show up, and this is in a building that is historically non-union.
I have also been on union jobs where the "customer" orders us to do work a certain way, usually in violation of electrical codes, or we are out!
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RIAA/MPAA... Bite me!!!!
In constant search for intelligent life on Earth! |
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Shamayim
I already have a Messiah.
Premium
join:2002-09-23
| said by jwersan :said by seige101 :said by jwersan :Union labor is more highly trained and more efficient than their non-union counterparts, so the pay differential is negligible and in most cases a job can be cheaper with union workers. I call bs right there. I am currently working in a large building, the previous electrical contractor in the building was union, I am non union. I am retro fitting line voltage HCAC controls, and the shoddy work the previous company did was a joke. There is no consistency, some blatant unsafe connections and then the units where they installed the controls but never made the final connections. Well I too have seen the opposite, BLATANT electrical code violations and numerous unsafe conditions by non-union electrical workers.. Even at the job I am at now, the electrical code violations would run pages, if the inspectors were to show up, and this is in a building that is historically non-union. I have also been on union jobs where the "customer" orders us to do work a certain way, usually in violation of electrical codes, or we are out! Someone ought to start a blog... the whistleblower kind!
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Who is Jesus? and Why it matters (to YOU).
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seige101
join:2003-06-23
Palmer, MA
·Comcast Digital Vo..
·Comcast
·Verizon Online DSL
| reply to jwersan
said by jwersan :I have also been on union jobs where the "customer" orders us to do work a certain way, usually in violation of electrical codes, or we are out! If thats the case honestly you or your company should refuse to do that work, union shop or non union shop. |
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